Which Cabinet To Choose?

[311boogieman]

Hey guys! So, I have a Mesa Quad Preamp with a Mesa 50/50 power amp. Now I need to choose a cab. I really love Metallica’s Justice and Black Album tone and as far as I know, they used Marshall cabs with G12 Vintage speakers.
The cabs that I am thinking about are:
-Marshall Silver Jubilee 2536
-Marshall Silver Jubilee 2536A
-Marshall 1960BV
-Mesa Boogie 2x12 Vertical Recto

I’m a bit afraid that the 4x12 Marshall would be too loud in my bedroom. Unfortunately I couldn’t test these cabs yet in person.
What do you guys think?

Without playing through a BV cab I would say get the 212 vertical recto cab. I have a Mesa Trad slant 412 and a Splawn 212 and both of those set ups are equally loud. The 412 will be 6db louder in theory all things being equal (but they are never equal). How you dial in your amp, your guitar volume, your EQ and everything else will make more difference - as I assume you already know. I think if this new cab is going to be set and forget (don't gig) and you don't have space issues then a 4x12 is hard to beat. I also would get a used one. Used speakers are the best.

The most forgotten, yet one of the most important aspect of metallicas tone from the black album era, is the Marshall BV cab. People chase that tone for years, getting down to extreme accuracy of the gear used on that record to get that tone, but then botch the factor that effected a huge part of that tone: the cab. So kudos to everyone that brought that up.

If you ever mic a Marshall BV cab with an era correct MD 421 and Unidyne sm57, you’ll see how important those aspects are for that sound. This is by no means perfect, but for 5 minutes of tweaking, this is pretty good in my opinion. Would’ve never gotten anywhere close to that sound without the BV cab and 421-U and Unidyne /sm57.


https://soundcloud.app.goo.gl/3Wuda9Qrv6HAH15J9

That is a killer tone and maybe one of my favorites of yours so far

 

[ZackElekes]

Without playing through a BV cab I would say get the 212 vertical recto cab. I have a Mesa Trad slant 412 and a Splawn 212 and both of those set ups are equally loud. The 412 will be 6db louder in theory all things being equal (but they are never equal). How you dial in your amp, your guitar volume, your EQ and everything else will make more difference - as I assume you already know. I think if this new cab is going to be set and forget (don't gig) and you don't have space issues then a 4x12 is hard to beat. I also would get a used one. Used speakers are the best.


That is a killer tone and maybe one of my favorites of yours so far

I’m gonna try to test these cabs in person but it’s a long drive there. I am leaning pretty hard towards the Marshall 1960BV

 

[Markedman]

I also have the Quad/50-50 set up and it is great at low volume. The 1960 is the only cabinet I would use, a 2X12 is OK but the 4X12 is the one to get if you want the best tone, X2. IMO.

I don't use the 2 Master volumes, I go straight out of the send to my delay and boost pedals to the power amp. The Quad sounds too compressed when I use the master outputs, YMMV.

 

[VESmedic]

I'm a slant cab guy myself.

But Jesus Christ on a Pogo Stick bouncing on your Step-Dad's trampoline!!!

That shit is nice. Nicely done.

Thanks man! Glad you guys dig it.

 

[FormerlyKnownAsMaddnotez]

One thing to keep in mind, sorry if this was mentioned and I missed it. The width of the vertical cab may not be enough for you.

This was a discussion on GGF forum and ultimately why I got a horizontal 2x12. My head is extremely large at 29" wide and the vert cab was like 23". Not trying to get T boned

 

[ZackElekes]

One thing to keep in mind, sorry if this was mentioned and I missed it. The width of the vertical cab may not be enough for you.

This was a discussion on GGF forum and ultimately why I got a horizontal 2x12. My head is extremely large at 29" wide and the vert cab was like 23". Not trying to get T boned

Yeah, that makes sense. For now, the Marshall 1960BV makes the most sense for me

 

[ZackElekes]

Is there any difference between new and old Marshall 1960BV Speakers (Celestion G12 Vintage)? Not taking in consideration break-in time. Are older speakers different?

 

[thegame]

Is there any difference between new and old Marshall 1960BV Speakers (Celestion G12 Vintage)? Not taking in consideration break-in time. Are older speakers different?

