New Rat vs Old Rat - Bullshit or Legit?

[SavageRiffer]

What's the deal with the new Proco Rat and vintage? I know about the LM308 chips and whatever, but are they REALLY better or just have the settled, burned-in quality that old gear has? From what I can tell, the newer Rat sounds pretty damned good.

 

[stephen sawall]

I've owned several since 1982. They all sound similar to me. My favorite is a big box vintage from the late 90's that does not have a LM308. It's a bit brighter with a little more cut. Direct A/B with a 1982 with LM308 is a bit smoother.

To be honest the difference is so small I can't tell what one I am using without looking.

 

[mchn13]

I've owned several since 1982. They all sound similar to me. My favorite is a big box vintage from the late 90's that does not have a LM308. It's a bit brighter with a little more cut. Direct A/B with a 1982 with LM308 is a bit smoother.

To be honest the difference is so small I can't tell what one I am using without looking.

Same. I can't really tell a difference, but I've only used them as a boost on a marshall. Might try boosting my Vht with it today.

 

[SavageRiffer]

Have you guys ever tried one of those boutique Rat clones like the Hartman? If so, what were your thoughts? I'm considering a good quality clone because I used to have a Rat in the early 90's but didn't care a lot for the way the filter worked, that the volume needed to be at 2:00 to be level with the amp signal, or that the distortion past 2:00 got too fuzzy. I bought another one early 2000's and it was the same thing. I never noticed a difference. They sounded exactly the same except the 80's one was kind of plastic sounding or something. It's hard to explain but there was slightly more color to the tone than the 2000's one. It seems like the boutiques might have a little better range on the knobs and reign in the tone and level a little better, so that's why I'm thinking about getting one. Also, on a side note, I hear the Suhr Riot is based on the Rat.

 

[godgrinder]

I have a 90's big box Vintage Rat with 308, and a 00's Turbo Rat modded with 308 and turbo/vintage switch. With the TR in vintage mode the 2 sounded basically the same, except the big box sound slightly smoother.

Haven't tried a boutique Rat-type pedal myself. But a Turbo Rat would give you more output. I don't really care a whole lot about what happens with the gain knob up high, since I rarely turn it past 9:00 as a boost.

 

[SavageRiffer]

I have a 90's big box Vintage Rat with 308, and a 00's Turbo Rat modded with 308 and turbo/vintage switch. With the TR in vintage mode the 2 sounded basically the same, except the big box sound slightly smoother.

Haven't tried a boutique Rat-type pedal myself. But a Turbo Rat would give you more output. I don't really care a whole lot about what happens with the gain knob up high, since I rarely turn it past 9:00 as a boost.

Boost? I wouldn't have thought it would be great for that. I like how it sounds on an edge of breakup or slightly dirty amp though.

 

[stephen sawall]

Works great as a boost, overdrive it distortion.

The clones I have tried did not sound like a Rat. I did not like any of them.

 

[Starman22]

I like the Rat2 setup as a boost, not a distortion. I turn the distortion knob down to 7:00 and the Volume knob to 3:30 and it gives a sinister boost to a Marshall. In fact it can be very much like a BOSS DS-1 in this respect, but with a bit more tightness.

The filter knob adds tightness and attack.... or opposite looser and more thump.

 

[jdel77]

Old Rats are smoother and clean up better on the guitar's volume knob.
The best Rat variant is the Bixonic Expandora with the external switches.

 

[SavageRiffer]

I like the Rat2 setup as a boost, not a distortion. I turn the distortion knob down to 7:00 and the Volume knob to 3:30 and it gives a sinister boost to a Marshall. In fact it can be very much like a BOSS DS-1 in this respect, but with a bit more tightness.

The filter knob adds tightness and attack.... or opposite looser and more thump.

Ew, I can't stand the stock DS-1. By tightness you mean less low end or not muddy low end?

Old Rats are smoother and clean up better on the guitar's volume knob.
The best Rat variant is the Bixonic Expandora with the external switches.

I've come across that pedal before, but the reviews haven't been that great. I wonder how it compares to the Hartman.

 

[Starman22]

I like the Rat2 setup as a boost, not a distortion. I turn the distortion knob down to 7:00 and the Volume knob to 3:30 and it gives a sinister boost to a Marshall. In fact it can be very much like a BOSS DS-1 in this respect, but with a bit more tightness.

The filter knob adds tightness and attack.... or opposite looser and more thump.

Ew, I can't stand the stock DS-1. By tightness you mean less low end or not muddy low end?

[/quote]


By tightness I mean less thump in the strings low end or faster more crisp attack at the strings. The DS-1 is advertised as a distortion pedal like the Rat2, yet both can become a somewhat clean boost with flavor if dialed away from distortion.

 

[cecilbag]

I've always found the rat tone really trashy sounding. I thought it was ok as a boost but not great. I have an old one and a mid-90s. They sound pretty much the same to me.

 

[japetus]

Try to find an old Keeley Modded Rat, with the 3 way mod. Best Rat I have ever had and at one point, had just about all of them.

 

[SavageRiffer]

Try to find an old Keeley Modded Rat, with the 3 way mod. Best Rat I have ever had and at one point, had just about all of them.

Hmm, sounds interesting. I'll check it out, thanks.