PayPal Drama

[FourT6and2]

I don't understand where you are getting the "seller accepts payment" idea, because in my experience a buyer clicks "send" on the payment button and bam the money goes straight to the seller and the fee is deducted simultaneously. No option to accept or decline.

Depending on the the type of payment, you have to click a button in your PP account that says something like "accept" the payment or something to that effect (claim funds, accept, etc. I can't remember the exact wording). And in this case, the payment had a hold on it. So the seller didn't have immediate access to the funds either way.

Whenever someone pays me using PayPal, I get an email that says, "You have money waiting. Click here to accept the funds". I then log into my account and see the transaction on my homepage with a button that says "accept".

The buyer sees a window showing the full value of the payment sent, but the seller sees a window showing the full value minus the fees deducted.

Correct. But not until AFTER the seller clicks accept. This has always been the case for me...

Now I suppose if there is a hold on the payment, I can understand how this process is paused, and that the fee would be refunded since the payment was never actually received. But outside of that, Paypal technically says that transaction fees are not refundable and that's why I was asking.

The buyer gets their full amount back.

 

[FourT6and2]

Same guitar is on reverb now :

https://reverb.com/item/92805488-mayones-duvell-elite-7-bl

Yeah, he put it up on Reverb after this happened as a way to bypass using PayPal. But a few problems with Reverb that I told the seller about:

1. Seller loses more money on Reverb fees.
2. Buyer pays more due to sales tax.
3. Reverb still holds the funds in escrow until seller provides tracking and/or guitar is delivered.

So I'm not sure why he's doing all of this instead of just accepting PayPal directly. The guy just sounds like he's not familiar with how the internet works.

I told him to call PayPal and find out why they're putting holds on his account and then get back to me if he decides to accept PayPal. Otherwise, I guess this isn't the guitar for me. Oh well. Don't really need a 7-string. Just thought I'd give one a try and I already have Mayones Duvells and love them.

 

[peterc52]

I've tried it 3 times before. They put the money on hold for 30 days

 

[napalmdeath]

I’ve had PayPal put a hold on incoming fees to me before. It’s been a few years but it was random and happened a couple of times. It’s definitely annoying as hell

I've had it happen too. They do it randomly, though its not happened in a long time. It's just a matter of shipping it and they'll release the funds upon delivery confirmation. Sounds like he's not active with PayPal and they flagged it. It's just to make sure the seller is legit. But, in some cases they'll hold the money up to 21 days.

 

[Exo-metal]

It's possible that they place a hold after having to reimburse you. My last transaction was a scam and bc I always use "for goods" when I don't know the seller the hold is used at that point in your next transaction randomly?

 

[Mike Oxhuge]

I think I'll message him on Reverb and ask if I can pay him tomorrow for a handburger roday.

 

[acidvoodoo]

Already done. No issue.

I don't understand only accepting FF or Zelle or Venmo. If the buyer pays the fees (like I did), then seller should have no problem accepting PayPal. After all, why would I want to risk thousands of dollars on an unknown seller. That's what PP is for—buyer and seller protection. If I know the person and trust them, sure... FF and Venmo are fine.

If a seller refuses to accept PayPal even when buyer agrees to pay the fees, that's a red flag.

Reverb seems to be the safest way to sell these days imo, but the catch is it’s expensive. Only using PayPal for a sale is sketchy either way you do it. F&F the buyer is completely unprotected. Regular PayPal, the seller is at risk because the buyer can request a return at anytime and those funds will be snatched right out of your account. It sucks selling gear now.

 

[Exo-metal]

Definitely no fun, they took all that away.

 

[lespaul6]

I started using paypal again recently and they put a hold on the money I received- over 2k in both cases. They released the funds when I updated the tracking to show it was delivered with signature.

 

[harddriver]

Already done. No issue.

I don't understand only accepting FF or Zelle or Venmo. If the buyer pays the fees (like I did), then seller should have no problem accepting PayPal. After all, why would I want to risk thousands of dollars on an unknown seller. That's what PP is for—buyer and seller protection. If I know the person and trust them, sure... FF and Venmo are fine.

If a seller refuses to accept PayPal even when buyer agrees to pay the fees, that's a red flag.

Red Flag I agree.....Maybe he wanted FF for a not so good reason or maybe not. Maybe he had some scam attempts as well, it's pretty screwed up right now buying and selling music stuff???

Good thing you cancelled the payment!

I remember buying all kinds of stuff in the early 2000's and if I didn't like it I flipped it, sometimes at a loss sometimes at a gain, but unless the items I bought were grossly misrepresented I never tired to force refunds. I never played the item for 90 days and then try to ask for a refund and make up a lie to force the seller to take the item's back like what seems to happen alot today.

AHHHHHHHHHHHHH, the good ole days of flipping gear.....People want a buy and try guarantee and PP accommodates them so it gets abused.

 

[PBGas]

This happened to me as well. A couple of years back, I had listed and sold my SSv2 to a member that is here and on another board. I knew him and talked to him frequently so it was a non-issue and I shipped it to him. It was random because he bought another amp from me several months before and there was no holding of funds.

Sounds like you made the right choice in the end.

 

[TooMuchGear]

I don't want a 1099-K is all. In IL I get a 1099k when I sell over $1,000.

I read recently that the reporting rules have been rolled back. Now is it > 200 transactions AND > $20K before a 1099 is issued.

 

[FourT6and2]

I read recently that the reporting rules have been rolled back. Now is it > 200 transactions AND > $20K before a 1099 is issued.

Not only that, but just because you get a 1099 doesn't mean you actually owe taxes. You only owe taxes if you make a consistent profit on those sales and you are only taxed on the gains. I don't know too many non-commercial sellers that are profiting on used gear...

You sell a guitar on Reverb, you aren't exactly profiting. Depreciation, selling fees, PayPal fees, shipping fees, your time and effort to maintain the gear, what you put into the gear for upkeep (strings if a guitar, tubes and such for an amp, etc.). All of that comes out of the profit you might make.

I sold a car a few years ago for a huge profit. Way more than $20K. And I didn't owe any tax on that.

 

[TooMuchGear]

Not only that, but just because you get a 1099 doesn't mean you actually owe taxes. You only owe taxes if you make a consistent profit on those sales and you are only taxed on the gains. I don't know too many non-commercial sellers that are profiting on used gear...

You sell a guitar on Reverb, you aren't exactly profiting. Depreciation, selling fees, PayPal fees, shipping fees, your time and effort to maintain the gear, what you put into the gear for upkeep (strings if a guitar, tubes and such for an amp, etc.). All of that comes out of the profit you might make.

I sold a car a few years ago for a huge profit. Way more than $20K. And I didn't owe any tax on that.

Not having to report saves sellers a lot of paperwork by not having to show in tax records whether a profit was made on every sale. As a hobby seller that would likely be most sales.

 

[Rackman]

Not only that, but just because you get a 1099 doesn't mean you actually owe taxes.

Yeah but it means you have to demonstrate the sale did not result in a profit which is a PITA for a random gear sale. You can't just ignore it.

 

[FourT6and2]

Yeah but it means you have to demonstrate the sale did not result in a profit which is a PITA for a random gear sale. You can't just ignore it.

Meh. 10 minutes of additional paperwork. No big deal. Up to you whether you think the convenience of using Reverb, PayPal, Venmo, etc. outweigh the inconvenience of having to fill out a form a year later.

And it's not one random gear sale. You need to rack up many thousands, if not tens of thousands of dollars in sales in a tax year to trigger a 1099. Or sell one Larry amp lol.