noob question... how to make this kind of rig work? rack w/d

[white buffalo]

I'm looking to put together my first big rig, but am feeling a bit lost as to how to actually do it.
I'll be running a Soldano SLO and CAA OD-100 Classic Plus (alternating with a DC-30) together, as well as my pedals and some rack units.
I don't have any of the rack stuff yet as I'd first like to understand it better. For example, I'd like to run a 2290, PCM 42, PCM 81 and maybe a tri stereo chorus if I can find one, along with 6-8 pedals on drawers inside the rack.
I'd like to get something like a CAE RS-10 to control all the effects and have some presets (combining various combinations of said effects) available at the tap of a switch, but not sure how exactly it works.
Would all the rack and pedal effects sum to a simple input/output into the foot controller? Programming seems like a nightmare for someone like me who isn't the least bit tech savvy, but maybe I'd get some help for that aspect.
Regarding the amps, I'd likely be running both into the same cab (will be getting a 4x12) and switching for clean/rhythm and lead stuff between the two heads. I was also thinking of running wet/dry but think the CAA amp would maybe be wasted on wet duties. What do you guys think? What are some good amps to run wet that can keep up with an SLO and CAA 100?
I'm mainly confused about the effects routing situation as this will be my first rack setup.

 

[glpg80]

I'm piecing together mine as well. I'll be running the following:

1x Furman P-1800AR AC Line RMS Voltage Regulator/Power Conditioner
1x Korg Tuner
1x ISP Pro Rack (Non-G Model)
1x Sound Sculpture Switchblade GL
1x Shure QLXD14 Half Rack Wireless
1x Lexicon PCM81 (Reverb/Chorus)
1x ADA 2FX (Chorus/Flanger)
1x TC G Major II
2x Rack Tray: Damage Control Timeline, EVH Phase 90, EVH Flanger, Tim V2 Pedal
2x TC 2240 Parametric EQ

Mine will be split between 2x 8 space racks to leave room and make transport a bit easier. I plan to have a slave power amp in a separate 2x rack to save on weight.

The switchblade is the backbone to my system - you can switch using a matrix-based approach - anything can go in any order at any time and you have full dB level control. Mine does not use multiple amps providing different tones at the same time via midi, as I'm using a single head to provide the tone and channel switching via MIDI within the switchblade.

Zach will chime in I'm sure and show the diagram of how his is connected. He uses a CAE rack device to switch (safely) between multiple amps via MIDI which sounds like what you want to do as well.

Hope this helps a bit.

 

[ChurchHill]

Here's what I'd do... I'd have one switcher that handled all of the up-front pedals. The output of that would go into a dedicated amp switcher, one that would provide a suitable load for the one not in use and send whichever was selected to one cab. I'd run a DI right before the cab and use this signal to feed the back end of the rack. I'd split the signal between all the post-amp devices (pedals or rackmount), use a second switcher to turn the inputs on or off as desired (so trails would continue to fade naturally), then use a mixer to mix them down to a stereo signal. That, I would run into a stereo slave amp powering 2 additional cabinets.

I'd draw this up, but I'm getting ready for an early morning trip. Hopefully, the following will be somewhat helpful, at least maybe to the point of asking more questions.

Guitar

VVVVV

Switcher for pedals before the amp

VVVVV

Switcher for amps >>> DI >>> Dry Cabinet

VVVVV

Switcher for effects after the amp
* various effects *
Mixer for post-amp effects

VVVVV

Stereo Slave Amp >>> Left Cabinet
>>> Right Cabinet


I'll try to make a better diagram tomorrow. In the mean time, I hope this makes just a little bit of sense.


<edit> Oh, BTW, this isn't the only way to do this. The above is Wet/Dry/Wet, but you could use your existing amps for the slave amp and switch between the preamps just like you'd switch between pedals. Both amps would have to have an effects loop to do this. Anyway, then you could feed the post-amp effects with the signal from the selected preamp and return the signal from the mixer to the effects return on both amps. The switching system in this example is slightly more complex, but does away with the slave power amp and at least one cabinet (if your cabinet can run stereo, you'd really only need that one stereo cabinet). This would result in a Wet/Wet rig. There are even more options, too, but IMHO, these two sound the best.

 

[Zachman]

I'm looking to put together my first big rig, but am feeling a bit lost as to how to actually do it.
I'll be running a Soldano SLO and CAA OD-100 Classic Plus (alternating with a DC-30) together, as well as my pedals and some rack units.
I don't have any of the rack stuff yet as I'd first like to understand it better. For example, I'd like to run a 2290, PCM 42, PCM 81 and maybe a tri stereo chorus if I can find one, along with 6-8 pedals on drawers inside the rack.
I'd like to get something like a CAE RS-10 to control all the effects and have some presets (combining various combinations of said effects) available at the tap of a switch, but not sure how exactly it works.
Would all the rack and pedal effects sum to a simple input/output into the foot controller? Programming seems like a nightmare for someone like me who isn't the least bit tech savvy, but maybe I'd get some help for that aspect.
Regarding the amps, I'd likely be running both into the same cab (will be getting a 4x12) and switching for clean/rhythm and lead stuff between the two heads. I was also thinking of running wet/dry but think the CAA amp would maybe be wasted on wet duties. What do you guys think? What are some good amps to run wet that can keep up with an SLO and CAA 100?
I'm mainly confused about the effects routing situation as this will be my first rack setup.

I recommend going here, and reading EVERYTHING (Every Link, etc.) a few times, BEFORE you spend any money. It'll help w/ design ideas, and considerations that may prove useful. http://customaudioelectronics.com/faq

The devices on your list are mostly what I selected, and it's good that you are that specific re: your preferences. It saves a LOT of time and $.

