Recording distorted guitar tones. Advice and tips please...

[Gooseman]

I am in the process of recording some distorted guitar tones and learning to record in general. My setup? A MacBook Pro, Shure SM57, Apogee Duet, Logic Express 9, Sony monitoring headphones (will buy actual monitors in the near future), Gibson SG Standard, Mesa Boogie Roadster, Marshall 1987x (can't really record this until I pickup an attenuator), Mesa Thiele cab w/ V-30.

Help me. What I know so far? Well, I know how to use Maestro to set the input levels on the mic. For example, get my amp to the level I would like it to be recorded at, then play and see where the output levels are in Logic. I guess you don't want the level to spike over 0, or so I've read. After that, I record. My problem is getting a good sound without adding any post-processing. I've read online today that some people suggest when recording gainy amps, to record two tracks, panned far L and R. I guess this creates a nice mix? I haven't tried it yet, but I will tomorrow. What are your suggestions?

 

[Ventura]

Tip No.1
Don't be scared to go big with mids, more than your ears may like... They translate nicely.

Tip No.2
Start at about 1/3 from cone centre and work your way out in small increments of a 1/4" outward till your about 3/4 from centre. Somewhere in there lies the sweetspot. SM57 should be almost touching the grille cloth.

Tip No.3
If you can, use a couple mics or double track.

Tip No.4
Not all drivers in the cab are the same...if you have a 4x12, try Tip No.2 on each one, playback each sample, and you'll find the best driver and its sweetspot. Once you get the cone and its sweetspot - put some tape on the cloth to mark its exact location.

Tip No.5
Record with some steam...don't play this bedroom volume level shit...move some air. It makes a difference in the reflective acoustics coming back into the mic.

V.

 

[PurposeToMelody]

http://www.scribd.com/doc/2067256/Slippermans-Guide

 

[Ventura]

And... CRUCIAL READ:

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/aug07/a ... ording.htm

This one article alone set my foundation in recording properly.

V.

 

[JakeAC5253]

http://www.scribd.com/doc/2067256/Slippermans-Guide

+1

Good read for beginners, you will outgrow it though, reach a point where you branch out to find your sound. Doubling and hard panning tracks is a must to any heavy mix. You can do other stuff past that, but its a good practice to get into otherwise. Get monitors, seriously. Even a beautiful woman would fuck up her makeup looking in a dirty mirror. Track with headroom. Leave at least 6dB on top to allow space for mixing down the road, you will be glad that you did. Everything else is ear training, listen and you will learn what to listen for over time.

 

[Gooseman]

Wow! This is all some detailed advice I'm getting! I am very thankful. I feel like I've just contacted the Jedi Council or something. You all have left me with so much. Thank you, thank you. The mids thing is interesting. With the Roadster, I've been killing the mids a bit. Naturally, the Roadster sounds better with the mids rolled back a bit. I will mess around with that knob and take a listen tomorrow.

I definitely need to get some monitors and another mic. Should I just get another SM57? Or should I save up and get something else? Thanks.

 

[Ventura]

Wow! This is all some detailed advice I'm getting! I am very thankful. I feel like I've just contacted the Jedi Council or something. You all have left me with so much. Thank you, thank you. The mids thing is interesting. With the Roadster, I've been killing the mids a bit. Naturally, the Roadster sounds better with the mids rolled back a bit. I will mess around with that knob and take a listen tomorrow.

I definitely need to get some monitors and another mic. Should I just get another SM57? Or should I save up and get something else? Thanks.

FWIW, I use 2 SM57's as close mic's and 1 Rode NT1000 for the ambient mic (http://www.rodemic.com/microphone.php?product=NT1000); 3 channels at once. Sounds blessed everytime. But in your case, another 57 is dandy, they're cheap and they work amazingly well.

Floor placed mics will definitely pick up more bass (at least they have in my applications), so the lower drivers on a cab will be a bit thicker usually. If you employ 2 SM57's, find a floor driver sweetspot, and a upper driver sweetspot. Proximity to the cone centre gives way to more thick, sizzle, punctuation, articulation, noise, flimsiness, and other characteristics - gotta play with it.

Peace,
V.