Good question. I believe they’ve always been made in the U.K, to this day. Which doesn’t answer your question. Celestion can be sneaky though. I know that at one point some of the earlier “Made in the UK“ Heritage reissue speakers of various models were merely assembled in the U.K. from parts originating in the Celestion factory in China! Again, I’m afraid I’m not answering your question but just raising more.

 

[ZackElekes]

Good question. I believe they’ve always been made in the U.K, to this day. Which doesn’t answer your question. Celestion can be sneaky though. I know that at one point some of the earlier “Made in the UK“ Heritage reissue speakers of various models were merely assembled in the U.K. from parts originating in the Celestion factory in China! Again, I’m afraid I’m not answering your question but just raising more.

One difference that I found, not 100% sure, but the old ones are 8 ohms, whereas the new ones are 16 ohms

 

[thegame]

One difference that I found, not 100% sure, but the old ones are 8 ohms, whereas the new ones are 16 ohms

There’s old and new ones in both 8 and 16 ohms. I think they were available only in 8 during the first year of production, circa 86-87.

 

[ZackElekes]

There’s old and new ones in both 8 and 16 ohms. I think they were available only in 8 during the first year of production, circa 86-87.

Hm, interesting. Does ohm make any tonal difference? Not sure about that.

 

[VESmedic]

Hm, interesting. Does ohm make any tonal difference? Not sure about that.

Absolutely 100 percent. The 8 ohm version is very different than the 16 ohm version. But it’s easy to predict the differences:


8 ohm speakers are generally more midrangey/mid forward, rolled off highs and lows. 16 ohms are usually more smiley face: bigger lows and highs, slightly scooped midrange, and generally always sound bigger. This is the same for any 8 ohm vs 16 ohm speaker.



As far as older vs newer: I’ve had literally dozens of Marshall vintage speakers. The differences aren’t so much because of different years, more so as they are just different do to the inherent nature of speakers being a lottery in the first place. ALL of mine sound incredibly different under a mic, and all had different flavors. This is honestly the best part about all the speakers being different, to me it’s not a negative at all. After all, I’ve got 4 chances of getting the right sound just from the speaker cab. If they all sounded the same, being original would be much harder at the very least. Sometimes my top left speaker fits a track, sometimes bottom right etc, it just all depends.


I have 2 Marshall BV cabs, and in them right now are: 2 1992 Marshall vintages, 2 from 94, 2 from
95, and two Mesa 16 ohm v30s: because again, Mesa 16 ohm v30s are different than the 8ohm speakers. I just picked my favorites out of the dozens I had and put them in two BV cabs basically. But I had some from 87 all the way to today. The differences, whatever they are ( I’m not saying there aren’t differences or that they aren’t audible, they most certainly are) are not attributed to a certain year etc, it’s just the crapshoot of speakers as a whole. You hear claims of early 2000s Mesa cabs being the holy grail for some and I think there is much more evidence to support that “something happened” In the early 2000s and those Mesa v30s than there is to support Marshall vintages having “better years” than others.

 

[anomaly]

Personally i'd get a Mesa standard OS cab, just cause it's my fav and has a really balanced sound to it, no boxyiness to it like the traditional can have. But if the Metallica sound is what you are after then get the Marshall 1960bv.

BTW the G12-vintage speaker are just marshall's version of the vintage 30.

 

[Techdeth]

I’m gonna try to test these cabs in person but it’s a long drive there. I am leaning pretty hard towards the Marshall 1960BV

BV has been very satisfying

 

[VESmedic]

Personally i'd get a Mesa standard OS cab, just cause it's my fav and has a really balanced sound to it, no boxyiness to it like the traditional can have. But if the Metallica sound is what you are after then get the Marshall 1960bv.

BTW the G12-vintage speaker are just marshall's version of the vintage 30.

It’s not Marshalls version, it’s the original V30 design from 1986. Celestion started to change the v30, Marshall wanted the original version. Which is what the Marshall vintage still is today.

 

[Racerxrated]

It’s not Marshalls version, it’s the original V30 design from 1986. Celestion started to change the v30, Marshall wanted the original version. Which is what the Marshall vintage still is today.

This.
A little more background is that the original Marshall Vintage was designed to be a ceramic magnet version of the original Alnico blue Celestion from 1963. When I got my vintage blues they have almost the exact same frequency response as a v30. But the blue has this 3D sound the v30 can’t touch. I lucked into a 1988 Marshall slant with the original 8 ohm vintages and I can’t recommend them enough. Killer cab.