We should all have neighbors like this

[theNoseBleedKid]

Do you have a problem with me not being ok with people insulting kids with disabilities.

I mean I knew you were low, but really.

Obtain a sense of humor, it's a joke. And retarded (yes, that is a medical term) kids weren't the butt of the joke.

I have a sense of humor. It doesn't revolve around kids with down syndrome. I know I was the target, but I'd appreciate it if there wasn't any negative allusion to poor people without any control over their disabilities.

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

Let me apologize for the lack of reading comprehension, and analytical ability exhibited by the majority on this site. Also, I would like to state that America has taken a definite turn for the worst, becoming a much more violent, materialistic, hypocritical, nation of individuals. This is exhibited by the permutation of Jesus Christ as gun toting, money loving, unforgiving, god of the republican party! WWJD? "Turn, then shoot the crook in the back!" This is the new "turn the other cheek!"

OK wait what? This is a RELIGIOUS debate now?

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

1. You don't live in the US - I think we're both happy about that.

This is relevant why?

2. You don't understand US laws.

Never claimed to ahve anything close to a perfect understanding of any laws. I doubt many living IN the US do either.

3. You've obviously never been assaulted by someone with the intent to harm you or your family.

Plain wrong.

4. You haven't learned that no one cares about your opinion at all.

If they didn't care they wouldn't respond.

Our constitution provides us the right to domestic tranquility, and the right to protect ourselves, family and property. We essentially have the right to not be victimized by lawless people. Our country was also founded on personal responsibility (which I don't expect you to understand since you live in a socialist country).

Wow Australia is socialist now? Thats new to me, how exactly?

Point is you ahve that right, but a constitutional document doesn't necesitate to a real life application, dig?

The illegal alien/criminals made the decision to break the law. Mr. Horn made the decision to confront them under the protection of Texas law. At least one of the criminals moved toward him and both were killed. Horn was cleared of all charges by the legal system. The only break down of our system seems to be that the criminals were in the country to begin with. The criminals started the whole process with their decision to break the law - they are responsible for their own deaths. The only person who told Horn not to go out was the 911 operator (not the police as you consistantly claim), who has zero authority and is in no way qualified to dispense legal advise especially in light of the fact that Horn's actions were justified under Texas law.

I'm not debating the legality of his actions. For the tenth time. Seriously, READ my responses THAN put your 2 cents in, k?

I like a good debate as well as the next guy, but there is no debate here - just the facts as stated and people's differing opinions. Your twisting banter doesn't change the facts of the case and your opinion that we are all "murder lovers" or what not is humorous and stupid. I only hope that you never are threatened by someone with ill intent and have to make a self defense choice since in your country you are denied access to basic self defense tools. Maybe you could try wearing a helmet...

I'm not attempting to change the facts of the case. Stating opinions and responses is debate. Again it's great to see you making incorrect presumptions about someone you've never met (oh and I do see the irony here, before someone goes to point it out).

No need for basic self defense tools here, we are more free and unencumbered by fear of out fellow citizens.

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

Personally, the thing about this case that troubles me is not that the homeowner killed 2 felons. It is the homeowner's statements to the 911 operator which seemed to indicate that he was intent on using his weapon before he even left the house. I can't judge his actions because I wasn't in his position, and he may have made statements in the heat of the moment that were a result of stress and adrenaline more than his actual intent, but I didn't like the sound of that call at all.

DId you read the link I posted a page back, he said a lot of very interesting things in the interview.

 

[Odin]

Do you have a problem with me not being ok with people insulting kids with disabilities.

I mean I knew you were low, but really.

Obtain a sense of humor, it's a joke. And retarded (yes, that is a medical term) kids weren't the butt of the joke.

I have a sense of humor. It doesn't revolve around kids with down syndrome. I know I was the target, but I'd appreciate it if there wasn't any negative allusion to poor people without any control over their disabilities.

In other words, you don't want me making fun of you?

 

[ratter]

Personally, the thing about this case that troubles me is not that the homeowner killed 2 felons. It is the homeowner's statements to the 911 operator which seemed to indicate that he was intent on using his weapon before he even left the house. I can't judge his actions because I wasn't in his position, and he may have made statements in the heat of the moment that were a result of stress and adrenaline more than his actual intent, but I didn't like the sound of that call at all.

