Which Amp?

  • Thread starter Thread starter MistaGuitah
  • Start date Start date

I Picked This One

  • Friedman BE-100

    Votes: 10 62.5%
  • Smallbox

    Votes: 6 37.5%

  • Total voters
    16
Just like to add, I had a Bogner Shiva 20th and a Mesa ElectraDyne at one time. On the same cab if I boosted the ElectraDyne with a BB Preamp I got them to sound scary close to each other. The Mesa had a lot more low end but the Shiva Excursion knob could make up for it. The ElectraDyne drawback is just it's lack of modern features and it's LOUD as all hell. It lacks preamp gain stock but a pedal like a BB Preamp wakes it up. I liked the Shiva 20th though a lot, right now all I have is a Mesa Mark IV. And when I had a Fractal AX8 all I did was try to get it to sound like the Mark IV, which it couldn't do exactly, close but no cigar.
 
danyeo":lyk3s5wq said:
Just like to add, I had a Bogner Shiva 20th and a Mesa ElectraDyne at one time. On the same cab if I boosted the ElectraDyne with a BB Preamp I got them to sound scary close to each other. The Mesa had a lot more low end but the Shiva Excursion knob could make up for it. The ElectraDyne drawback is just it's lack of modern features and it's LOUD as all hell. It lacks preamp gain stock but a pedal like a BB Preamp wakes it up. I liked the Shiva 20th though a lot, right now all I have is a Mesa Mark IV. And when I had a Fractal AX8 all I did was try to get it to sound like the Mark IV, which it couldn't do exactly, close but no cigar.

I'd love to try an Electra Dyne, but LOUD isn't a luxury I have at the moment. They sound like my cup of tea. Loved the Stiletto, owned it twice.
 
Thank you for all of your suggestions. In the end I got lucky and got enough money to get a Friedman BE-100. I'm not certain if I will regret not getting the Smallbox which I like very much, but it seems better to have an amp that doesn't need pedals. This wasn't in the options I listed but it was because I was already leaning towards the Smallbox.
 
If I had to pick just off the list I'd go with the small box.. Great amps
 
dogman":38eem9v1 said:
If I had to pick just off the list I'd go with the small box.. Great amps

Oh man I was really liking the Smallbox but went with the BE-100 after all because I didn't want to have limited gain. I just hope it will be as satisfying as the Smallbox on the clean side.
 
MistaGuitah":3ir453qr said:
dogman":3ir453qr said:
If I had to pick just off the list I'd go with the small box.. Great amps

Oh man I was really liking the Smallbox but went with the BE-100 after all because I didn't want to have limited gain. I just hope it will be as satisfying as the Smallbox on the clean side.

I hear ya. If I had to pick off the list the small box would work but I think my next amp is going to be the BE-50. Those things are just insanely monstrous.
 
MistaGuitah":3lv9bv5g said:
Oh man I was really liking the Smallbox but went with the BE-100 after all because I didn't want to have limited gain. I just hope it will be as satisfying as the Smallbox on the clean side.
The BE100 is a badass amp, congrats :rock:
I don't think you'll be disappointed. The BE / HBE side is mind-blowingly good.
The tone stack on the clean side of the BE100 is basically a Vox AC30.
If that doesn't float your boat, it's dead easy to convert it to a Fender Deluxe.
Swap out 2 film caps + a silver mica, and change the treble pot to 250k = done. :thumbsup:
You can also sub in a 6.8k resistor for that classic Fender chime, or stay with the 10k that's in there for more mids. The wiring of the bass / treble pots changes slightly, but you get the idea.
Just did mine, and I'm diggin' it.
I went with the 6.8k.
Amps is perfect now ( at least for me, anyway ;) )
 
fusedbrain":123mtw4j said:
MistaGuitah":123mtw4j said:
Oh man I was really liking the Smallbox but went with the BE-100 after all because I didn't want to have limited gain. I just hope it will be as satisfying as the Smallbox on the clean side.
The BE100 is a badass amp, congrats :rock:
I don't think you'll be disappointed. The BE / HBE side is mind-blowingly good.
The tone stack on the clean side of the BE100 is basically a Vox AC30.
If that doesn't float your boat, it's dead easy to convert it to a Fender Deluxe.
Swap out 2 film caps + a silver mica, and change the treble pot to 250k = done. :thumbsup:
You can also sub in a 6.8k resistor for that classic Fender chime, or stay with the 10k that's in there for more mids. The wiring of the bass / treble pots changes slightly, but you get the idea.
Just did mine, and I'm diggin' it.
I went with the 6.8k.
Amps is perfect now ( at least for me, anyway ;) )

