Kemper or real amp for shows??

[Deleted member 10619]

I got tired of lugging around heavy amps and changing tubes from time to time.

If anyone can tell you they "hear a difference", they are just lying to themselves (because they need to convince themselves there is magic mojo in their amps). There are many videos on this subject. It is already a FACT that Kemper sounds as good and convincing as any tube amp around. Don't let subjectivity blind your objectivity.

If you know how to dial it, and play around with the settings, you are golden.

The ONLY reason you would need tube amps is if you have the extra money and people to carry them around for you (which, again... means you have money). If you already have a huge ass studio (like Michael Wagner) with many amps, well OF COURSE KEEP THEM. But there is no reasonable reason on WHY to have a tube amp instead of a Kemper...

Remember, you are playing for your audience, not to impress a bunch of bedroom warriors in a guitar forum full of cork-sniffers and dentists.

 

[ProgFree]

I got tired of lugging around heavy amps and changing tubes from time to time.

If anyone can tell you they "hear a difference", they are just lying to themselves (because they need to convince themselves there is magic mojo in their amps). There are many videos on this subject. It is already a FACT that Kemper sounds as good and convincing as any tube amp around. Don't let subjectivity blind your objectivity.

If you know how to dial it, and play around with the settings, you are golden.

The ONLY reason you would need tube amps is if you have the extra money and people to carry them around for you (which, again... means you have money). If you already have a huge ass studio (like Michael Wagner) with many amps, well OF COURSE KEEP THEM. But there is no reasonable reason on WHY to have a tube amp instead of a Kemper...

Remember, you are playing for your audience, not to impress a bunch of bedroom warriors in a guitar forum full of cork-sniffers and dentists.

It is already a fact? Where? I can hear and "feel" a big difference and hate the eq thing on the kemper. I couldn't care less for what the others could hear, I prefer the feeling and tone of my tube amps.

As for the carrying around, some day you'll be playing the recorder on stage right? Even less to carry around than a kemper...

 

[Deleted member 10619]

I got tired of lugging around heavy amps and changing tubes from time to time.

If anyone can tell you they "hear a difference", they are just lying to themselves (because they need to convince themselves there is magic mojo in their amps). There are many videos on this subject. It is already a FACT that Kemper sounds as good and convincing as any tube amp around. Don't let subjectivity blind your objectivity.

If you know how to dial it, and play around with the settings, you are golden.

The ONLY reason you would need tube amps is if you have the extra money and people to carry them around for you (which, again... means you have money). If you already have a huge ass studio (like Michael Wagner) with many amps, well OF COURSE KEEP THEM. But there is no reasonable reason on WHY to have a tube amp instead of a Kemper...

Remember, you are playing for your audience, not to impress a bunch of bedroom warriors in a guitar forum full of cork-sniffers and dentists.

It is already a fact? Where? I can hear and "feel" a big difference and hate the eq thing on the kemper. I couldn't care less for what the others could hear, I prefer the feeling and tone of my tube amps.

As for the carrying around, some day you'll be playing the recorder on stage right? Even less to carry around than a kemper...

When we go into the "I feel this" and "I can hear this little quirk" territory, there is a fine line between personal experience and spewing disinformation.

So the other day I "felt" a weird presence when I got into a house. I couldn't put my finger on what it was exactly BUT IT FELT SPOOKY DUDE.



Have you heard about Double Blind experiments and how to get rid of bias? Yep, this is how we test things like the Kemper. You CAN'T tell what is "the real thing" with studio recording and live playing scenarios. I'm sorry to bring the news for you but technology just got to this point. (same reason there IS a heated discussion every time someone talks about the Kemper in forums)

You simply don't like the thing, fair enough. That's it. No need to dabble into subjective terms like "teh feelz" and blaming the EQ for not liking the thing.

And about the recorder thing on stage? Was that a joke? Because I really don't think it makes any sense given the context of the conversation here.

