Wizard MTL Mk2 tones

[anomaly]

I agree with you on all about that Catch 33 tone. Not a polite tone to me. My favorite songs by Meshuggah were on other albums though, so I guess I overlooked it in terms of sound

The production on Catch 33 is really good. Better than their later albums I think. The first half of the record is slow for sure, but it picks up and has an great ending to it.

 

[anomaly]

I agree. That’s why I get so turned off when amps are either too hollow, flat or smooth in the midrange. To my ears it’s worse than when an amp is too bright or harsh in the highs. There are times though when I want sizzle and more aggression in the highs, but not in the ways mark iii’s do it, more like the sizzle that JBL’s provide or certain vintage ceramic pickups I’ve got

You are right, a little sizzle ain't bad if done right. Mark III's are sizzly and bright in a bit of a harsh, ear fatiguing way.

 

[Brandonrz]

Let me ask you something guys, do you consider Meshuggah's tone on Catch 33 polite? To me, it's gotta smoothness to it, but at the same time it's very aggressive and very modern. I don't know how they managed that tone with a Pod XT but that is one of my all time favorite tones ever. That was like one of the first real djent records... well Nothing and I are Djent too, but they don't sound as huge and groundbreaking as Catch 33.

Great album. Insane that album was a pod xt and all programmed drums, not just midi but actually 100 percent programmed.

 

[Cenotaph]

It's funny how we all hear things differently. A Jubilee would be one of the last amps I'd call smooth or polite. Mine sounds like a chainsaw with diode clipping engaged (in a good way).

 

[Brandonrz]

It's funny how we all hear things differently. A Jubilee would be one of the last amps I'd call smooth or polite. Mine sounds like a chainsaw with diode clipping engaged (in a good way).

Seriously. That thing with an od808 in front of it is nuts.

 

[Brandonrz]

This track has a modern classic on it, badlander, and a evh stealth. It is a death metal track…. So if that’s not your thing I probably wouldn’t listen.

 

[midnightlaundry]

Sounds good to me.

 

[Tone Monster]

This track has a modern classic on it, badlander, and a evh stealth. It is a death metal track…. So if that’s not your thing I probably wouldn’t listen.

I like heavy shit. To me, the heavier or faster music gets, the less the tone matters. The mix is just so busy. The “tone” kinda doesn’t matter so much. Help me understand

 

[saxxamafone]

Interesting, I can hear a similarity to my Modern Classic. The mids are definitely different.

Been curious how the Metal sounds. Appreciate the post.

Mids on MTL are definitely lower from what I've read and heard ?

Ya it definitely has a more vintage voicing to it, kinda in the boosted 2203 ballpark but with more low mids, not exactly a modern metal machine. Maybe that's why those amps are so popular around here? Everyone just LOVES vintage around this place. I like the sound of it though, sounds cool.

That's a really good description actually! Like a boosted 2203 with lower mids. But not modern still. Exactly how I would describe it too.
Thanks for checking it out.

I have the opposite experience for me . I get modern torn and the bright up helps a lot . Someone on here had a problem like this and switched a tube and it helped . I’ll see if I can find the thread for you . It was very much like your describing. It ended up being a preamp tube

Think it was me haha. Do you find you like the bright at both low and high volumes? I have mine cranked in volume when trying to push the bright... that's when it doesn't work for me for some reason.

What’s your favorite out of that lineup?

Ohh not sure yet, at this stage I would say the Herbert of Uber.. but the Herbert is new so i'm honeymooning at the moment. I'll throw together some A/B clips, hopefully in a mix to put them up against each other

The op is the same guy, so it’s unlikely the preamp tube that’s the issue. I’ve had my MTL for almost 6 years now. Great amp (especially for something recent made), but wouldn’t be my first choice for most modern metal either honestly. I think it can be great for some modern metal that is mostly palm mutes and rhythmical in nature (party since it’s so defined and punchy), but for riffs that are either more melodic or more note-y with the left hand it’s not the best choice imo. My friend is in a tech death band and for what he does his MTL is one the best amps he has, but again he’s not as much a lead player and doesn’t play really those styles of riffs that are kinda in between a lead and rhythm. I think also the op may be looking more for that saturation and some other qualities that his original Uber has and that’s just not in the cards for the MTL (with any boost IME)

MTL would work great for tech material. You're right I do love saturated modern high gain. Don't mind the dryer tones too but I like the modern aggression to still be there. From what I've heard online, it seems the Fryette stuff fits this description.
The MTL is spoken about like it's an Uber or a Herbert but it's not 'that modern' in my experience.
I need to keep playing with it though

For a modern metal situation that amp seems to fit the bill to my ears. Definitely has that low mid thing going on. I actually thought it sounded real good with the sweep up. Would I sell my mc1 for 1 probably not. But for the application you demoed It sounded great. I assume the Wylde Les Paul still has the original Meg’s.