My setup is a Multi-Amp, w/d/w architecture. 20 Space Rack w/ Pedal Tray (ALL Pedals [Dyna Comp, Univibe, Phase 90, SCH-1, MXR Flanger, EHX LPB-2] are routed to the Inputs of the 'Selected' Amp.) POST Gear are TC 2290, TC 1210, Dytronics CS5, Lexicon PCM 81, Eventide H8000FW, Rocktron 300G.

Basically, There's an Audio Controller/Interface (Loop Switching System/Interface to the Foot Controller (Wah, Phantom Power to the RS10, Pre Volume, Post Volume, and a Dual Tap Tempo Control (2290/H8000FW)

Line Mixer (Mixes POST FX Series//Parallel to a Stereo L/R Output--routed to the Audio Controller/Interface--which feeds Stereo Power Amp Inputs L/R). I use a CAE Dual 5 channel Stereo Line Mixer.

Then there's the Amp Selector: I use a CAE V.1 which allows 4 Amps- 1 at a time-thru the same "Dry" Cabinet. There's also independent, Parallel Adjustable Line Level Controls for each of the 4 amps to feed the Input of the Rack Gear.

 

[ChurchHill]

I'll absolutely second Zachman's suggestions. I've learned so much of what I know from him through both this forum and HRI. There are several other experts on this topic here, too (just not me, I'm still learning).

Rigs like this can get complex and expensive really fast, so all the research you can do will be of immeasurable benefit. When I built my first "big" rack, I literally planned it out on paper for over a year before I bought anything. I read and re-read every manual for every piece of gear I was considering, mentally and physically drew it out just to make sure it would work. I asked a lot of questions along the way. All that paid off, too, in that the first time I wired it up, it worked exactly as designed.

Also, Zachman's right about being specific. The more specific, the better, too... think about how you want your gear to work together. For me, one of my requirements was for independent reverb and delay after the main "effects" (modulation, harmonizer, filters, etc.). So, I have two levels of effects in my rack, both post-dry-amp, each with its own switching and mixer. The first level is Yamaha SPX90, TC 2290, TC 1210, and Eventide H3000DSE. Those are mixed to stereo, then through a Lexicon PCM 81 and an Eventide DSP/GTR4000, and finally to stereo once again.

I'm still working on adding multi-amp capability...

 

[Zachman]

I'll absolutely second Zachman's suggestions. I've learned so much of what I know from him through both this forum and HRI. There are several other experts on this topic here, too (just not me, I'm still learning).

Rigs like this can get complex and expensive really fast, so all the research you can do will be of immeasurable benefit. When I built my first "big" rack, I literally planned it out on paper for over a year before I bought anything. I read and re-read every manual for every piece of gear I was considering, mentally and physically drew it out just to make sure it would work. I asked a lot of questions along the way. All that paid off, too, in that the first time I wired it up, it worked exactly as designed.

Also, Zachman's right about being specific. The more specific, the better, too... think about how you want your gear to work together. For me, one of my requirements was for independent reverb and delay after the main "effects" (modulation, harmonizer, filters, etc.). So, I have two levels of effects in my rack, both post-dry-amp, each with its own switching and mixer. The first level is Yamaha SPX90, TC 2290, TC 1210, and Eventide H3000DSE. Those are mixed to stereo, then through a Lexicon PCM 81 and an Eventide DSP/GTR4000, and finally to stereo once again.

I'm still working on adding multi-amp capability...

Thanks for the kind words. I am glad some of my madness has proved useful/helpful.

The multi-amp part-- is where things take a severe turn into the realm of insanity.

I look at it like: There's the FX and the architecture one intends (how they interact-- in front of amp-Pre-FX, POST amp Stereo), There's the Amps and how it all interacts, and then there's the control facet (Switching System, and MIDI Foot Controller, which makes it all into a cohesive 'rig'. I know one thing, you guys have GREAT taste in gear.

 

[glpg80]

I love how all of us have a PCM 81 currently or in plans. Absolutely stellar piece of equipment

 

[Zachman]

I love how all of us have a PCM 81 currently or in plans. Absolutely stellar piece of equipment

Agree. I upgraded from the PCM-80, and a million other things prior. It (PCM 81) has 'the' sounds a lot of us have heard on recordings, that just isn't there w/ other unit brands.

 

[ChurchHill]

I agree, too. There are so many sounds in the PCM 81 that we've all heard before, not just the reverbs, but the chorus and delays, too. Extremely versatile box. I think the Eventides are like that, too, and the 2290.

Just BTW, I've also got a TC 2240. I noticed that you have one, too, glpg80. And yeah, I picked it up after reading what psychodave had to say about it. I put each side in its own loop so I could have two "presets." Another great piece of gear!

 

[glpg80]

I agree, too. There are so many sounds in the PCM 81 that we've all heard before, not just the reverbs, but the chorus and delays, too. Extremely versatile box. I think the Eventides are like that, too, and the 2290.

Just BTW, I've also got a TC 2240. I noticed that you have one, too, glpg80. And yeah, I picked it up after reading what psychodave had to say about it. I put each side in its own loop so I could have two "presets." Another great piece of gear!

2240's have flown under the radar for a very long time. They're by far the best EQ money can buy today IMHO. They're super transparent and they sound absolutely fucking killer. Love mine and will not be letting it go anytime soon

I plan to use mine similarly. I will have one for a rhythm tone and another for cleans. I plan to use pedals for boosting leads before the amp with the rhythm EQ on. When the rig is ready to wire up, it's never going off

 

[ChurchHill]

Yep, transparent and quiet... plus, there's the boost for running one before the amp (like the Furman PQ3 or PQ4) or without it in the loop for fine tuning. Doesn't have the WOW factor of an Eventide or a Lex... until you turn it off.