 

[ElMuchoDingo]

i have played tube amps w/d/w with multiple mics, tube amps with torpedo live, and a kemper in live cover band settings (using in ear monitors for it all/ presonus studio live out to akg in ear, with a y stereo cable to the receiver to 1964 ears) and quite frankly the kemper wins. When i bought the kemper i did it out of curiosity, but i was sure it would sound digital and fake. it didn't, no one in the band or crowd knew i didn't have an amp. bass player now does recording for a living and he is always amazed by how it sounds. i play a britt plexi, then switch to a slo, xtc , mesa 2c, and all he can say is how stupid it is that it can sound that good


for ease of use the kemper wins hands down, i have it in a rolling case. pop the covers, plug it in, run the cable to the remote, plug into the sound board= done. I learned a couple "sound" tricks, i use 1/4 in cables from the main outs to the sound board. I get a lot more headroom, don't ask me why but i don't have as much problems setting the gain, much more consistent. second 2 channels on the board and set to master mono and pan them slightly right and left. last eq the iem's, the studio live lets me do this ( items can be an issue with the "feel of playing"

I mentally had to get used to the idea of no "thump" pants flapping 4x12, once i did i'm happier playing my kemper vs an amp and 4x12. recording is so easy also.

it takes some time to find the right profiles, and you can tweak them, i change the definition, sag, and the cabs ( i use ir's a lot) and you can really refine your sound.

 

[LP Freak]

Sorry, been there and done it all and I'll gladly stick to carrying my heavy ass killer sounding tube amp around.

 

[JerEvil]

Sound guy is a HUGE part of the live equation. Can be awesome and like all modelers, can be terrible live. At least with an amp, you have SOMETHING pushing sound from the stage.

I loved mine but it was a PITA as I brought tube power amps and 2x12 guitar cabs. For something simple, I made it very complicated. Here are some clips of my Quick Rod profiles

Oh I remember this clip. This is what got me started on contemplating a Kemper.

Edit: How did you record this clip? Was it very elaborate? It's an awesome tone over the computer.

This was just captured with my iPhone.

 

[Smac77]

They're great if you can get over the feel. Most guys eventually end up going back to their tube amp for a reason.

can you elaborate on this a bit... What is the most noticable thing missing ?

 

[LP Freak]

They're great if you can get over the feel. Most guys eventually end up going back to their tube amp for a reason.

can you elaborate on this a bit... What is the most noticable thing missing ?

Like I said earlier, what you get out of the FOH isn't bad, it a issue with the feel. On a good tube amp you get that certain sag where you can really dig in. I didn't feel it with the Kemper. It just felt very sterile. And yes, I played through my powered Kemper, tube power amp with a 4x12, powered FFR. And I didn't just decide this over night. I gigged with it many, many times. When I went back to my tube amp after not using it for a while I noticed a huge difference in the feel. And if that feel isn't what I like my playing suffers. If you can get past it than more power to you.

 

[Smac77]

They're great if you can get over the feel. Most guys eventually end up going back to their tube amp for a reason.

can you elaborate on this a bit... What is the most noticable thing missing ?

Like I said earlier, what you get out of the FOH isn't bad, it a issue with the feel. On a good tube amp you get that certain sag where you can really dig in. I didn't feel it with the Kemper. It just felt very sterile. And yes, I played through my powered Kemper, tube power amp with a 4x12, powered FFR. And I didn't just decide this over night. I gigged with it many, many times. When I went back to my tube amp after not using it for a while I noticed a huge difference in the feel. And if that feel isn't what I like my playing suffers. If you can get past it than more power to you.

i can't, thats why i asked ! Lots of guys love them but lots of guys saying you can't replace tubes... I was also looking at the kemper route like the op but rethinking that now... If only i could get 1 of everything lol...

 

[JerEvil]

Use a tube power amp and guitar cab. That's what I did but also why I ended up selling it. I was bringing WAY too much gear for something that should have been easy. Tried smaller cabs and tiny solid state power amps but for me it was a no-go.

It's a beautiful toy that can sound magnificent but I was lugging as much gear as when I was bringing the Splawn.

 

[ejecta]

I got tired of lugging around heavy amps and changing tubes from time to time.

If anyone can tell you they "hear a difference", they are just lying to themselves (because they need to convince themselves there is magic mojo in their amps). There are many videos on this subject. It is already a FACT that Kemper sounds as good and convincing as any tube amp around. Don't let subjectivity blind your objectivity.