Yes the low mid is very strong. I'd probably like a tad more high mids actually to get some more bite, while still keeping those low mids. I need to try the MTL in a mix to see how it really sits.
The Wylde LP actually has the EMGs removed and replaced with Bareknuckle painkillers. I don't regret making the change
I like the sweep pretty high usually too

I think it sounds great! I would be happy with those tones!

Thanks for checking it out mate!

I enjoyed my MTL mkII when i had it but just like my MCII-KT75, i just enjoy other amps more so i sold it. Glad OP is enjoying this though.

Wizards are great amps and certainly the best built amp I've seen. But tone wise they're not some magical unicorn that no other amp can touch. They're all tools for different jobs and personal preference is what makes tone so great. Sometimes the MTL will be the best amp for a situation, sometimes it won't

Rev blue isn’t the same beast as the original Rev or 2nd version fwiw. Not sure though how your experience would be opposite though. That is surprising as other MTL owners I’ve chatted with seem to feel similarly to what I felt. The MTL (at least my 2016 MTL 100 I’m talking about) is imo a more dry, open sounding amp that’s great for rhythmical stuff, guys love it for its punch, definition & clarity but for more single note heavy stuff I feel it works better on my amps with more saturation and fluid connection between the notes like the Uber Original or C+ (which are my 2 favorite metal I’ve had or tried so far, followed closely by my Rev D Recto)

Agree that the Blues are different and the MTL has a dry, openness to it ?

Sounds great to me! I have one arriving tomorrow to compliment my MCII. STOKED!!

Enjoy!! keen to hear what you think

Sounds good. Interesting that you don't like the bright set high. I need to have it set at 3:00 on all my Wizards. I run the presence up high too. Gives it a more raw and aggressive sound.

I think they all sound a little different over the years after 2016. I still have my 2016 MTL and 2019 KT150, but sold off a newer 2020 MK2 el34 and 2021 Mk2 Hybrid el34. I have a 2021 mk2 6L, and that's right up there with my older ones. They're all similar in certain respects, other than the character of the mids. The KT150 are a little tighter and punchier as well, but much more full in the mids.

Yes I have to have the presence around 8 usually to get the raw, clear aggression going. Do you have the amp cranked when running bright to 3:00? or is it more at lower volume?
Jealous of how many different versions you've been able to try! awesome

Sounds great man! What pickups are you using?

Thanks mate! These are Bareknuckle Painkillers ?

 

[saxxamafone]

This track has a modern classic on it, badlander, and a evh stealth. It is a death metal track…. So if that’s not your thing I probably wouldn’t listen.

Guitars sound great mate! Very clear and wide

Sounds good to me.

Thanks!

It's funny how we all hear things differently. A Jubilee would be one of the last amps I'd call smooth or polite. Mine sounds like a chainsaw with diode clipping engaged (in a good way).

The Jub is one amp I'm still curious about

 

[braintheory]

It's funny how we all hear things differently. A Jubilee would be one of the last amps I'd call smooth or polite. Mine sounds like a chainsaw with diode clipping engaged (in a good way).

I thought so too when I had mine at first. It’s all relative imo. Compared to a Friedman and many recent “boutique” amps it did sound raw & aggressive, but then after ABing with my ‘79 JMP2203 & 2016 Wizard MTL I started thinking of it as more smooth from that point on. The MTL was actually smoother (in the mids at least), but way punchier, bolder and imo just more impressive overall

 

[braintheory]

Mids on MTL are definitely lower from what I've read and heard ?



That's a really good description actually! Like a boosted 2203 with lower mids. But not modern still. Exactly how I would describe it too.
Thanks for checking it out.



Think it was me haha. Do you find you like the bright at both low and high volumes? I have mine cranked in volume when trying to push the bright... that's when it doesn't work for me for some reason.



Ohh not sure yet, at this stage I would say the Herbert of Uber.. but the Herbert is new so i'm honeymooning at the moment. I'll throw together some A/B clips, hopefully in a mix to put them up against each other



MTL would work great for tech material. You're right I do love saturated modern high gain. Don't mind the dryer tones too but I like the modern aggression to still be there. From what I've heard online, it seems the Fryette stuff fits this description.
The MTL is spoken about like it's an Uber or a Herbert but it's not 'that modern' in my experience.
I need to keep playing with it though

Yeah the Fryette’s are also imo dry, hollow mids vs Marshall’s, but like Wizards they are punchy and clear. The MTL and other Wizards are nothing like a Uber or Herbert. I’ve never heard anyone describe them as similar. Before I got any Wizards I was expecting them to be more Marshall-y and aggressive in the mids based on what I was reading on the forums, but I think with all these amps we just gotta see them all as their own thing. That’s why I try to be more accurate when talking about how various gear sounds. I hate those hyperbole exaggerators lol

 

[SQUAREHEAD]

Wow, listening to Wizard clips again, nothing punches like a Wizard!??