Regardless, even if he went outside with the intent on executing the felons in an act of vigilante justice, if the situation developed into one where he felt threatened by those felons then his actions would then be justified, even if he needlessly placed himself in the situation.

Entirely too much attention has been given to this case. Each year in this country thousands of innocent law abiding citizens are assaulted, stabbed, robbed, shot, raped, and killed by criminals and we rarely see much discussion about their plight. Many people appear to have more sympathy for the felons than the innocent citizens. This case was a less than ideal and questionable case of self defense, but in the end it ended with no innocent people harmed.

Therein lies my problem with this whole scenario. It ended with no innocent people harmed, but maybe only because of dumb luck. This guy sounded like he felt emboldened by the TX property-deadly force laws - emboldened to the point that he did something incredibly stupid.

I have zero sympathy for any felons, but I hope that the TX laws don't regularly encourage people to do stupid things. While you may be perfectly within your rights to stop a fleeing robber with deadly force, the smart thing for an ordinary citizen to do when the see a robber fleeing, is to let them flee and call the police. That little bit of jewelry or cash isn't worth risking your life over, even if it is your right to do so. On top of that, I'd hate to be the guy that shoots the robber and then the political tide turns and you find yourself being made an example of. So great, the bad guys are dead woohoo, but now you're in jail.

 

[Odin]

Personally, the thing about this case that troubles me is not that the homeowner killed 2 felons. It is the homeowner's statements to the 911 operator which seemed to indicate that he was intent on using his weapon before he even left the house. I can't judge his actions because I wasn't in his position, and he may have made statements in the heat of the moment that were a result of stress and adrenaline more than his actual intent, but I didn't like the sound of that call at all.

Regardless, even if he went outside with the intent on executing the felons in an act of vigilante justice, if the situation developed into one where he felt threatened by those felons then his actions would then be justified, even if he needlessly placed himself in the situation.

Entirely too much attention has been given to this case. Each year in this country thousands of innocent law abiding citizens are assaulted, stabbed, robbed, shot, raped, and killed by criminals and we rarely see much discussion about their plight. Many people appear to have more sympathy for the felons than the innocent citizens. This case was a less than ideal and questionable case of self defense, but in the end it ended with no innocent people harmed.

Therein lies my problem with this whole scenario. It ended with no innocent people harmed, but maybe only because of dumb luck. This guy sounded like he felt emboldened by the TX property-deadly force laws - emboldened to the point that he did something incredibly stupid.

I have zero sympathy for any felons, but I hope that the TX laws don't regularly encourage people to do stupid things. While you may be perfectly within your rights to stop a fleeing robber with deadly force, the smart thing for an ordinary citizen to do when the see a robber fleeing, is to let them flee and call the police. That little bit of jewelry or cash isn't worth risking your life over, even if it is your right to do so. On top of that, I'd hate to be the guy that shoots the robber and then the political tide turns and you find yourself being made an example of. So great, the bad guys are dead woohoo, but now you're in jail.

Yep, this case could have gone either way for Horn. In Travis County (San Fran Austin) he would have been charged, but pretty much anywhere else in the state he's going to get the benefit of the doubt. But if he had been charged a jury probably would have acquitted him since most Texans have very little sympathy for illegal alien felons and juries are prone to give homeowners a lot of leeway in defending their property.

If it were me I don't see myself taking the same actions that Horn took, but those types of situations are dynamic and in 2 seconds I could find myself in a similar situation. I'd like to hope that I could resolve it without shooting 2 guys but until you're there you don't know.

 

[amiller]

The guy shot two people IN THE BACK!!! as they were running away from a house where NO one was home...

 

[nbarts]

This is not just about property.

If someone shipped you a package & it was sitting in front of your door & someone stole it, that would be about property.


In this case this is about

braking & entering
violating other people's privacy & peace
.....
and sometime after this about property

yea, the guy seems to be very excited to shoot someone, but he had a good reason

 

[nbarts]

It doesn't surprise me that this fat, piece of shit neighbor had nothing better to do than play god and take the life of two illegal alien thieves. Anyone with morals would sacrifice property for a mans life. Texas is a state full of Bush loving, republican, pro death penalty, godless, soulless, materialistic fucks and should be avoided at all cost!

 

[Jordon]

Random crap throught thread.