If you know how to dial it, and play around with the settings, you are golden.

The ONLY reason you would need tube amps is if you have the extra money and people to carry them around for you (which, again... means you have money). If you already have a huge ass studio (like Michael Wagner) with many amps, well OF COURSE KEEP THEM. But there is no reasonable reason on WHY to have a tube amp instead of a Kemper...

Remember, you are playing for your audience, not to impress a bunch of bedroom warriors in a guitar forum full of cork-sniffers and dentists.

It is already a fact? Where? I can hear and "feel" a big difference and hate the eq thing on the kemper. I couldn't care less for what the others could hear, I prefer the feeling and tone of my tube amps.

As for the carrying around, some day you'll be playing the recorder on stage right? Even less to carry around than a kemper...

When we go into the "I feel this" and "I can hear this little quirk" territory, there is a fine line between personal experience and spewing disinformation.

So the other day I "felt" a weird presence when I got into a house. I couldn't put my finger on what it was exactly BUT IT FELT SPOOKY DUDE.



Have you heard about Double Blind experiments and how to get rid of bias? Yep, this is how we test things like the Kemper. You CAN'T tell what is "the real thing" with studio recording and live playing scenarios. I'm sorry to bring the news for you but technology just got to this point. (same reason there IS a heated discussion every time someone talks about the Kemper in forums)

You simply don't like the thing, fair enough. That's it. No need to dabble into subjective terms like "teh feelz" and blaming the EQ for not liking the thing.

And about the recorder thing on stage? Was that a joke? Because I really don't think it makes any sense given the context of the conversation here.

99% of all this stuff is subjective opinion whether feel is involved in the discussion or not. There are very few absolute facts when it comes to people's view on rigs and tone.

 

[Smac77]

I got tired of lugging around heavy amps and changing tubes from time to time.

If anyone can tell you they "hear a difference", they are just lying to themselves (because they need to convince themselves there is magic mojo in their amps). There are many videos on this subject. It is already a FACT that Kemper sounds as good and convincing as any tube amp around. Don't let subjectivity blind your objectivity.

If you know how to dial it, and play around with the settings, you are golden.

The ONLY reason you would need tube amps is if you have the extra money and people to carry them around for you (which, again... means you have money). If you already have a huge ass studio (like Michael Wagner) with many amps, well OF COURSE KEEP THEM. But there is no reasonable reason on WHY to have a tube amp instead of a Kemper...

Remember, you are playing for your audience, not to impress a bunch of bedroom warriors in a guitar forum full of cork-sniffers and dentists.

It is already a fact? Where? I can hear and "feel" a big difference and hate the eq thing on the kemper. I couldn't care less for what the others could hear, I prefer the feeling and tone of my tube amps.

As for the carrying around, some day you'll be playing the recorder on stage right? Even less to carry around than a kemper...

When we go into the "I feel this" and "I can hear this little quirk" territory, there is a fine line between personal experience and spewing disinformation.

So the other day I "felt" a weird presence when I got into a house. I couldn't put my finger on what it was exactly BUT IT FELT SPOOKY DUDE.



Have you heard about Double Blind experiments and how to get rid of bias? Yep, this is how we test things like the Kemper. You CAN'T tell what is "the real thing" with studio recording and live playing scenarios. I'm sorry to bring the news for you but technology just got to this point. (same reason there IS a heated discussion every time someone talks about the Kemper in forums)

You simply don't like the thing, fair enough. That's it. No need to dabble into subjective terms like "teh feelz" and blaming the EQ for not liking the thing.

And about the recorder thing on stage? Was that a joke? Because I really don't think it makes any sense given the context of the conversation here.

99% of all this stuff is subjective opinion whether feel is involved in the discussion or not. There are very few absolute facts when it comes to people's view on rigs and tone.

you're probably right on the money... I wonder how many opinions might change if we walked into demo room, plugged in blindfolded and let er rip.

 

[Monkey Man]

The Kemper eliminates the variables

Do Kempers kill soundmen? I want one!

LOL That's the one variable it doesn't take care of, unfortunately.

