Japan - too serious not to be a thread on the main forum.

[stephen sawall]

Asia
South Asia
Europe
Oceania
South-east Europe
Near and Middle East/South-west Asia
West and Central Europe
North Africa

All have lower murder rates .... I am not saying the US is one of the worst. It is in the middle ground. I just know there are many places that have less of these problems. You people are misunderstanding me. I want to live in area that that has about zero problems .... I am very aware that is not a lot of the world.

It also may be my view from my own life. I lived in Detroit during the race riots and saw some horrible things very young. Including a person killed with a knife at age seven. Where I live right now I know of 8 people that have been shot within 5 blocks in the last two years. 4 days before they picked up the Green River Killer ~ Gary Ridgway I sat and talked with him for two hour in a local bar. The only time I had ever seen him. .... and could tell several other stories about what I have been around .... I have been around violence and violent people plenty. I also have lived in areas in the US where crime was very low. So I know it is not that way every place here.

I just feel some places are better when it comes to these things ...


.... and I am part Soo .... our holocaust was not real pretty.

 

[stephen sawall]

Sorry I brought it up .... I like you people and should know better. I guess it was a knee jerk reaction to some of the post above. My post above does sound a bit heavy when I reread it.


Lets skip this crap and get back on subject .... my apology's to any one I offended. I really am not that hard .... peace ....

 

[ShredMojo]

Is it bad, my first thought was about the Japanese guitar companies? EVH is suppose to make a left handed wolfgang special this summer..from the Fender japan facility.

I am too American for my own good.

I also have, what might be the most retarded question.

What would happen to the reactors if we literally...nuked them.

maybe there'd be some sort of "crossing the streams" reaction.

 

[harddriver]

Harddriver ....

Since you have a better understanding of this than most of us ....

Is there any chance this could have a real effect for us on the west coast of the US.... what real dangers are there ?

I was a Boy Scouts .... I believe in being prepared. I rather be safe than sorry ....

..... and thank you ahead of time.

If it was a simple as just dropping off new generators at this point they would have already done that we are way past this working at Units 1, 2 and 3, I think alot of the essential piping of some or all of the safety systems they would normally use have been destroyed in either the subsequent explosions from using sea water and not the usual treated water that get circulated in the reactor or they were compromised during the earthquake. To sum it up the thermally hot fuel boiled off all the non-circulating water into a massive high pressure steam bubble in the reactor head, trying not to rupture the reactor vessel they were venting this high pressure radioactive steam early on. There is a safety system called RCIC(it does not need any outside power to run) that is supposed to catch this out of control high pressure steam that drives team turbines to run pumps that pump cooling water to the reactor vessel. Obvious that system has been compromised at all three units or it just ran out of water to pump is my guess if it is still intact and functioning.

They are dumping water from helicopter now just as Russia was dumping Boron into Chernyobl. We don't have a fissioning nuclear fire like Chernyobl but the fuel has to defintiely be melting to some degree by now without the proper cooling and being exposed.

Again I really hope I'm wrong about my theories as to what is going on, I imagine they are not telling everything to keep people from going into a full panic.

Stephen right now the worst thing is the fuel melting into a molten mass of uranium and melting its way throught the bottom of the reactor vessel and leaving the core where the boron rods are, the term China Syndrome is used at this point. Theoretically the mass could get dense enough to begin fissioning on it's own but it is unlikely, but possible. The molten fuel of Chernyobl mixed with sand that was packed around that reactor and became radioactive glass when it finally cooled, keeping it from moving further. There is a catch pit underneath the reactor and bedrock under the plants containment and foundation, if it gets that far hopefully it will cool enough to stop there. Aside from Chernyobl they haven't had fuel escape a commercial reactor vessel before so this is where theory and reality collide.

There may be some radioactive particulate fallout and contamination from this but probably not enough to worry about in the US, depends on how much gets into the air and wind speed and direction. It will be detecable though, China, the Far east and Hawaii may have more to concern themselves with any fallout. There is little chance of an atomic explosion as they only use 2-5 % enriched Uranium. Weapons grade Uranium is 85-100% enriched uranium. There was a plume of radioactive particlulate that made it's way around the wolrd on the Jetstream after Chernyobl in 1986 but wasn't much of a health concern for us. Japan proper will have the most to worry about especially with three reactors all suffering from the same problems. Hopefully these are the only ones having issues as there numerous nuclear plants on that side of Japan besides Fukushima.

