Autumn Snow

[Thumbpicker]

There are only two genders and one's sex is synonymous with gender. There are however many delusions.

 

[FokenBusker]

transgenderism isn't a mental illness

antisemitism is

 

[Bad Brain]

I didn’t say any of that. Nobody has said any of that ever. I’ve made my points, in multiple threads now. Take them or leave them.

I’ve asked you a couple of times for studies and objective data substantiating your position. You said you attended numerous workshops and presentations and they covered all that. But you can’t seem to provide anything when asked. I smell BS. But I know, I know, you’re “done” with the conversation.

 

[FokenBusker]

I’ve asked you a couple of times for studies and objective data substantiating your position. You said you attended numerous workshops and presentations and they covered all that. But you can’t seem to provide anything when asked. I smell BS. But I know, I know, you’re “done” with the conversation.

do you have any studies? usually if you ask for something it's nice to return the favour

 

[Dan Gleesak]

I’ve asked you a couple of times for studies and objective data substantiating your position. You said you attended numerous workshops and presentations and they covered all that. But you can’t seem to provide anything when asked. I smell BS. But I know, I know, you’re “done” with the conversation.

The work shops weren’t about numbers. They were about, and by people who have gone through the things I am talking about, and who are trying to help keep other kids from going through the same thing. I have made the same point over and over again, and that is a small change could mean a lot to some kids, and take next to zero effort from everyone else. What you do with that is on you.

If you disagree, you disagree, if you want to think of mental health as a statistic, knock yourself out. If you want to educate yourself on what is going on and what people are trying to do to help, try talking to people that have gone through it, are going through it, and are trying to help.

Or don’t, and continue to argue the points that matter to you. It’s perfectly normal to have views according to your own biases, but as I said, this one ain’t about you man, and your own insecurities are a different battle

 

[Thumbpicker]

If you disagree, you disagree, if you want to think of mental health as a statistic, knock yourself out.

Well that's sort of my point about delusions. It's a mental health issue aka a delusion. These genders aren't real. Why are we humouring them? for the sake of humouring the people that are severely mixed up? Pandering to the deluded by saying "yes dear it's all true - you really are a gay whale trapped in the body of a salamander" is kind of whacked because they'll never wake up to themselves.

 

[Bad Brain]

do you have any studies? usually if you ask for something it's nice to return the favour

No, the onus is on the one claiming that the novel treatment is efficacious and not harmful —especially in this case where it is a politically charged issue that effects everyone, not just the alleged sufferer and caregiver.

 

[Dan Gleesak]

Well that's sort of my point about delusions. It's a mental health issue aka a delusion. These genders aren't real. Why are we humouring them? for the sake of humouring the people that are severely mixed up? Pandering to the deluded by saying "yes dear it's all true - you really are a gay whale trapped in the body of a salamander" is kind of whacked because they'll never wake up to themselves.

Well that is kind of part of the “awareness” thing; so that people will listen when someone else is ready to talk. To understand where they are coming from when they say “I was born a girl but have always felt more like a boy”. Because that is what gender is. It’s gender identity. They aren’t pretending to sit on their make believe balls, just that everything about their being makes them believe they are a boy. It’s that simple. It’s nothing new and it’s not going to go away either. If anyone wants proof that the education is working, it’s that people are talking about it now. More and more people are comfortable going through it, and talking about it.

There is a huge disconnect for many people who boil this all down to the meme of that rugged lady screaming “it’s maam!” (Or bringing animals into the picture.
It’s not really about that. English is a very gender specific language, and the pronouns are how we refer to them in written and spoken language. The “preferred pronouns” are a simple pleasantry and sign of respect just the same as making a point of calling someone by their actual name, and not just making one up because he looks like a Larry to you, and fuck if you aren’t going to call him that.

 

[Bad Brain]

The work shops weren’t about numbers. They were about, and by people who have gone through the things I am talking about, and who are trying to help keep other kids from going through the same thing.

That's great, but we live in an empirical world. Some people are visited by aliens as well they say.

I have made the same point over and over again, and that is a small change could mean a lot to some kids, and take next to zero effort from everyone else.

You haven't demonstrated that it is what you are claiming, other than by personal anecdote, or that the supposed treatment helps and isn't harmful.

If you disagree, you disagree, if you want to think of mental health as a statistic, knock yourself out. If you want to educate yourself on what is going on and what people are trying to do to help, try talking to people that have gone through it, are going through it, and are trying to help.

Just asking for one study about suicide risk and one study demonstrating that transition reduces it.

this one ain’t about you man, and your own insecurities are a different battle

It's about me if I get cancelled or defamed for challenging it.

 

[Dan Gleesak]

It's about me if I get cancelled or defamed for challenging it.

Yikes

 

[Bad Brain]

Yikes

You can't provide any evidence other than personal anecdote. You don't know whether you're doing more harm than good with your novel treatments. You don't even have an objective method of testing to show that people are actually suffering from this malady and not something else. Yet you smugly continue. Yikes.

 

[Dan Gleesak]

You can't provide any evidence other than personal anecdote. You don't know whether you're doing more harm than good with your novel treatments. You don't even have an objective method of testing to show that people are actually suffering from this malady and not something else. Yet you smugly continue. Yikes.