Thanks. This gives me a good idea. Now I wonder if Friedman can modify the clean channel to the Buxom Betty like the BE50 has. Well, I'll have to see how I like the cleans on the BE first. I'd be surprised if the BE clean isn't very good.
 
ChurchHill":3bkcdgu4 said:
Well, first, I'd say don't count out the 20th Shiva because it doesn't use EL34s. I've heard, too, that the ones that do don't really have the magic that the KT88 version does. I'm usually an EL34 guy, too, but I don't miss them at all in my KT88 20th Shiva. It has all the cut and all the juicy mids. Honestly, if I didn't know that it wasn't EL34, I probably wouldn't know the difference. Anyway...

You mentioned the character of the JP2C vs the Mark V and I think that's a really good point. For me, I'd take character over versatility, but I also have more than a few amps. So, I think that part of your decision is deciding if you want something that has character or a jack of all trades. There are valid reasons for both...

Which leads me to ask, what kind of band are you wanting to start? If it's strictly a cover band that plays everything from George Jones to Slayer, a jack of all trades would likely be a good thing (if you're going for authenticity). If you're interested in finding your own sound (even if you're still only playing covers) or if you're wanting to play some or all original music, maybe a character amp would be better. Of course, that also adds the complication of whether or not the character of the amp fits your character and style. Mesas aren't Marshalls, Bogners aren't Friedmans, and Diezels are, well, Diezels. Some of them work for some players and some don't. That doesn't make one better or worse than the other, just different.

Another point to consider would be what your role in the band would be. Great rhythm amps aren't always great lead amps and vice versa. However, some are. If there's going to be another guitarist, you might want to consider what they'll be playing through and find something to compliment it. Something that sounds thin on its own often works much better in the context of a band, especially with multiple guitarists. On the other hand, being the only guitarist in a three-piece allows for a lot more room for the amp to fill.

You're likely right about regretting not having one after deciding on another... I think we're all afflicted with that disease here to a greater or lesser extent. You might want to consider looking at used options, too. That might allow you to sample multiple flavors within your current budget and it's usually easier to recoup more of your expenditure if you later decide to sell.

As far as reliability goes, within your list, I don't think you've got much to worry about. While it's true that some are better than others, they should all perform reliably unless you're overly abusive. Everyone builds a lemon every once in a while, but none of these companies got to where they are without having more great customer service days than terrible ones.

Anyway, I doubt any of this really makes your decision any easier, and this is all just my opinions, but I will say this. Try not to obsess too much and just pick one. Based on your list, you're not going to be terribly disappointed in any of them. I went through 7 or 8 amps until I found one that I was truly happy with (and I still have it), and I've probably been through at least 50 amps at this point. Some have stayed for awhile, some couldn't leave fast enough, but a lot of them are still around just because they all have one thing that they do better than everything else and they allow me to speak through them in a way I want to hear.

Sounds like the OP made his decision, but just had to say after reading the above post that this is some GREAT advice right here! Well spoken :thumbsup:

I'm sure the BE-100 is gonna be sick, but just wanted to say after the fact that the D60 is a budget friendly and amazingly versatile amp with unmatched articulation and awesome tones. The beauty of it is that its such a simple amp too and doesn't have a bazillion knobs and features to distract a guy; unless that's your thing of course.
 
MetalHeadMike":1cyfnvlp said:
ChurchHill":1cyfnvlp said:
Well, first, I'd say don't count out the 20th Shiva because it doesn't use EL34s. I've heard, too, that the ones that do don't really have the magic that the KT88 version does. I'm usually an EL34 guy, too, but I don't miss them at all in my KT88 20th Shiva. It has all the cut and all the juicy mids. Honestly, if I didn't know that it wasn't EL34, I probably wouldn't know the difference. Anyway...

