Another rig advice topic...help me rig masters!

[some dude]

-One thing I need NOW is a power amp! I love my Friedman recto tone, but the parallel loop is completely unusable for me. It just slaughters the tone when I put a delay in the loop no matter how I have it set. I might try a delay unit with a "killdry" function but I'd rather get a decent tube power amp and use the recto's 'slave out' jack and then hit my effects. I need a better rack effects unit as well, as lately I've been putting all my money into pedals.

-I don't necessarily NEED a W/D/W setup, but I'd like to at least have a stereo rig. Stereo is more than enough for me.

Since you're looking to go stereo you don't really need three power sections (ie, your head + a stereo power amp).

For the cost of a decent power amp you could pick up a used Recto head and use it as a slave amp for your stereo rig... and it would double as a backup to your main head.

 

[Zachman]

Hire someone to do it for you. Why stress yourself out trying to design a system when there are professionals who can help you get it done right?

You have admitted that you have not been able to complete the job. That professional will get it done for you.

That is a good idea, but I am able to design my rig, it's just that my budget isn't able to get there so I'm asking for suggestions from you guys to see if something sounds like it'll work and be somewhat cost effective. I'd love to have Dave Friedman design a pedalboard/switcher and two head W/D/W setup with integrated rack pieces but it's just not possible or practical for me at the moment.

Hire someone to do it for you. Why stress yourself out trying to design a system when there are professionals who can help you get it done right?

You have admitted that you have not been able to complete the job. That professional will get it done for you.

so in what world do you live in that everyone shits $100 bills?

Jordan.

sell the 4 space rack + amp holder. break the rack into 8 space chunks so that its mobile - use multiple 8x racks - as many as you need. leave a rack space in each rack for a bar with labeled connectors that are easy to see and easy to understand so teardown and buildup is easy and painless.

get a flight case for the mesa - and casters for the cabinets that are quick-removable if you dont have any.

as for the cabinet being stereo - the point of stereo effects is to get the stereo feeling left and right seperately with space between them. for this, i would get either 1x12's for the wet left/right or 2x12's for wet left/right and use the 4x12 always dry.

problem solved

Sometimes I'm in a David Gilmour frame of mind, and I want the old-school huge pedalboard into a couple amps run in stereo. But part of me wants to use that big road case and control it all via a Ground Control Pro. It's not something I need, but I've wanted to have a setup like that for so long that it's for my ego more than anything else! Or maybe just to get my rocks off on the look of a big stage rig in my bedroom!

I do like your idea of breaking it up into 8-space racks and smaller cabs for the wet signal. Definitely something I'll consider. the real question I have to face is whether or not I can sell my stuff. I have a problem with getting rid of gear.

Here's what I own that I probably don't need.
-new SKB 3-space rack I just took in a trade
-mint Grundorf 4-space rack. I guess I could keep it for my recording interface
-custom roadcase made by Rock Solid Cases. Great quality, but a little worn.

What do you guys think I could realistically get for those? I don't want to get rid of the road case and then regret it later.

I admit-- having the heads in one rack along with all of the outboard fx and switching gear has it's appeal-- BUT unless you're playing larger stages and/or have a moving truck w/ a hydraulic lift gate and friends/roadies to help move it around, they can be overkill. I don't mind overkill, but that's me.

How many pedals? How many control functions? How many rack pieces? How many spaces will all of it take up?

Seems to me your biggest obstacle is coming to terms with having put the cart before the horse regarding the HUGE case.

Gear serve as a mere utility which serve a purpose, beyond appearance.

Yeah, the huge case was actually bought second-hand. I couldn't pass it up because my head fit perfectly in it, and the price was KILLER! So I yes, I bought the case thinking I would build up a rig using that as my template, rather than planning out what I need and moving on from there. I did it ass backwards but now that I have that case, I want so badly to use it!

