Anybody know about KT77's and Mesa Rectifers???

[stephen sawall]

Eurotubes is in Portland not too far from me. I know Bob and his son and have been to their home/basement/shop many times. If you ask Mesa they will you it is a bad idea to put KT88 in any DR. Some people love them ..... so as always I say it is only a matter of taste.
I have seen Bob set up and re-tube several amps .... He tends to set the Bias very hot with all amps I noticed. This is the way he likes it and it does have certain advantages and sounds, feel, etc....
What Bob does is he finds KT88's that are so far down on the scale that they are in the range of your amp. These tubes because they are far at one end of the range do not behave or act like KT88's in the normal range. But they can be used in many amps designed for 6l6 and El34 amps. This is also a way for tube sellers to sell KT88's that are not in the normal range... because most KT88 users would never want KT88's this cold in a amp designed for normal KT88's.

This same kind of thing can also allow you to put 6V6's in your amp. But the 6V6's would be at the other end of their range than KT88's in your amp.

I have tried them all a long time ago .... this is what I remember.

EL34 .... great crunch, less low end that makes it less loose in the bottom. Do not sound very good clean when compared with 6L6.

KT77 .... a lot of the same character of a EL34 but with a fuller bass more like a 6L6. The high end is also a little more aggressive.

6CA7 (old).... Great crunch with a focused full bass .... best over all for me and feel they blow away everything else. I was recommended these by Mesa a very long time ago and they also feel this is the best tube in the amp. (warning vintage 6CA7 are not cheap at all.)

6L6.... good cleans and a very full big sounding bottom with distorted sounds.

5881 ..... not as warm as 6L6 and a different midrange. Great sound especially for blues and point of break-up sounds.

KT66.... best clean sound and a huge bass end. Sounds great for leads but tends to be loose for crunch playing.

6V6.... much like a 6L6 but breaks up faster and more bass in it's tonal balance.

EL84 (Yellowjackets). Best harmonics and almost magical high end. Lacks bass and is loose on the bottom.

KT88 .... also a very big sound like the KT66 with a tighter bass and not near as warm. Kind of cold sounding (not in a bad way).

6550 .... big clean sound, does not break up much at all till it is really pushed and then gets pretty nasty (also not in a bad way).

Every individual tube is like a snowflake.... it has it's own voice, tonal balance and point of breakup. So all the things said above are greatly effected by the rating of the individual tubes and what kinds of sounds you are trying to achieve.

So in the end what tubes I put in my amps depends a lot on what my goal is at the time....Myself I trust Mesa when it comes to their amps a lot more than Bob...

If there is something I missed or whatever ... do not be afraid to ask. I went kind of crazy with all this stuff about ten years ago, still recovering ....

 

[snakeman1986]

From what I understand running kt88s in a recto is pointless.in order to run them they run way cold and it defeats the purpose.kt 77s on the other hand are actually a good fit for the recto.I find that they tend to make an amp have a very stiff feel and seeing as rectos are loose it works out well....

I like it much more with 88s than 6l6s

 

[some dude]

JJ E34Ls are cool in a Recto. Gives some of the EL34 mid without thinning the tone as much.

 

[crwnedblasphemy]

Today...I tried the KT77's in my recto....sounded good. Better highs....Bias was hot.

Super low when I tested my 6L6's. Crazy low.

 

[CaseyCor]

I'm interested in this as well. I heard u could use 77s but not 88s...which I have been doin anyway for a long time with no issues at all. I took my series one single Rec to a tech a few years back and he said I could use 88s in there so I did. Came to find out a long time later that u absolutely should NEVER run 88s in there. I've been doing it now for a few years. Not smart I know but I did it anyway.

After I posted this I sent an email to eurotubes.com and got this in response:

"Yes, KT88's can be run in the older series I Single Recs. The amp does not seem to mind the added load and KT88's really sound great in them.

If you order from us online just make sure to mention that you have series I in the comments section. Then we can set you up with the proper grade for the KT88's.

Thanks,
Eddie"

So apparently 88s are ok too...everyone has always said no.