You mentioned the character of the JP2C vs the Mark V and I think that's a really good point. For me, I'd take character over versatility, but I also have more than a few amps. So, I think that part of your decision is deciding if you want something that has character or a jack of all trades. There are valid reasons for both...

Which leads me to ask, what kind of band are you wanting to start? If it's strictly a cover band that plays everything from George Jones to Slayer, a jack of all trades would likely be a good thing (if you're going for authenticity). If you're interested in finding your own sound (even if you're still only playing covers) or if you're wanting to play some or all original music, maybe a character amp would be better. Of course, that also adds the complication of whether or not the character of the amp fits your character and style. Mesas aren't Marshalls, Bogners aren't Friedmans, and Diezels are, well, Diezels. Some of them work for some players and some don't. That doesn't make one better or worse than the other, just different.

Another point to consider would be what your role in the band would be. Great rhythm amps aren't always great lead amps and vice versa. However, some are. If there's going to be another guitarist, you might want to consider what they'll be playing through and find something to compliment it. Something that sounds thin on its own often works much better in the context of a band, especially with multiple guitarists. On the other hand, being the only guitarist in a three-piece allows for a lot more room for the amp to fill.

You're likely right about regretting not having one after deciding on another... I think we're all afflicted with that disease here to a greater or lesser extent. You might want to consider looking at used options, too. That might allow you to sample multiple flavors within your current budget and it's usually easier to recoup more of your expenditure if you later decide to sell.

As far as reliability goes, within your list, I don't think you've got much to worry about. While it's true that some are better than others, they should all perform reliably unless you're overly abusive. Everyone builds a lemon every once in a while, but none of these companies got to where they are without having more great customer service days than terrible ones.

Anyway, I doubt any of this really makes your decision any easier, and this is all just my opinions, but I will say this. Try not to obsess too much and just pick one. Based on your list, you're not going to be terribly disappointed in any of them. I went through 7 or 8 amps until I found one that I was truly happy with (and I still have it), and I've probably been through at least 50 amps at this point. Some have stayed for awhile, some couldn't leave fast enough, but a lot of them are still around just because they all have one thing that they do better than everything else and they allow me to speak through them in a way I want to hear.

Sounds like the OP made his decision, but just had to say after reading the above post that this is some GREAT advice right here! Well spoken :thumbsup:

I'm sure the BE-100 is gonna be sick, but just wanted to say after the fact that the D60 is a budget friendly and amazingly versatile amp with unmatched articulation and awesome tones. The beauty of it is that its such a simple amp too and doesn't have a bazillion knobs and features to distract a guy; unless that's your thing of course.

I meant to respond to Churchill's point earlier and forgot. The reason I never started a band before is because I wanted to blow everyone away with my guitar ability. It took years to finally realize that I just don't have that special talent. I've developed some proficiency over the years, but there are a thousand Youtube players that would make me look like a newb. Therefore, I'm not so much into gear that I let it distract from what I'm trying to accomplish. Therefore I settled on the idea that I need to cover songs that I can play with 100% confidence.

The kind of covers I'll be doing are anything from Pink Floyd and Styx to Megadeth, Lamb of God and Amon Amarth. Mostly in the realm of rock. I don't have 7 or 8 string guitars. I keep two guitars down-tuned to D with .10-.46 gauge strings. Sometimes I get away with downtuning to C for Katatonia and At The Gates stuff, but nothing that I think the BE can't handle.

That's pretty much it. The options these days are mind blowing. Any decision you make leads to some regret, or lament that you cannot afford to have all the amps you want. I can't do Dual Rectifier tones with the BE, nor can I get those Dirty Shirley tones. I wish I could have all three, but it seems from what I've played of it that the BE can do it all convincingly enough for a cover band.
 
