Lets talk Marshalls

  • Thread starter Thread starter cragginshred
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Had a DSL40C a few months ago and was pretty impressed with the variety of good sounds it had. The stock speaker had been swapped for a WGS ET-65. Only thing I didn't like about it was that the modes (clean/crunch and OD1/OD2) on each channel weren't footswitchable. Marshall fixed this on the DSL CR series if adding the upgraded footswitch. I can't speak to the build quality, but if you can demo a DSL series amp near you, I'd give it a shot.
 
JCM800 2203 like others have said with a boost or two. But you might consider the Amp 1 Iridium just for fun. I was surprised by its sound. Ive got five amp heads that are collecting dust since getting the Amp 1 unit.
 
That was my impression too. I've played maybe 5 or 6 different variants of the JVM at different volumes. I did prefer the 2 channel better - like Greazygeo is saying. But they always had this fake sound to the distortion, synthetic as you are saying. It's the preamp. I'm by far the expert here so I'm just blabbering. There are mods for them and you do have to crank them up to get the goods, similar to other amps like a *cough*Splawn*cough* :D

But there are plenty of dudes that love them, @rsm included I'm sure, so the great news is there are lots of choices. If I were to get a true Marshall, which I may some day, I would go for an old school OG'r. 4 holer or 2004. I'm just not real good at identifying a good one vs a not so good one which is why I got a Splawn lol.
Other than maybe Jubilee’s, most Marshall’s I found need to be very loud to sound their best. I also liked the Satch more than other JVM’s, but it still just has that synthetic/almost modeler sound. I find most amps made in the last 20 years or so have some degree of a less organic sound and feel, but the JVM’s and Engl’s are I think among the furthest tube amps I’ve tried down that spectrum of an artificial sound
 
Other than maybe Jubilee’s, most Marshall’s I found need to be very loud to sound their best. I also liked the Satch more than other JVM’s, but it still just has that synthetic/almost modeler sound. I find most amps made in the last 20 years or so have some degree of a less organic sound and feel, but the JVM’s and Engl’s are I think among the furthest tube amps I’ve tried down that spectrum of an artificial sound
I hear that a lot about the Friedmans but believe it or not....have never played one :(
 
Reissues are definitely cool, and reasonably priced. You just need a power station to get the most out of them stock. They’re kinda like legos, want the zakk sound? Plug in some 6550’s. Want the evh thing? Change out the first tube wiring. You see the point.
Reasonably priced!!??! Nothing these days is reasonably priced...
 
He’s had almost every Friedman, multiple times plus countless other highend marshall type amps. I don’t think you’re ever going to be happy ?
 
I hear that a lot about the Friedmans but believe it or not....have never played one :(

I think that is very true, in general they are super "slick" and processed sounding

I would say more so than a JVM in my opinion

I do think the dirty Shirley is leaps and bounds better than most of their other offerings though, that amp specifically has a cool thing of its own, unlike most of the other Friedmans I've played which have an ungodly amount of gain, but not a ton of personality

The DS feels quite a bit different
Other than maybe Jubilee’s, most Marshall’s I found need to be very loud to sound their best. I also liked the Satch more than other JVM’s, but it still just has that synthetic/almost modeler sound. I find most amps made in the last 20 years or so have some degree of a less organic sound and feel, but the JVM’s and Engl’s are I think among the furthest tube amps I’ve tried down that spectrum of an artificial sound

I agree. That processed/artificial sound has its place, though it's not to my taste

Lots of people seem to like the Engls and JVMs for that modern, slick, processed death metal tone
 
I think that is very true, in general they are super "slick" and processed sounding

I would say more so than a JVM in my opinion

I do think the dirty Shirley is leaps and bounds better than most of their other offerings though, that amp specifically has a cool thing of its own, unlike most of the other Friedmans I've played which have an ungodly amount of gain, but not a ton of personality

The DS feels quite a bit different


I agree. That processed/artificial sound has its place, though it's not to my taste

Lots of people seem to like the Engls and JVMs for that modern, slick, processed death metal tone
Happy with the classic '70s/'80s hard rock / old metal tones I get from my JVM410 (I use channels 1-3 mostly, rarely use red mode on 3) and Engl E651; I'm not hearing the modern slick processed death metal sounds -

- which I do hear with my Engl E530 Tube Preamp & E850/100 Tube power amp, which is why I purchased it many years ago - definitely gets the Death/Schuldiner, Cynic, Sadus, Morbid Angel, Carcass, Sepultura, etc. I wanted back then.

Then again, my ears could be shot by now, the tinnitus is bad too.
 
No one is selling a new reissue for $1500, where are u shopping so the rest of us can go there??!
 
No one is selling a new reissue for $1500, where are u shopping so the rest of us can go there??!
USED reissues around me are 1500-2000. There’s a 1987x that’s been sitting for weeks by me at $1600, and a jtm reissue for the same price.
 
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I just wish English was you primary language at this point.
 
My 4104 hangs with the best amps I've had. It's the sound of the 80s and most early 90s grunge.
Boosting the hi input is the sound of the big 4 80s metal bands.
Low input is terribly underrated for cleans and as a pedal platform. Big Muff here is the Smashing Pumpkins sound.
Anthrax, Motley Crue, Ratt, Black Crowes, White Zombie, Pearl Jam....
It'd be easier to name bands from the late 80s early 90s that didn't use the JCM800 than who did.

The reissues sound like a good JCM.
 