I just seen some up close pics of the reactor building and they are destroyed, I never would have believed this kind of failure could occur. I'm sure many are in disbelief as I, I always touted to the public how safe they were with all the redundant backup safety systems that were available to safely shut a reactor down, but that confidence has been shattered for me.

 

[harddriver]

Thanks... Obviously being in the field you know your stuff... But I heard an announement that the Japanese Authorities have just stated that they almost have an
electrical line run to the reactors, and once implimented will restore cooling to the core..

This would indicate that the cooling systems are not ripped out, and are indeed functional, and only thing that failed were the Diezel Generator backup, and the Battery backup that were destroyed by the Tsunami...

Interesting... In the Generators case they were hardened, and not affected by the water... It was the Fuel Tanks that were washed away! Don't know how they would not think of protecting the fuel source also

Thanks,

Roid RAGE

I hope you are right about the generators working but my gut tells me we are way beyond that simple of a solution for Reactors 1,2 and 3. This may keep #4 from suffering the same fate. I am only going on a satellite image that supposedly showed Fukushima one or two days after the earthquake before explosions and there did not seem to be much flood water or building damage on the property to corroborate their story. I could be wrong. I hope the cooling systems are intact but thay have started using Helicopters dumping water feverishly into the reactor building seems like an act of desperation not a concise plan of restoring power to the safety systems. But again it's just my opinion and I hope I am wrong.

Yes, the Japanes Power companies after seeing a 30ft Tsunami in 2004 was possible should have taken precautions to retrofit their plants. Especially when you build nuclear plants in the Ring of Fire earthquake zone.

 

[stephen sawall]

harddrive ....

I have learned a lot in the last few days .... I was able to follow that easy. Thank you for the clarity and your time.
This whole thing is tragic by any measure. I hope you are wrong also.....

 

[harddriver]

Thanks Stephen, I am far from an expert and I certainly am no Nuclear Engineer but my father was a Senior Reactor Operator for 28 years at a Nuclear Plant here in Illinois and he knows a thing or two about nuclear reactors aside from my experience in the industry. I have been out of the industry now for over ten years but the basics I do know still apply.

I just seen on the news the US miltary has given TEPCO high pressure water cannons so hopefully they can deluge the reactors well enough to keep the fuel in the core with the boron control rods are inserted. They need to keep the constant deluge going for days/weeks and not give the fuel time to flash the water to steam. I'll keep my fingers crossed. 99% percent of the time all the redundant safety systems make a reactor fairly failsafe, this is the one percent biting us in the ass.

There will still be alot of cleanup and site contamination but if they can keep the fuel in the vessel this will be a treatable situation. These reactors will never see operation again that's for sure, and I'm sure the Japanese people are not happy about this either.

 

[skoora]

What does it say though about how safe a source of energy is if it only takes a 1 or 2% chance of cataclysmic failure to kill thousands and sicken/contaminate food and water sources for maybe thousands more. That sounds like 1 or 2% too fucking much as were seeing it be a very real threat right now. Maybe somewhat morbidly but it might be saving us a lot more devastation down the road with this happening now as we're trying to seriously look at energy sources away from fossil fuels. I never felt good about nuclear energy and this has confirmed it as a detrimental fact for me. My hopes and best thoughts go with the Japanese people.

If you can, donate to the Red Cross or any other charity that can supply relief.

 

[Shark Diver]

But name an African, Asian, Middle Eastern country that doesn't have high theft, murders and rapes.

China for one .... crime is very low there.

.... And I plan on retiring in Canada for my reasons stated above.

We are having different conversations. From info I have read China's government is very cruel to their people. So, theft, rape, murder doesn't necessarily refer to the citizens doing it as much as it is simply a problem.

I have thought the same about going to Canada, it's just so damn cold. I'm leaning towards Catalina, New Zealand or Australia.