As far as pedals go, I'm a junkie! I sold a couple that I really don't need, but I'm at around 10 or so that I absolutely must have in my rig and there're a few to go still.
For this reason, I think a board such as a PT-PRO with a small looper/switcher that'll switch my pedals AND amp channels/rack gear is the best route. As badly as I want to rack my pedals, I think I'd need two shelves to fit them all.

I was thinking of grabbing the big Pedaltrain board and one of these http://www.rockbox.com/efxmkii.htm or the new Rocktron floormate switcher.

I've also considered getting a POD HD 500 along with a rack switcher and using it control everything, but then what do I do with all the pedals? Have a big pedalboard in addition to that? See where my problem is?

I hear you. A DEAL is a DEAL is a Deal... Gotta do it.

Ya, so 2 pedal trays easily fit 10 pedals unless they're all Moogs or something equally sized.

You're now up to about a 10-12 space rack.

Furman
Palmer
Axe
Pedal Tray
Pedal Tray
GCX, or ?
Power amp


My previous rig was 12 and I EASILY moved it all by myself, w/ no lift gate on my Durango either.

 

[jlbaxe]

Honestly I sold all my pedals after buying an Axe Fx. It was so much easier and I eliminated all that excess cables. I still have my amps but tonight I did a A/B with the Marshall JMP 100 and Axe Fx and I was leaning towards the Axe. Now it wasnt the same cab (Bog 4x12 w/V30s and Marshall 4x12 w X pattern cl80, G12T75s) but with and without the cab sims I still preferred the Axe. My Bogners beat the Axe on the other hand. I did an A/B with the 20th XTC and have the Axe close enough that I could leave my Bogner home.

Last night I did an A/B with a Art SLA2 and RT2/50 w/quad of JJ E34Ls and I actually prefer the RT2/50. I didnt want to like the RT because of the weight but it sits in a 6 space rack with the Axe now.

For a W/D/W setup I like the Art SLA2 because it doesn't color my amp tone.

I had a 20 space and a 40 space Gilmour rack, 2 trays of pedals, switchers multiple preamps, Amps and the works. With the Amps I have and the Axe-Fx it feels as a weight has been lifted off my shoulder. Its so nice not worrying about power supplies for the pedals and rack units or what order I want them in. I dont jones for pedals or amps because most of them are in the Axe.

Just my 2 cents and what I went through the last 3 years.

 

[glpg80]

i prefer racked pedals. i have planned about 6 pedals i have to have.

the reason i wont ever go to an effects unit for ALL effects is because i prefer analog signal chains out front for one, and two, i prefer the ability to tweak on the fly with actual knobs. also, some pedals add their own tones and characters with the opamps and transistors that they use initially by design. psychodave can detest to this, as he is always switching out opamps for more HIFI ones to adjust the preferred tone. you cant do that in an axe-fx or any modeling unit for that matter.

the axe is great for back saving and at home jamming where you arent burning through $300 of tubes at bedroom levels.

i also prefer lower-end TC electronics rack gear to their upper end models. more expensive does not necessarily mean better. TBH thats why each person's view of what is better is so scewed - its all tonally subjective.

 

[glpg80]

Yeah, the huge case was actually bought second-hand. I couldn't pass it up because my head fit perfectly in it, and the price was KILLER! So I yes, I bought the case thinking I would build up a rig using that as my template, rather than planning out what I need and moving on from there. I did it ass backwards but now that I have that case, I want so badly to use it!

like Zach said, you have to judge what you want versus what you need with your rig. and when you get down to being brutally honest with yourself, you'll be surprised at what you actually end up designing. an example is i want a flanger in my rig, but i never use one or found myself needing one. so i dont own one even though it sounds good on paper. i wanted a noise supressor, bought the best you could get and wrote a detailed review about it in the rack section. ended up selling it because it took away from the core tone (lost some low end chunk at high volumes)

what sounds good on paper or in your head might not or does not seem reasonable in application for you - it all depends on just how brutally honest you are with yourself.