You, sir, are an ignorant fool. Someone disagrees with your viewpoint, and you latch onto that. People will disagree. So be it.

You don't live here, this case, the laws, the crimes and the individuals have no impact on you. Period.

You cannot force your views on someone else. You scream for facts, then spew random bullshit in the next sentence.

Go look up the serenity prayer from Alcoholics Anonymous and recite it to yourself. Trust me, it applies to you.


And yes, I have read the entire thread. And I do have my own viewpoints on the subject. They are just that: mine and no one elses. I do not feel compelled to voice them, as it is pointless. I do, however, care when someone tries to force their own views onto others as you seem to do in every politically-charged thread.

Get off your high horse.

 

[badger71]

Two crooks got what they deserved. Horn knew there should be only one side of the story to tell in this instance...his....kudos Mr. Horn.

Illegal immigrants having rights in this country....please....again, what part of illegal can't people understand....they've already started off on the wrong foot in this country as criminals. National laws should reflect this with severe punitive consequences.

Somewhere down the road, this country lost its way. Too many laws protecting the guilty/criminals....too many citizens punished financially for the woes of illegal immigrants....too many working citizens supporting the lazy....too much "softness" in the political system to make significant changes. Such a shame.

 

[redrol]

the only thing I have to add is that america is and was founded from people from other countries, that is what makes our country the best

 

[badger71]

the only thing I have to add is that america is and was founded from people from other countries, that is what makes our country the best

Exactly. These people wanted to become Americans....they went through the process and became just that....U.S. citizens. Some of these people, my anscestors included, took up arms against their former country because this was their country now. That was the root of their convictions. I don't see that same desire to become a citizen or national pride/patriotism to this country when I drive through So Cal now and see other "colors" on flagpoles....didn't see it when I was delivering welfare checks to illegals during my 8 year employment in the Postal Service. I certainly don't see it when some U.S. trained athlete....developed, schooled, and nurtured by our coaches/system....suddenly feels some conviction to play for the country of their ethnicity.

 

[badger71]

Oh yeah....Mr. Horn....you are welcome to be my next door neighbor anytime you'd like.

 

[nbarts]

What does this have to do with immigration, constitution or the US?
I can’t think of a country where one breaking into somebody else’s home doesn’t deserve a bullet in his head.

 

[Odin]

What does this have to do with immigration, constitution or the US?
I can’t think of a country where one breaking into somebody else’s home doesn’t deserve a bullet in his head.

I agree. These illegal alien felons mistake was that they chose to break into someone's house in a state where a bullet to the head is not uncommon for burglars.

Any person, certainly any person in Texas, knows damn well that if you trespass and break in to someone's house and steal from them that there is a very real and likely possibility that citizens will fight back with force, including deadly force.

In other words, breaking into a home and stealing from it was a very, very stupid decision that these guys knew, or should have known, could possibly result in incarceration, injury, and/or death. Knowing all of that, they still chose to proceed. And they died as a direct result of their choices and actions.

Every day people do stupid things and end up getting injured or killed as a result. And nobody makes a big deal out of it.

If I walked into the tiger cage at the zoo wearing a meat suit and poking the tigers with a big stick, and as a result I got mauled and eaten, would there be a big deal made of it? I mean, poking a cat with a stick is mean, but does it really deserve the death penalty? Should I be murdered just because I poked a cat with a stick? The answer, of course, is that it's my choice and I know the potential for danger, so if I proceed then I have only myself to blame.

 

[CharFace]

 

[SeaDog]

1. You don't live in the US - I think we're both happy about that.

This is relevant why?
Because you obviously condesend to the Americans here on this board.

2. You don't understand US laws.

Never claimed to ahve anything close to a perfect understanding of any laws. I doubt many living IN the US do either.

3. You've obviously never been assaulted by someone with the intent to harm you or your family.

Plain wrong.
Perhaps I am, but your comments leave that impression.

4. You haven't learned that no one cares about your opinion at all.

If they didn't care they wouldn't respond.
For the same reason you respond.

Our constitution provides us the right to domestic tranquility, and the right to protect ourselves, family and property. We essentially have the right to not be victimized by lawless people. Our country was also founded on personal responsibility (which I don't expect you to understand since you live in a socialist country).

Wow Australia is socialist now? Thats new to me, how exactly?