That said, it does in fact make the sound guy's job easier, and reduces the margin for error due to the fact that harsh resonances, especially in the high end, are already non-existent when the signal gets to the board. If an engineer's having a bad night or just lacks chops, these piercing annoyances (and intermittent feedback) that emanate from live-mic'd amps on stage find their way through, and do nobody any favours.

They're great if you can get over the feel. Most guys eventually end up going back to their tube amp for a reason.

No, most guys don't eventually go back to their tube amps. Most guys I know stick with the Kemper.

Like any new system, there is a little learning curve (although much less than there was with my Axe-FX). You have to understand how to get it to do what you want. Out of the box it sounds great, but if you want it to sound amazing, you'll have to learn how to tweak it.

We spend years learning about how to get the best out of our tube amps, guitars, pedals, cabs, etc. The only people I know who go back to tube amps from the KPA are the ones who don't spend a little time figuring out how to dial it in. It's not even that hard, and there are TONS of resources online. But some old dogs don't want to learn new tricks.

This.

I've seen hundreds of died-in-the-wool tube guys, including my brother, make the switch and swear they'll never go back. OTOH, I reckon I've seen perhaps 2 who reverted to using real tubes only. Regardless of the exact number who did so, in every case I saw a somewhat-disturbing wilful ignorance towards exploring the tweaking options at hand, in spite of the Kemper forum members' best efforts to encourage said experimantetion and tips offered. This made me wonder why they'd bothered in the first place; it's as if the whole exercise was intended to confirm their existing preference and nothing more.

LP Freak, I'm in no way disputing your personal experience and take on it; I'm just chiming in with my immediate reaction to your statement that "Most guys eventually end up going back to their tube amp for a reason". IMHO, it'd be more-accurate to say, "Most guys who eventually end up going back to their tube amps, do so for a reason."

Subtle language difference, but a hugely-different meaning, and one that's closer to the truth IMHO. Rock on brother.

 

[zuel69]

Thanks for your opinion. I've had the powered Kemper, a guitar cab and board..right next to that was my Suhr PT-100 SE stack...at this point like others have pointed out, your carrying close to the same amount of gear. In this situation...goodbye Kemper.

I got tired of lugging around heavy amps and changing tubes from time to time.

If anyone can tell you they "hear a difference", they are just lying to themselves (because they need to convince themselves there is magic mojo in their amps). There are many videos on this subject. It is already a FACT that Kemper sounds as good and convincing as any tube amp around. Don't let subjectivity blind your objectivity.

If you know how to dial it, and play around with the settings, you are golden.

The ONLY reason you would need tube amps is if you have the extra money and people to carry them around for you (which, again... means you have money). If you already have a huge ass studio (like Michael Wagner) with many amps, well OF COURSE KEEP THEM. But there is no reasonable reason on WHY to have a tube amp instead of a Kemper...

Remember, you are playing for your audience, not to impress a bunch of bedroom warriors in a guitar forum full of cork-sniffers and dentists.

 

[ProgFree]

When we go into the "I feel this" and "I can hear this little quirk" territory, there is a fine line between personal experience and spewing disinformation.

So the other day I "felt" a weird presence when I got into a house. I couldn't put my finger on what it was exactly BUT IT FELT SPOOKY DUDE.



Have you heard about Double Blind experiments and how to get rid of bias? Yep, this is how we test things like the Kemper. You CAN'T tell what is "the real thing" with studio recording and live playing scenarios. I'm sorry to bring the news for you but technology just got to this point. (same reason there IS a heated discussion every time someone talks about the Kemper in forums)

You simply don't like the thing, fair enough. That's it. No need to dabble into subjective terms like "teh feelz" and blaming the EQ for not liking the thing.

A big no comments to this one above...

Like I said earlier, what you get out of the FOH isn't bad, it a issue with the feel. On a good tube amp you get that certain sag where you can really dig in. I didn't feel it with the Kemper. It just felt very sterile. And yes, I played through my powered Kemper, tube power amp with a 4x12, powered FFR. And I didn't just decide this over night. I gigged with it many, many times. When I went back to my tube amp after not using it for a while I noticed a huge difference in the feel. And if that feel isn't what I like my playing suffers. If you can get past it than more power to you.

