Metal guitar recording methods used by majority are far from optimal?

There seems to be a lot of misconceptions about what I am after here. By mentioning "in the room" sound, I don't mean that I want the room ambience into the sound. I mean the frequency spectrum itself. If you close mic the speaker from an inch away, you'll hear very different type of sound than in the room, because different parts of the speaker sound different. In the room you'll hear the whole speaker area, how it sounds as a whole. That is what I meant by saying "it is possible to actually hear that sound in the room".

Can I assume you have listened to live guitar playing with good headphones into an interface while you or someone moves the mic around the speaker at close, 1", and further and you have found better positions for metal? Or am not following?
 
This topic requires the listener to hear the cabinet output in the room and then what was captured through the mic. So it's impossible to say how well the process worked from audio clips alone.
You misunderstand, I meant you can hear how things stack up against a standard 57 on the edge of a dustcap, which is what I'm comparing to. Naturally the only person who knows how close the amp sounds to the recording in that thread would be me, so you can't compare that yourself. Best you'll get is my subjective opinions on how close it sounds to me when I listen back, which may or may not be useful to you.
 
There seems to be a lot of misconceptions about what I am after here. By mentioning "in the room" sound, I don't mean that I want the room ambience into the sound. I mean the frequency spectrum itself. If you close mic the speaker from an inch away, you'll hear very different type of sound than in the room, because different parts of the speaker sound different. In the room you'll hear the whole speaker area, how it sounds as a whole. That is what I meant by saying "it is possible to actually hear that sound in the room".

Ah ok I think I see a misunderstanding here.

No, you won't hear the "whole speaker area" in the room.

Stand in the room and listen to a cab. After that, move your head a foot in any direction and listen again. Notice how the tone is completely different now. So where exactly in the room is the "true" sound of the speaker? The answer is that there isn't one, because there is no "one true whole sound" of a speaker. A cab puts out an entire spectrum of different EQ+phase signatures depending on where you stand in the room relative to the cab, and will sound different depending on the characteristics of the room is as well. All a mic does is capture a specific one of these EQ+phase signatures in space, out of an entire spectrum of tones. In the room, your ears just capture two of these EQ+phase signatures from said spectrum, and your brain mixes them in stereo. You can do the same thing with two mics. Either way a mic setup close to the cab hears no more or less of the "whole speaker sound" than your ears.

Also, think about how much farther away from the speaker your head typically is than a mic. You're hearing a LOT more room reflections than you think. If the cab would sound different in an anechoeic chamber, then your ears are hearing a whole lot of the room mixed in with the speaker. Plus, your ears can't both face the cab at the same time, as they're on opposite sides of your head. In a room, you might hear some small amount of vibrations directly caused by the speaker, but usually only in one ear at a time, and you hear just as much if not more room reflections bounced from objects or walls. And even if your head is on axis with the speaker, the speaker is likely way off axis from your ears, so does that mean your ears aren't perceiving the sound as truly as possible then?

There is no singular "in the room" tone. "In the room" tone is a myth. Instead there is an entire spectrum of sound any given guitar cab will produce throughout a given room, and where you put your head at any given moment dictates what you will hear, but that is by no means representative of the "true" tone of the whole speaker any more than what a mic would hear.
 
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Also, it seems like some of you haven't used the sE Electronics Voodoo series ribbon mics yet. I feel like this is a lot of the solution to just a SM57, as my VR1 sounds flat and natural. I put it on the edge of the dust cap, and being a ribbon mic, it covers more of the cone of the speaker. Even close up, it sounds very neutral on everything I've put it on, and the top end is sweet. It's not dark like other ribbon mics (R121), and it has a lot of range. Bright ribbon mics might be the future of recording guitar.
 
i was curious a while ago about 10" speaker.. i bought a celestion creamback and a v30 and made a closed back mesa recto 1x10 clone with high quality leftover wood from other projects..

it's surprising.. its has its own tone but this thing can cut through any mix.. its quite middy but there is a surprising amount of.bass (the cab is deep).. if micced and recorded, you can eq it to make it sound like a pseudo 4x12 if you know what you're doing with eqs..

i consider it as a usefull specialized tool..
 
OP has a ton of theoretical tone philosophy but 0 sound samples trying to persuade us out of close mic-ing a v30 with a 57 for metal. Are we going to present evidence for these alternative ideas or just wonder out loud "is everybody wrong"?
 
This just isn't really how speaker cabs work in real life. Each speaker does not put out the same frequencies. Each one will sound slightly different. On top of that, you will ALWAYS have some room resonance happening. You can close mic a 412 in different rooms and hear this. You can mic 15-20CM back and hear this. Different size cabs will resonate differently. Different number of speakers in a cab will resonate and sound different. Every little piece adds up to contribute to what you are hearing. Having different speakers in the same 412 will change how each speaker sounds.

But like has been mentioned countless times in this thread...audio engineers have been optimizing metal guitar recordings for decades. It's simply wrong to say that the way things are done after all this time and experimentation is sub-optimal. We have to work within the parameters that sound and physics gives us, so there will never be a "perfect" solution. It's all art, there is no perfect. Science and the art of music and sound don't really translate in ways that make sense to each other.
 
heres the mic placement for the Metallica clip i did, dead center on the cone and leaning against the grill lol


H3vqDkZ_d.jpeg
 
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