 

[stephen sawall]

We are having different conversations. From info I have read China's government is very cruel to their people. So, theft, rape, murder doesn't necessarily refer to the citizens doing it as much as it is simply a problem.

I have thought the same about going to Canada, it's just so damn cold. I'm leaning towards Catalina, New Zealand or Australia.

I have family in Taiwan and am very familiar with what is going on in China ..... not some place I want to live. All three of those are on my list .... New Zealand is difficult to become a citizen and probably my favorite. My whole family is part gypsy or something .... none of us stay any place long.

I have been thinking about moving down your way or a little south.

 

[Shark Diver]

We are having different conversations. From info I have read China's government is very cruel to their people. So, theft, rape, murder doesn't necessarily refer to the citizens doing it as much as it is simply a problem.

I have thought the same about going to Canada, it's just so damn cold. I'm leaning towards Catalina, New Zealand or Australia.

I have family in Taiwan and am very familiar with what is going on in China ..... not some place I want to live. All three of those are on my list .... New Zealand is difficult to become a citizen and probably my favorite. My whole family is part gypsy or something .... none of us stay any place long.

I have been thinking about moving down your way or a little south.

I own land in San Felipe along the coast of Baja. Amazing. I highly recommend looking into that as well.

Again, prayers to Japan.

 

[Anonymous]

What does it say though about how safe a source of energy is if it only takes a 1 or 2% chance of cataclysmic failure to kill thousands and sicken/contaminate food and water sources for maybe thousands more. That sounds like 1 or 2% too fucking much as were seeing it be a very real threat right now. Maybe somewhat morbidly but it might be saving us a lot more devastation down the road with this happening now as we're trying to seriously look at energy sources away from fossil fuels. I never felt good about nuclear energy and this has confirmed it as a detrimental fact for me. My hopes and best thoughts go with the Japanese people.

If you can, donate to the Red Cross or any other charity that can supply relief.

You know who should donate to the red cross? The central bank that injected 2 cash amounts of about 200 BILLION DOLLARS back into the falling Japanese stock market (chump change to them)... it makes me sick that these tyrannical rulers (central banks) of the world stand by and watch people suffer, and all they can do right now is stop inflation from curbing in India... while protecting their best interest with their money tied into their stocks. Fuckin pathetic... and we the small people send money to help those in need out.

 

[glpg80]

anyone know of any links to send donations?

they are having a hard time rationing gas, food, water, and there are below freezing temperatures.

id like to help, im a part time worker full time student but i feel as though they need it more than i do.

 

[MisterBulbous]

I believe most local "mid-size" cities or states have a japan-american society. For example, in Kentucky we have JASK (Japan-American society of Kentucky). I donated there because it's local and I felt better about it. Aside from that you can hardly open up Yahoo, MSN, Google, etc., without seeing a link to a donation site like Red Cross.

 

[harddriver]

We are having different conversations. From info I have read China's government is very cruel to their people. So, theft, rape, murder doesn't necessarily refer to the citizens doing it as much as it is simply a problem.

I have thought the same about going to Canada, it's just so damn cold. I'm leaning towards Catalina, New Zealand or Australia.

I have family in Taiwan and am very familiar with what is going on in China ..... not some place I want to live. All three of those are on my list .... New Zealand is difficult to become a citizen and probably my favorite. My whole family is part gypsy or something .... none of us stay any place long.

I have been thinking about moving down your way or a little south.

I worked at Chin Shan Nuclear Plant outside of Tai Pei, Taiwan, Units 1 and 2 in 1989 for reactor recirculation piping replacement outages, that country is sure mountainous! It was monsoon season when I was there is was like Seattle, WA.

 

[boof]

people are buying up just about everything they can find now. including toilet paper...

 

[Code001]

I heard that there is a milk shortage, but the reason is apparently due to milk plants being damaged due to the quake. From what I'm seeing via am acquaintance around the Meguro area, the shelves are fairly well stocked. He did show a few signs with no toilet paper as your picture suggests.

 

[boof]

yeah milk was gone right off the bat from day 1.

 

[EXPcustom]

President authorized voluntary all non essential military personal evacuation of Japan.

 

[boof]

my company is taking a very different attitude than that of the skipper..


its more like gilligan