 

[Gooseman]

Wow! This is all some detailed advice I'm getting! I am very thankful. I feel like I've just contacted the Jedi Council or something. You all have left me with so much. Thank you, thank you. The mids thing is interesting. With the Roadster, I've been killing the mids a bit. Naturally, the Roadster sounds better with the mids rolled back a bit. I will mess around with that knob and take a listen tomorrow.

I definitely need to get some monitors and another mic. Should I just get another SM57? Or should I save up and get something else? Thanks.

FWIW, I use 2 SM57's as close mic's and 1 Rode NT1000 for the ambient mic (http://www.rodemic.com/microphone.php?product=NT1000); 3 channels at once. Sounds blessed everytime. But in your case, another 57 is dandy, they're cheap and they work amazingly well.

Floor placed mics will definitely pick up more bass (at least they have in my applications), so the lower drivers on a cab will be a bit thicker usually. If you employ 2 SM57's, find a floor driver sweetspot, and a upper driver sweetspot. Proximity to the cone centre gives way to more thick, sizzle, punctuation, articulation, noise, flimsiness, and other characteristics - gotta play with it.

Peace,
V.

I will definitely keep your advice at the forefront of my recording -- thank! I think I might get another SM57, or the Beta version even. I was also looking at the Blue Dragonfly too.

 

[PurposeToMelody]

Read Slippermans guide, its great. I also really like a ribbon mic' close mic'd as well as the typical 57 or 609. I use Fathead II's in the studio.

+1 to all that Jake said!

 

[crankyrayhanky]

(2) 57s can give you great tone- Positionedproperly

 

[Cornfordcrunch]

Best advice-

Ignore what the guitar sounds like solo'd. Worry about what it sounds like in the context of a mix with everything else.

 

[steve_k]

Wow! This is all some detailed advice I'm getting! I am very thankful. I feel like I've just contacted the Jedi Council or something. You all have left me with so much. Thank you, thank you. The mids thing is interesting. With the Roadster, I've been killing the mids a bit. Naturally, the Roadster sounds better with the mids rolled back a bit. I will mess around with that knob and take a listen tomorrow.

I definitely need to get some monitors and another mic. Should I just get another SM57? Or should I save up and get something else? Thanks.

FWIW, I use 2 SM57's as close mic's and 1 Rode NT1000 for the ambient mic (http://www.rodemic.com/microphone.php?product=NT1000); 3 channels at once. Sounds blessed everytime. But in your case, another 57 is dandy, they're cheap and they work amazingly well.

Floor placed mics will definitely pick up more bass (at least they have in my applications), so the lower drivers on a cab will be a bit thicker usually. If you employ 2 SM57's, find a floor driver sweetspot, and a upper driver sweetspot. Proximity to the cone centre gives way to more thick, sizzle, punctuation, articulation, noise, flimsiness, and other characteristics - gotta play with it.

Peace,
V.

Where do you place your ambient mic?

Steve

 

[Ventura]

Wow! This is all some detailed advice I'm getting! I am very thankful. I feel like I've just contacted the Jedi Council or something. You all have left me with so much. Thank you, thank you. The mids thing is interesting. With the Roadster, I've been killing the mids a bit. Naturally, the Roadster sounds better with the mids rolled back a bit. I will mess around with that knob and take a listen tomorrow.

I definitely need to get some monitors and another mic. Should I just get another SM57? Or should I save up and get something else? Thanks.

FWIW, I use 2 SM57's as close mic's and 1 Rode NT1000 for the ambient mic (http://www.rodemic.com/microphone.php?product=NT1000); 3 channels at once. Sounds blessed everytime. But in your case, another 57 is dandy, they're cheap and they work amazingly well.

Floor placed mics will definitely pick up more bass (at least they have in my applications), so the lower drivers on a cab will be a bit thicker usually. If you employ 2 SM57's, find a floor driver sweetspot, and a upper driver sweetspot. Proximity to the cone centre gives way to more thick, sizzle, punctuation, articulation, noise, flimsiness, and other characteristics - gotta play with it.

Peace,
V.

Where do you place your ambient mic?