You play all the same music I play most of the time. If you didn't like the Smallbox because it's too dark and low gain for those sounds, and you want that more metallic, bright gain sound guys like Warren Dimartini were known for, that's a journey for sure that might take you a few tries to get what you like. I'll make a few comments though:

I have a JVM410. Channel 2 "Crunch" and Overdrive 1 are great. The JVM210/205 does not have Crunch Green, Crunch Orange, or any of the OD1 modes, only OD2. I mention this because OD2, to my ear, sounds awful, and not at all like a classic Marshall. So with that said, aim for the JVM410 if shopping JVM's... but personally I wouldn't be too interested in a JVM for what you want. Yes, it can do it, and yes it sounds alright, but you're sacrificing a lot for the versatility which you may not ever use. Idk, I've had two JVM410's, and they just don't "wow" me the way other Marshalls have, and I think you'll probably feel the same way, if not at first then later on.

You really can't lose with a real JCM800, 2203 or 2204, reissue or otherwise. It's *the* sound for a reason, but you'll need either a boost, or modifications to hit those heavier 80s metal sounds, or to get the voice for VH sounds. It's not versatile like the JVM, but it sure does that definitive sound perfectly.

I have to plug the 2205 and 2210 model JCM800's. Some people don't like them, but if you get a later revision circuit - mid '84 or later - they seriously rip. I have one of each, and they do sound quite different from each other, one is brighter than the other. But they are both superb, with good effects loops, and a clean channel that is pretty decent too. They do use diodes for additional gain, and they are always on, so if you hear that telltale light "fuzz" of the diode and it just drives you crazy, you won't like these.

As an alternative, a JCM900 Mk III head is basically an extension of a 2203/2204. It shares almost the same circuit topology, but it's voiced with a little less bass, likely to keep it from getting muddy when.... you turn up the "sensitivity" knob which introduces diode clipping. The nice thing about the Mk III though, you can turn that control to zero, and the diodes are no longer having any effect on the sound, not enough voltage is going through and the signal isn't being clipped. Turn it up for flavor, or not, add a boost, or not, etc. Very nice amp, and an effects loop for the required reverb/delay and maybe chorus if you're going for certain VH sounds. Truly, fantastic amp.

Both the 2-channel 800's and the Mk III have not been reissued, you have to get the real thing.

Ok, one last plug. Ceriatone King Kong (or Yeti, or Chupacabra) does those kinds of modded Jose 80s sounds dead on. On the KK, Channel 1 is a duplicate Treble channel from a 1987/1959 NMV Marshall. Played side by side with my real 1987x's treble channel, it's extremely close, maybe even within just the tolerance of components (10-20%). Channel 2 on the KK is the same as the Yeti, which gives you two bright switches, two gain controls, and the "era" switch which is a 3-way switch that lets you do no diodes, or some type of diode A, or another arrangement of diodes B. Basically, flipping a couple of switches you can fine tune exactly how much brightness and cut you want, how much gain you want from two different stages, and how strong the diode clipping is on the amp (at the cost of volume, just like the real early modded amps). It's a seriously killer amp and for the price I can't believe more people don't have them. I like the King Kong in particular because I like the second channel, so I can do either clean-ish + high gain, or crunch + gainy solo. Highly, highly recommended amp from me specifically for 80s shred sounds.

I was not super fused over the JVMs I played over the years but I'm not a Marshall expert. You will get tons of good advice here :yes:

This is a decent guide I believe :D
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Dammmmnnn I don't want to be a shitter lol but I hate that graphic. I know tone is subjective and all, but of these I strongly disagree with:
  • JCM900 Dual Reverb gets a "great" for overall distortion. I don't hate it, I think it sounds awesome for 90s punk stuff, but a lot of people outright dislike it, the whole amp is op-amps and clipping diodes, it only has 1 tube gain stage even. I'm not crapping on JCM900DR's specifically, but that rating is just really... biased? Yeah.
  • JCM900 SL-X gets a "great" for modern metal, but the Mk III gets "Mediocre." It's basically the same exact amp, swap one tube gain stage on the SLX for Diodes on the Mk III. By extension, DSL/TSL which both have far more gain than the SL-X also get "Mediocre" for modern metal? Also, SL-X gets a "mediocre" for classic rock - Ace Frehley from KISS would probably disagree lol, since he used the crap out of those for ya know, classic rock.
  • JCM800 split channel and Jubilee are the same line. These are WAY different sounding amps. Like, not even close.
  • TSL gets "good" while DSL gets "great" for overall distortion. Again, lead channel, same exact circuit, same sound. Had them both side by side.
  • JCM900 Dual reverb gets "great" for overall features. It's got two channels and an FX loop. How does an amp like the TSL have a lower rating, which has three channels, two effects loops, XLR output, output mute, etc etc.
I could go on. I know I'm being a bit of a jerk and I'm not calling you out specifically, but as someone who owns - concurrently - almost every tube amp on that list, this comes off as a chart that someone who owned one or two of them made while "speculating" about the others based on youtube clips or hearing one in a shop somewhere. Not someone who has used the same guitar, same speaker cab, same room to actually test them out.

(Sorry)
 
Anyone that has played 5 old (late-60s 70s) Marshalls knows that 4 of them suck. 9 out of 10 with 50 watters.

What is the disconnect with modern tolerances and schematics and kits? I've heard wild shit like the insolation used on the old wires.

Come on.

The 100 watt VM Marshalls were everything you can expect from a plexi. Dickhead guitar players shat on them.
 
Anyone that has played 5 old (late-60s 70s) Marshalls knows that 4 of them suck. 9 out of 10 with 50 watters.

What is the disconnect with modern tolerances and schematics and kits? I've heard wild shit like the insolation used on the old wires.

Come on.

The 100 watt VM Marshalls were everything you can expect from a plexi. Dickhead guitar players shat on them.
I thought the VM was based on the JTM ?
Doesn't do the JMP stuff near as well as JTM ?

The VM can be found around $700.
 
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