As far as pedals go, I'm a junkie! I sold a couple that I really don't need, but I'm at around 10 or so that I absolutely must have in my rig and there're a few to go still.
For this reason, I think a board such as a PT-PRO with a small looper/switcher that'll switch my pedals AND amp channels/rack gear is the best route. As badly as I want to rack my pedals, I think I'd need two shelves to fit them all.

so whats wrong with that? ill be using two shelves soon. the shelves arent that wide and you can fit them in 4 rack spaces and easily hold 10 pedals. use an RJM effects gizmo or a GCX switcher and you're in MIDI heaven man

no huge pedal boards out front to hook up or clutter the stage with chords. just your favorite wah and a MIDI board - everything you need at the push of a button.

I was thinking of grabbing the big Pedaltrain board and one of these http://www.rockbox.com/efxmkii.htm or the new Rocktron floormate switcher.

I've also considered getting a POD HD 500 along with a rack switcher and using it control everything, but then what do I do with all the pedals? Have a big pedalboard in addition to that? See where my problem is?

I might wait for a cheaper Fractal/Axe solution or a rackmount PODHD because either way I'd like to own one for recording purposes. Then I'll try to integrate it into my live rig.

IMHO my at home jamming, backup, and small gig setup will be an HD-500 using the 4CM, my 5150 II, and a 2x12. thats for the bars where alot of tones are needed, no space to play, and the easier to setup the better. someone on the forum posted a clip and didnt say it was an HD-500 afterwards and i was really surprised at the recording, it sounded REALLY fucking good. for the money im all over the HD-500. the fact that its not racked and requires MIDI is even better.

 

[axemeaquestion]

Say, brother glipper, why have you appended your signoff with one of my quotes?

I know git players are famous for ripping off other people's riffs....

 

[glpg80]

Say, brother glipper, why have you appended your signoff with one of my quotes?

I know git players are famous for ripping off other people's riffs....

a personal reminder to never take you seriously

ripping off other peoples riffs? never heard you play, but i doubt since you hate blues and hardcore metal that you have anything in your arsenal worthy enough for my obviously better and more elite playing abilities

 

[axemeaquestion]

Say, brother glipper, why have you appended your signoff with one of my quotes?

I know git players are famous for ripping off other people's riffs....

a personal reminder to never take you seriously

ripping off other peoples riffs? never heard you play, but i doubt since you hate blues and hardcore metal that you have anything in your arsenal id want to play. it would probably put me to sleep

Dude, go download that clip that everyone thot was Satriani in that other thread. Mind you, that's 18 years ago. I wouldn't put up anything that sloppily played today.

Or find that other clip of mine in that other thread.

 

[axemeaquestion]

Say, brother glipper, why have you appended your signoff with one of my quotes?

I know git players are famous for ripping off other people's riffs....

a personal reminder to never take you seriously

ripping off other peoples riffs? never heard you play, but i doubt since you hate blues and hardcore metal that you have anything in your arsenal id want to play. it would probably put me to sleep

Dude, go download that clip that everyone thot was Satriani in that other thread. Mind you, that's 18 years ago. I wouldn't put up anything that sloppily played today.

Or find that other clip of mine in that other thread.

 

[Zachman]

Say, brother glipper, why have you appended your signoff with one of my quotes?

I know git players are famous for ripping off other people's riffs....

a personal reminder to never take you seriously

ripping off other peoples riffs? never heard you play, but i doubt since you hate blues and hardcore metal that you have anything in your arsenal id want to play. it would probably put me to sleep

Dude, go download that clip that everyone thot was Satriani in that other thread. Mind you, that's 18 years ago. I wouldn't put up anything that sloppily played today.

Or find that other clip of mine in that other thread.