This, it was exactly the same for me. I also felt that how close the profile is to the real amp, depends a lot on the amp. For some amps the profiles lay closer for other amps they are far off. Never heard a convincing profile of my Diezels VH4 and Hagen or of a Herbert or of a Bogner Ecstasy or Uberschall for example. Ymmv.

 

[ejecta]

I got tired of lugging around heavy amps and changing tubes from time to time.

If anyone can tell you they "hear a difference", they are just lying to themselves (because they need to convince themselves there is magic mojo in their amps). There are many videos on this subject. It is already a FACT that Kemper sounds as good and convincing as any tube amp around. Don't let subjectivity blind your objectivity.

If you know how to dial it, and play around with the settings, you are golden.

The ONLY reason you would need tube amps is if you have the extra money and people to carry them around for you (which, again... means you have money). If you already have a huge ass studio (like Michael Wagner) with many amps, well OF COURSE KEEP THEM. But there is no reasonable reason on WHY to have a tube amp instead of a Kemper...

Remember, you are playing for your audience, not to impress a bunch of bedroom warriors in a guitar forum full of cork-sniffers and dentists.

It is already a fact? Where? I can hear and "feel" a big difference and hate the eq thing on the kemper. I couldn't care less for what the others could hear, I prefer the feeling and tone of my tube amps.

As for the carrying around, some day you'll be playing the recorder on stage right? Even less to carry around than a kemper...

When we go into the "I feel this" and "I can hear this little quirk" territory, there is a fine line between personal experience and spewing disinformation.

So the other day I "felt" a weird presence when I got into a house. I couldn't put my finger on what it was exactly BUT IT FELT SPOOKY DUDE.



Have you heard about Double Blind experiments and how to get rid of bias? Yep, this is how we test things like the Kemper. You CAN'T tell what is "the real thing" with studio recording and live playing scenarios. I'm sorry to bring the news for you but technology just got to this point. (same reason there IS a heated discussion every time someone talks about the Kemper in forums)

You simply don't like the thing, fair enough. That's it. No need to dabble into subjective terms like "teh feelz" and blaming the EQ for not liking the thing.

And about the recorder thing on stage? Was that a joke? Because I really don't think it makes any sense given the context of the conversation here.

99% of all this stuff is subjective opinion whether feel is involved in the discussion or not. There are very few absolute facts when it comes to people's view on rigs and tone.

you're probably right on the money... I wonder how many opinions might change if we walked into demo room, plugged in blindfolded and let er rip.

Some people's opinion might change and some may not. Just because someone can't tell the difference in feel or other nuances in playing guitar rigs doesn't mean everyone can or should. Also just because someone can detect differences doesn't make them a better player with better ears. It just makes them different than you and that's as it should be.

 

[Mattfig]

I do Kemper for live gigs and haven't looked back...I have decided to use DI profiles and a traditional cab and it works wonderfully....If the profiles are done well, you won't be able to make a distinction between which is which on an a/b test...

 

[wizardy]

I do Kemper for live gigs and haven't looked back...I have decided to use DI profiles and a traditional cab and it works wonderfully....If the profiles are done well, you won't be able to make a distinction between which is which on an a/b test...

This
Same thing for me

 

[Splawnman90]

Use a tube power amp and guitar cab. That's what I did but also why I ended up selling it. I was bringing WAY too much gear for something that should have been easy. Tried smaller cabs and tiny solid state power amps but for me it was a no-go.

It's a beautiful toy that can sound magnificent but I was lugging as much gear as when I was bringing the Splawn.

I feel you man! Dis you think with the tube poweramp and kemper - did it sound as good as your Splawn in a live setting? Could you tell the difference really?

 

[PBGas]

Let your ears make the choice. Kemper is a great unit for recording and is really easy to use. A lot of the inbox sounds are very easy to use and navigating the unit is intuitive. I was an early adopter 4 years ago and had several units through the years. Two of them gave me issues but the third was fine. There are many helpful and friendly people over at the Kemper forums. That being said, it is nice to have everything in one box. If I was a tourning pro, it would make total sense to have this to save both weight and time.

Thankfully, I play a couple of gigs per month and my setup is really easy and simple to use. I love amps and thus, remain using them for what I do. The Two-Notes Studio that I now have has pretty much eliminated any GAS I have for a modeller.