Wow, really? 88's in a Series I Singe Rectifier?

My wallet is not fond of you and you're desire to enlighten, sir.

 

[stephen sawall]

Today...I tried the KT77's in my recto....sounded good. Better highs....Bias was hot.

Super low when I tested my 6L6's. Crazy low.

I like the KT77 in the DR's also .... easy one of my favorites. Great crunch sound...

 

[locoed]

I ran 77's in one of my rack mount Recto's,i has it biased though,some cats just flip the EL-34 switch which CAN be bad,Mesa sets their amps so cold. However i didn't like the tone i was getting,i play thrash,(Exodus/Kreator etc) the KT-88's were more what i was looking for.IMO it's better to be safe.
Good luck,if you do swap them let us know what you think.

 

[leib10]

I know I could run KT77s in my Twin Jet with the switch set to EL34 mode, but I didn't really like them. Bottom end was too extended for my tastes.

 

[crwnedblasphemy]

I have to order a set today....I am trying to decide between the KT77's and the SED 6L6's? I tried the KT77's yesterday and they sounded good. Just have to give them back to my friend. I had GT 6L6's in it....a bit more spongy, and fuzzy. I play a lot not just on the low strings, and felt the KT77's added a bit of nice compression, but not nearly as dry/tight as any EL34 I have tried in a recto.

 

[tfridgen]

I have to order a set today....I am trying to decide between the KT77's and the SED 6L6's? I tried the KT77's yesterday and they sounded good. Just have to give them back to my friend. I had GT 6L6's in it....a bit more spongy, and fuzzy. I play a lot not just on the low strings, and felt the KT77's added a bit of nice compression, but not nearly as dry/tight as any EL34 I have tried in a recto.

I've had em all and prefer the SED 6l6's in my Roadster to the JJ kt77's(which still sound damn good). My faves lately are actually the JJ e34l's, a little more mid grind but keep my cleans in tact!

 

[crwnedblasphemy]

I have to order a set today....I am trying to decide between the KT77's and the SED 6L6's? I tried the KT77's yesterday and they sounded good. Just have to give them back to my friend. I had GT 6L6's in it....a bit more spongy, and fuzzy. I play a lot not just on the low strings, and felt the KT77's added a bit of nice compression, but not nearly as dry/tight as any EL34 I have tried in a recto.

I've had em all and prefer the SED 6l6's in my Roadster to the JJ kt77's(which still sound damn good). My faves lately are actually the JJ e34l's, a little more mid grind but keep my cleans in tact!

Can you tell me what tonal differences you notice? I play on the vintage mode mostly. More Alice in Chains type stuff...

 

[glassjaw7]

I safely ran 77s in my dual for several years. They have to be a certain "grade" and the amp has to be run in EL34 bias mode. I know a lot of people don't like JJs/Eurotubes but they are very knowledgable when it comes to tube swaps in Boogies. I went with 77s from them and my amp ran like a top and the tonal differences were exactly what I was looking for! I also went with JJ pres (NOT the high gain pres)and GZ34 rectifier tubes.

What all this did was make the recto clean and clear, with a slight mid shift. It reallymade a difference in clearing up the fizz. The top end still had a nice "sizzle" but it was much clearer. Bottom got a bit tighter too.

All the recto demos I put up on YouTube are with 77s. Check em out under the name cordanscedo.

Here's one of the last ones I did on my iPhone

Was this stock? Or Friedman modded?

WeLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!! ?????????????

Oops sorry guys, been away... Yes this clip was done after the mod but honestly, I got the biggest change from the tube change. The mod was just the icing on the cake. More of a "feel" thing.
And Greg, while I respect your mad recording skills and think you're an all-star Rig-Talker and consider you a friend, F.U! The 77s sound better!!! LOVE those tubes in the recto.
Here's one in vintage mode with 77s BEFORE the Friedman mod. It's more about using less gain and knowing how to dial it in IMO. I just went for the mod to fine tune and refine an already great tone.