MistaGuitah":2ffcjkyu said:
fusedbrain":2ffcjkyu said:
MistaGuitah":2ffcjkyu said:
Oh man I was really liking the Smallbox but went with the BE-100 after all because I didn't want to have limited gain. I just hope it will be as satisfying as the Smallbox on the clean side.
The BE100 is a badass amp, congrats :rock:
I don't think you'll be disappointed. The BE / HBE side is mind-blowingly good.
The tone stack on the clean side of the BE100 is basically a Vox AC30.
If that doesn't float your boat, it's dead easy to convert it to a Fender Deluxe.
Swap out 2 film caps + a silver mica, and change the treble pot to 250k = done. :thumbsup:
You can also sub in a 6.8k resistor for that classic Fender chime, or stay with the 10k that's in there for more mids. The wiring of the bass / treble pots changes slightly, but you get the idea.
Just did mine, and I'm diggin' it.
I went with the 6.8k.
Amps is perfect now ( at least for me, anyway ;) )

Thanks. This gives me a good idea. Now I wonder if Friedman can modify the clean channel to the Buxom Betty like the BE50 has. Well, I'll have to see how I like the cleans on the BE first. I'd be surprised if the BE clean isn't very good.
The BE100 clean is quite good, but it is it's own thing. I was looking for more chime, so I made the adjustment.
I was just trying to point out that getting the clean channel to sound how you want is not a big deal. The BE/HBE is the money channel, and if you need gain without using pedals, you made the right choice vs the Smallbox.
I also think that the Structure switch on the newer BE's was a game changer. With the S switch set to the lowest gain setting and the gain control turned up a bit, the low gain, crunchy / plexi sounds are fantastic. On the older versions, all you could do was turn the gain knob way down, and the amp lost the mojo.
Dave can basically do anything you want as far as a different clean channels go. The only thing to keep in mind is the BE100 clean doesn't have a mid control, so you have to set the mids with that 6.8k / 10k resistor, or install a new knob / switch on the front panel.
 
fusedbrain":jwivn6ru said:
MistaGuitah":jwivn6ru said:
fusedbrain":jwivn6ru said:
MistaGuitah":jwivn6ru said:
Oh man I was really liking the Smallbox but went with the BE-100 after all because I didn't want to have limited gain. I just hope it will be as satisfying as the Smallbox on the clean side.
The BE100 is a badass amp, congrats :rock:
I don't think you'll be disappointed. The BE / HBE side is mind-blowingly good.
The tone stack on the clean side of the BE100 is basically a Vox AC30.
If that doesn't float your boat, it's dead easy to convert it to a Fender Deluxe.
Swap out 2 film caps + a silver mica, and change the treble pot to 250k = done. :thumbsup:
You can also sub in a 6.8k resistor for that classic Fender chime, or stay with the 10k that's in there for more mids. The wiring of the bass / treble pots changes slightly, but you get the idea.
Just did mine, and I'm diggin' it.
I went with the 6.8k.
Amps is perfect now ( at least for me, anyway ;) )

Thanks. This gives me a good idea. Now I wonder if Friedman can modify the clean channel to the Buxom Betty like the BE50 has. Well, I'll have to see how I like the cleans on the BE first. I'd be surprised if the BE clean isn't very good.
The BE100 clean is quite good, but it is it's own thing. I was looking for more chime, so I made the adjustment.
I was just trying to point out that getting the clean channel to sound how you want is not a big deal. The BE/HBE is the money channel, and if you need gain without using pedals, you made the right choice vs the Smallbox.
I also think that the Structure switch on the newer BE's was a game changer. With the S switch set to the lowest gain setting and the gain control turned up a bit, the low gain, crunchy / plexi sounds are fantastic. On the older versions, all you could do was turn the gain knob way down, and the amp lost the mojo.
Dave can basically do anything you want as far as a different clean channels go. The only thing to keep in mind is the BE100 clean doesn't have a mid control, so you have to set the mids with that 6.8k / 10k resistor, or install a new knob / switch on the front panel.

How Fendery can an amp be with EL34 tubes? Now this has got me wondering if people ever modified their Fenders to use EL34s.
 
You would probably really like the Diezel Lil Fokker for sale on the classifieds section here on rig talk. I own one as well as a modded Dual rec, BE100, Quickrod & KSR Ares. All great amps but if you like in your face mids, awesome cleans, El34s and a mix of modern and classic rock then the Fokker is a great choice. Not many clips out there that do the amp justice but it has more mids and oomph than all my amps fwiw.
 