 

[saxxamafone]

Yeah the Fryette’s are also imo dry, hollow mids vs Marshall’s, but like Wizards they are punchy and clear. The MTL and other Wizards are nothing like a Uber or Herbert. I’ve never heard anyone describe them as similar. Before I got any Wizards I was expecting them to be more Marshall-y and aggressive in the mids based on what I was reading on the forums, but I think with all these amps we just gotta see them all as their own thing. That’s why I try to be more accurate when talking about how various gear sounds. I hate those hyperbole exaggerators lol

Agree mate, I thought the MTL would still have heaps of high mids thinking it would still be very Marshally. I'd call the MTL very punchy and clear but not a super high gain aggressive metal monster like it's sometimes referred to.

 

[braintheory]

Agree mate, I thought the MTL would still have heaps of high mids thinking it would still be very Marshally. I'd call the MTL very punchy and clear but not a super high gain aggressive metal monster like it's sometimes referred to.

Agreed on all. Unfortunately, we usually have to try these amps out ourselves to really figure it out. A lot of guys get too excited or broey from their initial honey moon phases when talking about gear and get sloppy with descriptions. The 1996 MC I owned had more upper mid presence and mids, but they had the same smooth, hollow character to them vs a real Marshall. If you want aggressive mids, nothing I've tried yet IME rivals a good early '70's to early '80's Marshall (stock or with the right mod). My 1989 SLO has excellent upper mids too, but in a more creamy, smooth yet still mean somehow kinda way. My MTL is still a keeper, but it's I think not what many guys here describe them to be

 

[saxxamafone]

Agreed on all. Unfortunately, we usually have to try these amps out ourselves to really figure it out. A lot of guys get too excited or broey from their initial honesty moon phases when talking about gear and get sloppy with descriptions. The 1996 MC I owned had more upper mid presence and mids, but they had the same smooth, hollow character to them vs a real Marshall. If you want aggressive mids, nothing I've tried yet IME rivals a good early '70's to early '80's Marshall (stock or with the right mod). My 1989 SLO has excellent upper mids too, but in a more creamy, smooth yet still mean somehow kinda way. My MTL is still a keeper, but it's I think not what many guys here describe them to be

How would you describe your SLO to the MTL?

Is it almost if you bumped the MTL slightly back towards Marshall territory?

 

[braintheory]

How would you describe your SLO to the MTL?

Is it almost if you bumped the MTL slightly back towards Marshall territory?

Not really. I think they're pretty different flavors. Firstly, I think my '89 SLO sounds a lot better than the early 2000's ones I've owned & tried (same flavor, just better. haven't tried the BAD era ones). The SLO is imo a great amp for all things rock (even some blues stuff) up to maybe the first Metallica album or 2, but even that's a stretch. I wouldn't really use it for metal. The MTL when AB'ed is more open, crisp, a lot harder hitting in it's punch, tighter, deeper lows, more scooped, way drier (the SLO is a saturated amp with give to it). The SLO has also a very pleasant midrange that is I think unique to it. It's a big part of why I still have it

 

[saxxamafone]

Not really. I think they're pretty different flavors. Firstly, I think my '89 SLO sounds a lot better than the early 2000's ones I've owned & tried (same flavor, just better. haven't tried the BAD era ones). The SLO is imo a great amp for all things rock (even some blues stuff) up to maybe the first Metallica album or 2, but even that's a stretch. I wouldn't really use it for metal. The MTL when AB'ed is more open, crisp, a lot harder hitting in it's punch, tighter, deeper lows, more scooped, way drier (the SLO is a saturated amp with give to it). The SLO has also a very pleasant midrange that is I think unique to it. It's a big part of why I still have it

Thanks mate, sounds like the MTL would be more 'modern' vs the SLO based on your description

 

[braintheory]

Thanks mate, sounds like the MTL would be more 'modern' vs the SLO based on your description

Yeah the SLO is not at all what I consider to be a modern sound. Very '80's imo, but excellent for that. My original Uber may actually be my favorite amp I've tried so far for modern stuff, although I think I get equally good sounds with my c+ or Rev D for modern metal (despite them being older amps) and I still gotta try my Rev C