Time to change the rig, advice appreciated!

[ibanez4life SZ!]

Hey guys,

It's coming time to make some changes to the 'rig'. I've been playing an Axe FX Standard through a pair of KrK rokit 5's for years now…it got me through undergrad, graduate school, and the first two years of my professional career so far with great tones. However, I've come to the point where I have the following complaints with the setup:

1. I'm beginning to miss the 'in-room' feel/sound I used to have with amps, as opposed to the 'recorded' sound I currently get with my setup

2. While the Axe FX is versatile, the in depth tweaking options it offers are becoming to get a little daunting and discouraging. There are just so many parameters in there that tempt me to look for an 'even better tone' that a session can quickly become more tweaking than playing.

Now, it's important to take into account my playing atmosphere. I am a home owner in a neighborhood with close neighbors, have a full-time job, and am not in a band. Given that, my playing is restricted to 'at home' volumes at nights after work during the weekdays or during the weekends. I'm lucky enough to have a room in the house devoted to my 'guitar stuff', but it is a smaller bedroom, so too high volume can be impractical.

I see two possibilities for a new rig that I think would help my problem:

1. Axe FX --> Matrix Power Amp --> Guitar Cabinet

2. Tube Amplifier (really enjoyed the Mesa Roadster and Mark V previously) --> Guitar Cabinet

With option 1, I feel like I would still be able to maintain the volumes I need no problem, but I'm still concerned with the tweaking aspect of the Axe FX. For anyone that has gone through something similar, did you find that a more 'conventional' setup with the Axe FX helped to dial in tones more easily? I should also mention that I'm more of a 'meat and potatoes' player…I don't use a bunch of amps models or effects…I tend to try to dial in 3-4 basic tones, and that's it.

With option 2, I think it would definitely be more straight forward to dial in my tones and play. The 'in room' feel will obviously be there as well. However, I am concerned about the volume needed to bring these amps to life. I used to love my Mesa amps (Roadster and Mark V) in the past, but I played in a band where I could turn them up and let them breathe. Is there any chance of actually getting an enjoyable playing experience out of amps like this at lower volumes. It's been years since I've dealt with a tube amp, but I recall volume always being a bit of an issue.

Really appreciate you insight!

Eric

 

[lessthan12]

get yourself a real amp and a two notes torpedo live for late night playing and direct recording etc. best of both worlds

 

[rlord1974]

Go try a Mesa Rectoverb 25 head. Report back.

 

[FUZZboat]

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[ibanez4life SZ!]

1. Axe FX --> Mesa Tube Power Amp --> Guitar Cabinet

best of both worlds

I've considered this, but will I not run into the same volume issues as with a full blown tube amp?

 

[barnesjd]

Try a low-wattage (15-20W) tube amp into a quad of low-sensitivity speakers like Greenbacks.

 

[guitarrhino]

I'll be crazy here and state that you should go with some old school single channel amps. I'm running the Fender Twinolux with some pedals and it rocks.

 

[1meanplexi]

Although I think technology has done a fine job of capturing "sounds" I really feel that you cannot replicate the true tone of a tube amp, Solid state or what have you. Nonetheless.....let your ears be the judge. Chip or tubes.....

 

[cardinal]

Something to consider with either set up, is what size cabinet are you happy with? I much prefer the tone of a 4x12 above anything else, at any volume. However, at low volume, a 4x12 still throws off enough bass to be problematic in some situations (still causes lots of vibrations and thumping).

That said, I used the AXFII for a bit with a cheap power amp and a nice-enough cab. I was very underwhelmed. It could be that the cheap power amp killed it, but it was just blown out of the room by an actual tube amp (in my case, a VH4S) and so I sold the AFXII. I currently use a Rev. G Triple Recto and a 4x12 a lot at very low volumes and it's great. The trick IMHO is to bypass the loop to remove the annoying Rectifier fizz. It doesn't seem to be an issue at higher volumes, but at low volumes the loop is doing something terrible to the tone, even if it's not being used. I can't dial in a Mesa Mark to save my life, so I'm useless there.

 

[Mizati20]

Did you get my PM brother? Tellin ya, you would dig a tube power amp with your setup... volume can still be as loud or as quiet as you want with the axe setup... you essentially have the output on the power amp, the level within the preset itself and the level on the front of the axe...

 

[flash6969]

get yourself a real amp and a two notes torpedo live for late night playing and direct recording etc. best of both worlds

What he said! I have several 100 watt tube heads & volume is never an issue

 

[Valtyr]

My home rig is a Marshall JVM1 head and Mesa 1x12 cab. On the low power setting I can crank it at TV volumes. On 1 watt it gets as loud as I care to play at home.

 

[JimmyBlind]

The Matrix power amps are pretty good I think. You'll have to spend quite a lot of money in a tube power amp & it will certainly add it's own colour to the sound. The tube power amp simulation on the AFX is really good I think & you'd have to turn that off while you were playing at home & on while you're recording. When you record, you might have to spend time tweaking the power amp simulation to match your actual power amp & settings. I've heard mixed reviews about the hybrid setup.

My needs are relatively few so I settled with having a wicked all-tube head that I know delivers. I don't have to think about whether my tone sounds decent or not. There's something reliable about that setup. My ears were constantly adjusting when I had my AxeFX & I sometimes lost track of what sounded good or would sound good in a live mix. I found the tonal spectrum almost too vast.
Only bummer is the power of an all-valve amp. I just don't get to take it out of 1st gear nowadays, even though it still sounds awesome. With the Axe, you get the whole tube amp saturation in the simulator without stripping the wallpaper & making the old lady in the apartment downstairs shit her underpants.

If you like having the versatility & aren't perturbed by the lack of organics in your rig, then the AxeFX is a formidable unit. I can't say that I personally didn't show a sigh of relief when I switched back to a valve rig.

 

[mjtripper]

Since you would need the guitar cabinet in either situation I would get the matrix and a cab for now and then add a head at a later date while keeping the axefx. That way you have the best of both worlds and when you are playing the head you can drop the axe into the fx loop and have a third setup. It will let you phase everything in and spread out the cash outlay as well and give you plenty of time to pick which head you want.

 

[GtarLover]

I totally understand being ready for a change after playing through studio monitors for a long while.
I absolutely needed a fix of a LOUD amp/cab set-up to feel the tones again.

That said, the Axe FX is absolutely capable of giving you the tone you are speaking of here.
I have been running mine (Axe FX II) direct to FOH AND through a Matrix into cab(s). It sounds fantastic!!
With this set-up I can get the amp/cab interaction on stage, as well as the direct FOH consistency.
So you can get ALL the tones you want.

The real question is why get a cab and a power amp if you can't turn it up anyway.
I mean you will NEVER have a real cab moving decent amounts of air when it has to be quiet.
The Axe should be able to provide you with great tones at low volumes...however, if you want the "in the room" feel, you will simply need to be louder.
Cabs interact with the power section of an amp and need that power turned up in order to give you that "feeling."
Think Marshall on 10, why, because that's when the synergy happens.
A major intention of models is to give you the same/similar tone at lower volumes, both for recording and low volume playing, yet if you are asking for that "FEEL," then that's power + cab = LOUD.

Don't get me wrong, I understand wanting the feel and tone, yet unless you can turn it up, you may be hard pressed to get both.
The same applies if you get a head and cab, it's a different set-up, but still needs the volume for the interaction between power/cab to take place and get you the "feel.".
Maybe it's time to find a few guys to jam with so you get a chance to turn it up a bit. That's where it's at anyway, right?
Nothing like a little LOUD LIVE MUSIC to get you to that happy place