 

[Moshaholic]

I safely ran 77s in my dual for several years. They have to be a certain "grade" and the amp has to be run in EL34 bias mode. I know a lot of people don't like JJs/Eurotubes but they are very knowledgable when it comes to tube swaps in Boogies. I went with 77s from them and my amp ran like a top and the tonal differences were exactly what I was looking for! I also went with JJ pres (NOT the high gain pres)and GZ34 rectifier tubes.

What all this did was make the recto clean and clear, with a slight mid shift. It reallymade a difference in clearing up the fizz. The top end still had a nice "sizzle" but it was much clearer. Bottom got a bit tighter too.

All the recto demos I put up on YouTube are with 77s. Check em out under the name cordanscedo.

Here's one of the last ones I did on my iPhone

Was this stock? Or Friedman modded?

WeLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!! ?????????????

Oops sorry guys, been away... Yes this clip was done after the mod but honestly, I got the biggest change from the tube change. The mod was just the icing on the cake. More of a "feel" thing.
And Greg, while I respect your mad recording skills and think you're an all-star Rig-Talker and consider you a friend, F.U! The 77s sound better!!! LOVE those tubes in the recto.
Here's one in vintage mode with 77s BEFORE the Friedman mod. It's more about using less gain and knowing how to dial it in IMO. I just went for the mod to fine tune and refine an already great tone.

That stock clips sounds killer but honestly, lets face it, it's a just "rectifier" ok, I mean like come on (removes 3 inch cork from backside, holds up to nostrils and breathes deeply...)

Seriously, Id rather spend 4k and drill 57 extra holes through the front and back of my vintage amp and wait 17 months to get it back, now thats what I'm talking about.

 

[Moshaholic]

I safely ran 77s in my dual for several years. They have to be a certain "grade" and the amp has to be run in EL34 bias mode. I know a lot of people don't like JJs/Eurotubes but they are very knowledgable when it comes to tube swaps in Boogies. I went with 77s from them and my amp ran like a top and the tonal differences were exactly what I was looking for! I also went with JJ pres (NOT the high gain pres)and GZ34 rectifier tubes.

What all this did was make the recto clean and clear, with a slight mid shift. It reallymade a difference in clearing up the fizz. The top end still had a nice "sizzle" but it was much clearer. Bottom got a bit tighter too.

All the recto demos I put up on YouTube are with 77s. Check em out under the name cordanscedo.

Here's one of the last ones I did on my iPhone

Was this stock? Or Friedman modded?

WeLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!! ?????????????

Oops sorry guys, been away... Yes this clip was done after the mod but honestly, I got the biggest change from the tube change. The mod was just the icing on the cake. More of a "feel" thing.
And Greg, while I respect your mad recording skills and think you're an all-star Rig-Talker and consider you a friend, F.U! The 77s sound better!!! LOVE those tubes in the recto.
Here's one in vintage mode with 77s BEFORE the Friedman mod. It's more about using less gain and knowing how to dial it in IMO. I just went for the mod to fine tune and refine an already great tone.

That stock clip sounds ABSOLUTLY killer!!! But honestly, lets face it, it's a just "rectifier" ok, I mean like come on... (removes 3 inch cork from backside, holds up to nostrils and breathes deeply...)

Seriously, you should just spend 4k and drill 57 extra holes through the front and back of a stock/vintage amp and wait 17 months to get it back... Now thats what I'm talking about.

 

[glassjaw7]

I safely ran 77s in my dual for several years. They have to be a certain "grade" and the amp has to be run in EL34 bias mode. I know a lot of people don't like JJs/Eurotubes but they are very knowledgable when it comes to tube swaps in Boogies. I went with 77s from them and my amp ran like a top and the tonal differences were exactly what I was looking for! I also went with JJ pres (NOT the high gain pres)and GZ34 rectifier tubes.

What all this did was make the recto clean and clear, with a slight mid shift. It reallymade a difference in clearing up the fizz. The top end still had a nice "sizzle" but it was much clearer. Bottom got a bit tighter too.

All the recto demos I put up on YouTube are with 77s. Check em out under the name cordanscedo.