Grow up

 

[Zachman]

Yeah, the huge case was actually bought second-hand. I couldn't pass it up because my head fit perfectly in it, and the price was KILLER! So I yes, I bought the case thinking I would build up a rig using that as my template, rather than planning out what I need and moving on from there. I did it ass backwards but now that I have that case, I want so badly to use it!

like Zach said, you have to judge what you want versus what you need with your rig. and when you get down to being brutally honest with yourself, you'll be surprised at what you actually end up designing. an example is i want a flanger in my rig, but i never use one or found myself needing one. so i dont own one even though it sounds good on paper. i wanted a noise supressor, bought the best you could get and wrote a detailed review about it in the rack section. ended up selling it because it took away from the core tone (lost some low end chunk at high volumes)

what sounds good on paper or in your head might not or does not seem reasonable in application for you - it all depends on just how brutally honest you are with yourself.

As far as pedals go, I'm a junkie! I sold a couple that I really don't need, but I'm at around 10 or so that I absolutely must have in my rig and there're a few to go still.
For this reason, I think a board such as a PT-PRO with a small looper/switcher that'll switch my pedals AND amp channels/rack gear is the best route. As badly as I want to rack my pedals, I think I'd need two shelves to fit them all.

so whats wrong with that? ill be using two shelves soon. the shelves arent that wide and you can fit them in 4 rack spaces and easily hold 10 pedals. use an RJM effects gizmo or a GCX switcher and you're in MIDI heaven man

no huge pedal boards out front to hook up or clutter the stage with chords. just your favorite wah and a MIDI board - everything you need at the push of a button.

I was thinking of grabbing the big Pedaltrain board and one of these http://www.rockbox.com/efxmkii.htm or the new Rocktron floormate switcher.

I've also considered getting a POD HD 500 along with a rack switcher and using it control everything, but then what do I do with all the pedals? Have a big pedalboard in addition to that? See where my problem is?

I might wait for a cheaper Fractal/Axe solution or a rackmount PODHD because either way I'd like to own one for recording purposes. Then I'll try to integrate it into my live rig.

IMHO my at home jamming, backup, and small gig setup will be an HD-500 using the 4CM, my 5150 II, and a 2x12. thats for the bars where alot of tones are needed, no space to play, and the easier to setup the better. someone on the forum posted a clip and didnt say it was an HD-500 afterwards and i was really surprised at the recording, it sounded REALLY fucking good. for the money im all over the HD-500. the fact that its not racked and requires MIDI is even better.

Nothing more to add. THAT sums it up nicely

 

[axemeaquestion]

Say, brother glipper, why have you appended your signoff with one of my quotes?

I know git players are famous for ripping off other people's riffs....

a personal reminder to never take you seriously

ripping off other peoples riffs? never heard you play, but i doubt since you hate blues and hardcore metal that you have anything in your arsenal id want to play. it would probably put me to sleep

Dude, go download that clip that everyone thot was Satriani in that other thread. Mind you, that's 18 years ago. I wouldn't put up anything that sloppily played today.

Or find that other clip of mine in that other thread.

Grow up

Why are you being such a Gloomy Gus? I was responding to my brother's statement that he hadn't heard my playing.

 

[Zachman]

Say, brother glipper, why have you appended your signoff with one of my quotes?

I know git players are famous for ripping off other people's riffs....

a personal reminder to never take you seriously

ripping off other peoples riffs? never heard you play, but i doubt since you hate blues and hardcore metal that you have anything in your arsenal id want to play. it would probably put me to sleep

Dude, go download that clip that everyone thot was Satriani in that other thread. Mind you, that's 18 years ago. I wouldn't put up anything that sloppily played today.

Or find that other clip of mine in that other thread.

Grow up

Why are you being such a Gloomy Gus? I was responding to my brother's statement that he hadn't heard my playing.

Anything current to listen to, or is it all sloppily played?

 

[axemeaquestion]

Yes, brother Zach. That clip, entitled Sample Clip, is from my upcoming debut album. You'd have to go back a few pages to find it. I'm not overly keen about putting much else up, but I will post a longer clip from a new song that's getting an extensive rework sometime in January. It has a Holdsworth influenced solo that may be of interest to those who have a preference for music that common folk don't get.