I can’t stop you from digging bro but the problem is on the surface, I’m not going down the rabbit hole with you.
You can call kindness and sensitivity “treatments” and feeling unwelcome as a “malady” but that isn’t strengthening your case. If your metric for success is less suicides, then I hope it works out, but you are missing the forest for the trees.
It’s ok that you don’t really know what you are talking about. Most people don’t. That’s why they are teaching it. I was as clueless as you were not too long ago, however my ignorance showed itself as indifference, while yours comes across as rage, so I have trouble finding middle ground with you.

Anyways keep on fighting the fight I guess, #cancelcurtesy

 

[Beater]

She’s a really nice girl! One bad decision in high school shouldn’t count.


~ss

You’re thinking of Aurora Snow.

 

[Bad Brain]

I can’t stop you from digging bro but the problem is on the surface, I’m not going down the rabbit hole with you.
You can call kindness and sensitivity “treatments” and feeling unwelcome as a “malady” but that isn’t strengthening your case. If your metric for success is less suicides, then I hope it works out, but you are missing the forest for the trees.
It’s ok that you don’t really know what you are talking about. Most people don’t. That’s why they are teaching it. I was as clueless as you were not too long ago, however my ignorance showed itself as indifference, while yours comes across as rage, so I have trouble finding middle ground with you.

Anyways keep on fighting the fight I guess, #cancelcurtesy

It's not "Kind, sensitive or courteous" to advocate a belief system that disregards the conscientiously held beliefs of others because you "Know better" (Even though you clearly don't). It's disingenuous to call asking for evidence "Going down the rabbit hole" but I guess you've been indoctrinated to think that's the case. Maybe it's kind and sensitive to humor what arguably amounts to a form of delusion, but I draw the line at compelled speech either way. And maybe it's not kind because you're doing more harm — but you wouldn't know because you don't have data one way or the other. And you were the one that brought up suicide as the reason it's so important to "Help" these children. You say I'm clueless but you can't seem to answer any of my questions without equivocation. I really have no clue wether you are confused or insincere or what. I'm leaning toward the latter and that's what angers me. You don't strike me as stupid.

 

[Thumbpicker]

English is a very gender specific language, and the pronouns are how we refer to them in written and spoken language. The “preferred pronouns” are a simple pleasantry and sign of respect just the same as making a point of calling someone by their actual name, and not just making one up because he looks like a Larry to you, and fuck if you aren’t going to call him that.

Well that's interesting because I wouldn't respect anyone that talked about gender pronouns and made me use them. I'd just snort at them and walk away and never talk to them again. I don't do weird shit.

 

[jdel77]

It's not "Kind, sensitive or courteous" to advocate a belief system that disregards the contentiously held beliefs of others because you "Know better" (Even though you clearly don't). It's disingenuous to call asking for evidence "Going down the rabbit hole" but I guess you've been indoctrinated to think that's the case. Maybe it's kind and sensitive to humor what arguably amounts to a form of delusion, but I draw the line at compelled speech either way. And maybe it's not kind because you're doing more harm — but you wouldn't know because you don't have data one way or the other. And you were the one that brought up suicide as the reason it's so important to "Help" these children. You say I'm clueless but you can't seem to answer any of my questions without equivocation. I really have no clue wether you are confused or insincere or what. I'm leaning toward the latter and that's what angers me. You don't strike me as stupid.

Teachers shouldn’t be teaching anything not in the curriculum.
That goes for pro-trans AND anti-trans propaganda, Left or Right ideology or anything else unless it’s in the curriculum.

No, there isn’t a wash of pro-gay mind warping suddenly appearing in text books as far as I know as someone who’s been in the job nearly 20 years.

Just a few months ago my Year 10 Global Politics students had to pick a human rights issue and argue for or against it in an editorial format, and some chose topics such as trans-athletes shouldn’t be allowed to compete to an advantage and we were happy to have it because the #1 thing a teacher can teach is the value of critical thinking based on independent research and questioning.

The 2nd most important thing is the need for people to be valued, feel safe and wanting to contribute to a society which values people and their safety.
If I’ve got students leaving High School knowing they’re worth something and that they should question things and make up their own minds from as many different sources of information as possible, then job done.

 

[jdel77]

Well that's interesting because I wouldn't respect anyone that talked about gender pronouns and made me use them. I'd just snort at them and walk away and never talk to them again. I don't do weird shit.

I won’t tolerate enforced/mandatory speech by any government, but if you cannot simply extend respect to someone of a different socio-political persuasion than yourself; then that’s your personal failure to deal with.

 

[Thumbpicker]

I won’t tolerate enforced/mandatory speech by any government, but if you cannot simply extend respect to someone of a different socio-political persuasion than yourself; then that’s your personal failure to deal with.

No it isn’t. Not putting up with shit from wankers is a strength. No one will make me play their game - that allows them to set the rules. if I was to go along with it normalises it and is de facto ascent to it. That is how things creep like this in. If everyone was as strong willed as me it would never have happened.

 

[Monkey Man]

It's easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than it is for a rich man to go to heaven.

I haven't looked it up but IIRC it should be, "... enter the Kingdom of Heaven."

Pass though eye of a needle vs enter Kingdom of Heaven - it's a comparison of difficulty of entry / passing though something.

Carry on. Just nitpicking.

 

[VonBonfire]

I won’t tolerate enforced/mandatory speech by any government, but if you cannot simply extend respect to someone of a different socio-political persuasion than yourself; then that’s your personal failure to deal with.

There are people who use pronouns to gain the upper hand in social interactions. They aren't worthy of respect. So how I responded would mostly depend on whether they were being aggressive or just making a humble request. If you are going to use some hot topic social issue in a personal interaction with me as a weapon you will test my titanium spine and fail.