Steve

Depends, sometimes anywhere between 5 feet or more, has a lot more to do with the angle/offset of the mic than the distance, if that makes sense (is it elevated, is it directly in front, is it in some weird corner of the room, etc.). The usual room I record in is about 12' by 14', and it has damping and so forth... The NT1000 is usually about 4 to 5 feet in front of the amp in question, and about 1.5 feet above the top of the cabinet and angled to pick up a lot of floor bounce and off angle sound from the cab. I've even had it dead centre in the room hanging from the ceiling...it's pretty amazing how much fullness it adds to the mix.

Really depends on the style I'm going after - cleans, clears, semi-dirt to light crunch is one set up, then getting into the gainier styles, it changes. The SM57's are rarely outside any 2 spots on 2 drivers at any given time.

V.

 

[dawnofdreamx97]

1) good hands / great amp / great guitar
2) sm57 / 421
3) neve 1073 dpa mic pre
4) rock n roll.....
5) use your ears...

 

[zee1usa]

I have good results with a Oktava ribbon mic, love the way it sounds!

 

[kasperjensen]

+1 on ignoring what the guitar sounds like solo'ed. Context is everything.

Also... Take the distortion gain up to where you think it's awesome, and then roll it back a notch.

 

[Death by Uberschall]

+1 on ignoring what the guitar sounds like solo'ed. Context is everything.

Also... Take the distortion gain up to where you think it's awesome, and then roll it back a notch.

This^^^

Definitely record with less gain you need to cover mistakes when playing live.
If you make a mistake, go back and fix it.

 

[Ventura]

+1 on ignoring what the guitar sounds like solo'ed. Context is everything.

Also... Take the distortion gain up to where you think it's awesome, and then roll it back a notch.

This^^^

Definitely record with less gain you need to cover mistakes when playing live.
If you make a mistake, go back and fix it.

Yep. What the ears hear isn't what translates to the mic then to the recording. I always find it funny that I'll up the mids, lower the gain, and hit REC and what comes out of the eargoggles is ultimately what I want to hear, but if I dial my amp to the way I like it when played, it sounds (in gainier contexts) fizzy and lacking balls. This is one reason I dig employing an ambient mic, for whatever reason, the ambient seems to capture more of what my ears hear when playing than the close mic 57's. It also has a nice, natural 'verby feel to it, adds another level to the recording, and is just slightly different in its time track so it extends the girth of the recording.

But man, I swear, I've spent more time dialing in my recording set up's than I have playing... This is why I said f-it and bought the Zoom H4n...not as a replacement to hi-def recordings, but just something I can turn on and run when I'm free-playing. It'll track 3 or 4 hours of hi-def on an 8GB card, and that's a lot of time to find tasty nuggets in the playback.

V.

 

[Meathead]

Tip No.1
Don't be scared to go big with mids, more than your ears may like... They translate nicely.

Tip No.2
Start at about 1/3 from cone centre and work your way out in small increments of a 1/4" outward till your about 3/4 from centre. Somewhere in there lies the sweetspot. SM57 should be almost touching the grille cloth.

Tip No.3
If you can, use a couple mics or double track.

Tip No.4
Not all drivers in the cab are the same...if you have a 4x12, try Tip No.2 on each one, playback each sample, and you'll find the best driver and its sweetspot. Once you get the cone and its sweetspot - put some tape on the cloth to mark its exact location.

Tip No.5
Record with some steam...don't play this bedroom volume level shit...move some air. It makes a difference in the reflective acoustics coming back into the mic.

V.

All good advise.

For recording guitars seriously (not just making You Tube clips) I would use three mics, recording them each to a separate channel. I would use my SM57 and e906 up close to the speaker and also my Neumann TLM103, placed far back to grab the sound of the amp in the room
Then at mixdown you have some nice decisions to make.

 

[JakeAC5253]

Too much mids is honky, at the amp that is. I consider a guitar tone to be 'all mids' if the low end is present but not muddy and the high end is clear but not uncomfortable. Establish this and the midrange falls into place. I actually tend to run my rig pretty devoid of mids and further scoop midrange after tracking. Considering that I use V30's and a Maxon OD808 my guitar tone is still 'all mids'. Too much even at times.