Here's one of the last ones I did on my iPhone

Was this stock? Or Friedman modded?

WeLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!! ?????????????

Oops sorry guys, been away... Yes this clip was done after the mod but honestly, I got the biggest change from the tube change. The mod was just the icing on the cake. More of a "feel" thing.
And Greg, while I respect your mad recording skills and think you're an all-star Rig-Talker and consider you a friend, F.U! The 77s sound better!!! LOVE those tubes in the recto.
Here's one in vintage mode with 77s BEFORE the Friedman mod. It's more about using less gain and knowing how to dial it in IMO. I just went for the mod to fine tune and refine an already great tone.

That stock clip sounds ABSOLUTLY killer!!! But honestly, lets face it, it's a just "rectifier" ok, I mean like come on... (removes 3 inch cork from backside, holds up to nostrils and breathes deeply...)

Seriously, you should just spend 4k and drill 57 extra holes through the front and back of a stock/vintage amp and wait 17 months to get it back... Now thats what I'm talking about.

Thanks man. Keep in mind that the first clip is in Modern mode through the recto 212 with v30's, while the unmodded video was done in Vintage mode and played through a front-loaded Carvin 412 with old carvin(Eminence?) 100 watt speakers. The carvin speakers are much smoother and creamier while the v30s are tighter with more bite and aggression.
I liked the amp better obviously after Dave worked on it, but you can get EXCELLENT rectifier tones with the 77s. It sounded so much better with those tubes, I couldn't believe it actually. My videos are pretty lame as far as recording quality, but I definitely think they show the improvements the 77s make.

 

[Moshaholic]

I safely ran 77s in my dual for several years. They have to be a certain "grade" and the amp has to be run in EL34 bias mode. I know a lot of people don't like JJs/Eurotubes but they are very knowledgable when it comes to tube swaps in Boogies. I went with 77s from them and my amp ran like a top and the tonal differences were exactly what I was looking for! I also went with JJ pres (NOT the high gain pres)and GZ34 rectifier tubes.

What all this did was make the recto clean and clear, with a slight mid shift. It reallymade a difference in clearing up the fizz. The top end still had a nice "sizzle" but it was much clearer. Bottom got a bit tighter too.

All the recto demos I put up on YouTube are with 77s. Check em out under the name cordanscedo.

Here's one of the last ones I did on my iPhone

Was this stock? Or Friedman modded?

WeLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!! ?????????????

Oops sorry guys, been away... Yes this clip was done after the mod but honestly, I got the biggest change from the tube change. The mod was just the icing on the cake. More of a "feel" thing.
And Greg, while I respect your mad recording skills and think you're an all-star Rig-Talker and consider you a friend, F.U! The 77s sound better!!! LOVE those tubes in the recto.
Here's one in vintage mode with 77s BEFORE the Friedman mod. It's more about using less gain and knowing how to dial it in IMO. I just went for the mod to fine tune and refine an already great tone.

That stock clip sounds ABSOLUTLY killer!!! But honestly, lets face it, it's a just "rectifier" ok, I mean like come on... (removes 3 inch cork from backside, holds up to nostrils and breathes deeply...)

Seriously, you should just spend 4k and drill 57 extra holes through the front and back of a stock/vintage amp and wait 17 months to get it back... Now thats what I'm talking about.

Thanks man. Keep in mind that the first clip is in Modern mode through the recto 212 with v30's, while the unmodded video was done in Vintage mode and played through a front-loaded Carvin 412 with old carvin(Eminence?) 100 watt speakers. The carvin speakers are much smoother and creamier while the v30s are tighter with more bite and aggression.
I liked the amp better obviously after Dave worked on it, but you can get EXCELLENT rectifier tones with the 77s. It sounded so much better with those tubes, I couldn't believe it actually. My videos are pretty lame as far as recording quality, but I definitely think they show the improvements the 77s make.

I'm totaly sold on Rectos and am a big fan, and even more so with KT77's now... I'm glad they are not the "in crowd amp" these days as it keep s them cheap and plentiful on the market.