Point is you ahve that right, but a constitutional document doesn't necesitate to a real life application, dig?

I was using satire with the socialist country joke, perhaps you've heard of it. Point is you're absolutely wrong about a constitutional document. Ours dictates the basic freedoms and rights in real life applications every day and with every court decision, I don't see how you don't get that.

The illegal alien/criminals made the decision to break the law. Mr. Horn made the decision to confront them under the protection of Texas law. At least one of the criminals moved toward him and both were killed. Horn was cleared of all charges by the legal system. The only break down of our system seems to be that the criminals were in the country to begin with. The criminals started the whole process with their decision to break the law - they are responsible for their own deaths. The only person who told Horn not to go out was the 911 operator (not the police as you consistantly claim), who has zero authority and is in no way qualified to dispense legal advise especially in light of the fact that Horn's actions were justified under Texas law.

I'm not debating the legality of his actions. For the tenth time. Seriously, READ my responses THAN put your 2 cents in, k?

Doesn't the fact that you referred to the members of this community as murder lovers imply that you consider this a murder case? Are you implying that we love murder in a moral sense rathar than a legal sense? I think we love the safety of our life, property and community more than the rights of criminals, so if you choose to victimize us you may find we will protect our "space", which is perfectly natural and moral.

I like a good debate as well as the next guy, but there is no debate here - just the facts as stated and people's differing opinions. Your twisting banter doesn't change the facts of the case and your opinion that we are all "murder lovers" or what not is humorous and stupid. I only hope that you never are threatened by someone with ill intent and have to make a self defense choice since in your country you are denied access to basic self defense tools. Maybe you could try wearing a helmet...

I'm not attempting to change the facts of the case. Stating opinions and responses is debate. Again it's great to see you making incorrect presumptions about someone you've never met (oh and I do see the irony here, before someone goes to point it out).

No need for basic self defense tools here, we are more free and unencumbered by fear of out fellow citizens.

So you don't care about the legal or factual information in the case, but rathar you are offended by the moral issues of this man killing two other men, when in your opinion he had no cause or right? If that is your opinion then fair enough, but most Americans aren't going to lose much sleep over this guys actions. We are tired of being the "melting pot" for every two bit thug that wants to sneak into this country and commit crimes. If you live in a world where these things make no sense to you, then perhaps you are the lucky one.

 

[theNoseBleedKid]

Because you obviously condesend to the Americans here on this board.

I condescend to a lot of people, a lot of people condescend to me. Place of birth is irrelevant.

Perhaps I am, but your comments leave that impression.

Your mistaken completely. Sometimes NOT making presumptions is totally rad too!

For the same reason you respond.

I respond because I care. Sometimes about things unrealted to Joe Horn, but there is still a care factor.

I was using satire with the socialist country joke, perhaps you've heard of it. Point is you're absolutely wrong about a constitutional document. Ours dictates the basic freedoms and rights in real life applications every day and with every court decision, I don't see how you don't get that.

Maybe you should indicate when your making a joke! Since the rest of your responses didn't come accross as jokes! No, your document tells you what you have a right to get, but that doesn't always necessarily happen. Like when you get robbed for instance. Constitution doesn't prevent that from happening.

Doesn't the fact that you referred to the members of this community as murder lovers imply that you consider this a murder case? Are you implying that we love murder in a moral sense rathar than a legal sense? I think we love the safety of our life, property and community more than the rights of criminals, so if you choose to victimize us you may find we will protect our "space", which is perfectly natural and moral.

I consider his actions cold blooded killing (or murder), but not illegal. I consider those that make him to be a hero in love with cold blooded killing, there is no illegality in their support. I never said that. I'm not victimising you at all. This is the internet, it's hard to victimize ANYONE.

So you don't care about the legal or factual information in the case

I certianly care about the facts. I'd agree I don't know them all.

but rathar you are offended by the moral issues of this man killing two other men, when in your opinion he had no cause or right?

Right is such an annoying word. I don't think the punishment fits the crime. To me it's immoral to kill two people for that.

If that is your opinion then fair enough, but most Americans aren't going to lose much sleep over this guys actions.

Neither am I, that doesn't mean I approve.

We are tired of being the "melting pot" for every two bit thug that wants to sneak into this country and commit crimes. If you live in a world where these things make no sense to you, then perhaps you are the lucky one.

I am lucky.