 

[glpg80]

Yes, brother Zach. That clip, entitled Sample Clip, is from my upcoming debut album. You'd have to go back a few pages to find it. I'm not overly keen about putting much else up, but I will post a longer clip from a new song that's getting an extensive rework sometime in January. It has a Holdsworth influenced solo that may be of interest to those who have a preference for music that common folk don't get.

you've got alot of balls coming to a predominately metal forum and strutting around with holdsworth material and spiking words like debut album, when no ones even heard of you - let alone cares when you're spewing shit like what's in my signature

 

[axemeaquestion]

Yes, brother Zach. That clip, entitled Sample Clip, is from my upcoming debut album. You'd have to go back a few pages to find it. I'm not overly keen about putting much else up, but I will post a longer clip from a new song that's getting an extensive rework sometime in January. It has a Holdsworth influenced solo that may be of interest to those who have a preference for music that common folk don't get.

you've got alot of balls coming to a predominately metal forum and strutting around with holdsworth material and spiking words like debut album, when no ones even heard of you letalone cares when you're spewing shit like whats in my signature

I hadn't realized this was primarily a metal forum, brother glipper. As you know, I do find metal to be a rather limited genre and find it generally lacking in melody and harmonic contrast. Of course, there are exceptions.

You do seem to care what I say, since you seem to take such delight in responding to me. I am well pleased that I have been a source of delight for you.

 

[Zachman]

Yes, brother Zach. That clip, entitled Sample Clip, is from my upcoming debut album. You'd have to go back a few pages to find it. I'm not overly keen about putting much else up, but I will post a longer clip from a new song that's getting an extensive rework sometime in January. It has a Holdsworth influenced solo that may be of interest to those who have a preference for music that common folk don't get.

I'm unmotivated to go hunting.

Allan Holdsworth... Love the guy! We got to hang out and visit the last time he came to Hawaii. He was rather surprised as the last few times we hung out were in California, drinking Ale.

Feel free to go try to impress someone else. For me-- you just ain't doing it.

 

[axemeaquestion]

That's awesome, brother Zach. I'm envious as he is the one guy that blows me away when I hear his stuff.

Holdsworth did a solo on the guy who's singing and playing bass on my album. That's kinda wicked.

 

[Zachman]

That's awesome, brother Zach. I'm envious as he is the one guy that blows me away when I hear his stuff.

Holdsworth did a solo on the guy who's singing and playing bass on my album. That's kinda wicked.

I'm bowing out of this conversation. You and I are not brothers. I think your attitude is terrible, and I think it's rather pathetic that you appear to get off on seeking negative attention.

 

[racerevlon]

Here's what I did on the cheap:

That's a 16-space with 2U dedicated to power, 2U to switching, 7U to signal processing (if you count rack stuff), a tuner, and a spectrum analyzer. While it's somewhat big, it's not very heavy.

Fancy this:

1U for power
2U for Switching/Loops
2U for signal processing/noise suppression
1U for a pedal drawer

That's a 6-Space rack, and with the right MIDI controller (GCP, All Access) will control pretty much any head, if configured correctly. The MIDI-capable heads are easy--one MIDI cable and you're ready. For the non-MIDI-capable heads, I create a labeled snake for each and just plug in the plugz on the fly. For instance, I have one snake for my Splawn QR that, with the All Access and GCX lets me do away with the stock foot switch AND do the gear switching. I have a snake for the Splawn Nitro, one for my Mark V Combo, and the Vintage Modern is just one lead programmed to be Momentary. It's not that hard, and can be EASILY done with consumer-grade equipment. Get one of those head/rack combo units, and you have one unit to move, then speakers. Get yourself a good DI box and you're golden.

For a grab 'n go rig I always go super-simple: 3-space rack--JMP-1 (or Triaxis, or Engl), G-Major, EL84 20/20. Use the power amp to drive two 1 x 12 cabinets set wide and run a DI to the board. If you want to go down to a 2-space anvil briefcase setup, I recommend a Rocktron VooDoo Valve and a power amp--same principles but the preamp and effects are combined. It'll do in a pinch.

Flame on...