MYDEMISE":1je5utql said:
You would probably really like the Diezel Lil Fokker for sale on the classifieds section here on rig talk. I own one as well as a modded Dual rec, BE100, Quickrod & KSR Ares. All great amps but if you like in your face mids, awesome cleans, El34s and a mix of modern and classic rock then the Fokker is a great choice. Not many clips out there that do the amp justice but it has more mids and oomph than all my amps fwiw.

I love that amp! Yes I know it very well. I owned one for a while but replaced it with a VH4. Now the VH2 is out. Unfortunately, the VH2 is still a rather big and heavy amp so there's no advantage to it for me. I do miss the Fokker quite a lot.
 
MistaGuitah":2672zan6 said:
MYDEMISE":2672zan6 said:
You would probably really like the Diezel Lil Fokker for sale on the classifieds section here on rig talk. I own one as well as a modded Dual rec, BE100, Quickrod & KSR Ares. All great amps but if you like in your face mids, awesome cleans, El34s and a mix of modern and classic rock then the Fokker is a great choice. Not many clips out there that do the amp justice but it has more mids and oomph than all my amps fwiw.

I love that amp! Yes I know it very well. I owned one for a while but replaced it with a VH4. Now the VH2 is out. Unfortunately, the VH2 is still a rather big and heavy amp so there's no advantage to it for me. I do miss the Fokker quite a lot.

What happened to the Astoria?
 
napalmdeath":3d77u3kc said:
MistaGuitah":3d77u3kc said:
MYDEMISE":3d77u3kc said:
You would probably really like the Diezel Lil Fokker for sale on the classifieds section here on rig talk. I own one as well as a modded Dual rec, BE100, Quickrod & KSR Ares. All great amps but if you like in your face mids, awesome cleans, El34s and a mix of modern and classic rock then the Fokker is a great choice. Not many clips out there that do the amp justice but it has more mids and oomph than all my amps fwiw.

I love that amp! Yes I know it very well. I owned one for a while but replaced it with a VH4. Now the VH2 is out. Unfortunately, the VH2 is still a rather big and heavy amp so there's no advantage to it for me. I do miss the Fokker quite a lot.

What happened to the Astoria?

I don't use one of those. You must have me confused with someone else. You're probably remembering vaguely that I inquired about them being discontinued.
 
MistaGuitah":3en0umne said:
How Fendery can an amp be with EL34 tubes? Now this has got me wondering if people ever modified their Fenders to use EL34s.
Sure! Tweeds moreso than Blackface, but those, too. I don't have one at the moment, but have played a number of Bassman heads and combos, a few Deluxes, and a Super Reverb that used EL34s. Slightly stronger mids, slightly softer bass, but not too terribly different.
 
ChurchHill":1k6fj7tg said:
MistaGuitah":1k6fj7tg said:
How Fendery can an amp be with EL34 tubes? Now this has got me wondering if people ever modified their Fenders to use EL34s.
Sure! Tweeds moreso than Blackface, but those, too. I don't have one at the moment, but have played a number of Bassman heads and combos, a few Deluxes, and a Super Reverb that used EL34s. Slightly stronger mids, slightly softer bass, but not too terribly different.

Interesting. I'm going to have to look for some Youtube vids of something like that. One of my favorite Fenders is the 57 Deluxe so it would be cool to hear what that would sound like with EL34s.
 
MYDEMISE":1eezt9ea said:
You would probably really like the Diezel Lil Fokker for sale on the classifieds section here on rig talk. I own one as well as a modded Dual rec, BE100, Quickrod & KSR Ares. All great amps but if you like in your face mids, awesome cleans, El34s and a mix of modern and classic rock then the Fokker is a great choice. Not many clips out there that do the amp justice but it has more mids and oomph than all my amps fwiw.


Wow! More mids and oomph than the Quickrod? Man I just picked up a drop B+ QR and the mids are insane, in a good way. The mids on the Ares I have are utterly vulgar too :rock: I almost picked up a Fokker but wound up with this QR and a 20th anniversary Shiva this week and am loving them both so far, but I think I need to give the Fokker a shot in the near future.
 
I just hate this shit. Which expensive amp is good for me? I say buy a JCM800 and crank it up.
 
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