Blackmachine Guitars

[Stealthtastic]

Hate to break it to anyone buying a Blackmachine... but you aren't getting a real Blackmachine... he has subbed out his work ENTIRELY to someone else, and he simply checks over the guitar before he sends it out... I've been E-mailing Doug for quite awhile asking about a left handed Blackmachine... and I absolutely flipped SHIT when last month he replied and said there were some "in the works"... only to inform me he has no input in the builds and they are done by a "friend"...

When I asked him about specs or possible progress pics he totally brushed me off and told me he had several buyers who were ready to immediately pay, and made me feel like I should be privileged that he was even offering me a guitar... only to just again ask when I would be sending money...

He has put himself in a position where the hype surrounding these things is so ridiculous that he doesn't even have to build the fucking things anymore and sit back and collect money... I will still say I love the look of Blackmachines and would still love to own a REAL one... but I honestly don't think Doug is even building guitars anymore...

....fuck that noise....

Edit: I am not saying that the guitars being produced aren't probably top notch... but the whole mystique behind Blackmachine was that they had some special mojo about them or whatever... if it's something so simple that another builder can just copy and stamp a name on it... well, I'm just not interested in that anymore

I'm assuming this was for a B6? Doug and Feline have both stated publicly that the B6s are built by Feline Guitars and Doug just assembles them.

Yeah Doug and Feline have stated multiple times that they both work on the b6 models together. There is no hidden conspiracy here lol

Feline has been in the game a long time now too, his work is solid.

 

[Mizati20]

Hate to break it to anyone buying a Blackmachine... but you aren't getting a real Blackmachine... he has subbed out his work ENTIRELY to someone else, and he simply checks over the guitar before he sends it out... I've been E-mailing Doug for quite awhile asking about a left handed Blackmachine... and I absolutely flipped SHIT when last month he replied and said there were some "in the works"... only to inform me he has no input in the builds and they are done by a "friend"...

When I asked him about specs or possible progress pics he totally brushed me off and told me he had several buyers who were ready to immediately pay, and made me feel like I should be privileged that he was even offering me a guitar... only to just again ask when I would be sending money...

He has put himself in a position where the hype surrounding these things is so ridiculous that he doesn't even have to build the fucking things anymore and sit back and collect money... I will still say I love the look of Blackmachines and would still love to own a REAL one... but I honestly don't think Doug is even building guitars anymore...

....fuck that noise....

Edit: I am not saying that the guitars being produced aren't probably top notch... but the whole mystique behind Blackmachine was that they had some special mojo about them or whatever... if it's something so simple that another builder can just copy and stamp a name on it... well, I'm just not interested in that anymore

I'm assuming this was for a B6? Doug and Feline have both stated publicly that the B6s are built by Feline Guitars and Doug just assembles them.

Doug isn't assembling anything... he told me he would "Have a look at it" before it was shipped... that's just not a Blackmachine to me...

 

[Mudder]

I don't know. I'd be willing to bet other high end builders aren't personally hand building their guitars either. Would you suggest a Suhr isn't a Suhr if John doesn't build it? Or an Anderson? If you get a product worth the money then you have what you ordered. Feline builds a hell of a guitar, it's not like they hooked up with some shady outfit. Folks spend big money for Dusenbergs even though those guitar are substantially Korean.

 

[Stealthtastic]

I don't know. I'd be willing to bet other high end builders aren't personally hand building their guitars either. Would you suggest a Suhr isn't a Suhr if John doesn't build it? Or an Anderson? If you get a product worth the money then you have what you ordered. Feline builds a hell of a guitar, it's not like they hooked up with some shady outfit. Folks spend big money for Dusenbergs even though those guitar are substantially Korean.

Yeah Suhr does it, Anderson does is, Nic Huber does it, Ritter does it (iirc?), pretty much all the high end brands do it. You can only put out so many guitars a year otherwise.

I do agree with you btw, which is why I want a b7!!!

 

[cardinal]

So does this guy (either Doug or Feline) still make 7 strings that a person can actually purchase?

 

[Stealthtastic]

So does this guy (either Doug or Feline) still make 7 strings that a person can actually purchase?

You can buy a b7, but the list is full. Its also like $7500 IIRC.

 

[Workhorse]

I know this thread is a little old, but there a few things I think are somewhat misconstrued here.

First is regarding Daemoness guitars, one of which I am a proud owner of and have extensive experience playing a few models Dylan Humphries has come up with. While some might consider him pretentious or unnecessarily abusive, I think you have missed the entire point of his small business. Humphries is all about Heavy Metal - every aspect of his builds, which are quite unique and laboriously put together - is meant to reflect that. He is not a traditional luthier, nor do his guitars aspire to anything but building a metal machine. His e-mail might not be everyones cup of tea, but to be quite honest - as beautiful as his guitars are, it was quite foolish and arrogant of Alex to e-mail him about an endorsement, because if you just take the time to look at the limited models he produces - his inclination is very, very clear. And, he is not doing it for the money, or else he would cater to a far bigger demographic.

Now, is there a uniting philosophy to metal? It depends on who you ask. Dylan sees heavy metal as a powerful form of expression which is more philosophical and poetic. If Steve Vai or some other non-metal but talented musician would have e-mailed him, I think he would have had a very different response - because there is a difference between 'making a living', and being a serious musician - like it or not.

 

[Workhorse]

So does this guy (either Doug or Feline) still make 7 strings that a person can actually purchase?

If you check the blackmachine facebook page, he still makes guitars for sale. He does not run a custom shop, so he has the luxury of building models to his liking and knows that someone will buy it.

I wouldn't even bother simply because they're too expensive, and I can get something from Daemoness, RAN, Vik or another luthier that is completely modified to my liking and still cost <$5000. The last blackmachine I saw sold on ebay was second hand and went for about $6000.

I would strongly suggest trying to find one to try out, there are people who own them, and they have this mystical reputation to their quality, but by almost any metric - people have spoken extremely highly about how good they are, but you could probably get something just as good from the Mayones Master Builder collection.

 

[Stealthtastic]

^ As someone thats owned Daemoness and Blackmachine...Im going to be completely honest and say the Daemoness is not as nice. Its still a fucking sick guitar but its not a BM.

 

[spirit7]

The only question to ask about BM is why I don't own one...

-C

 

[JimmyBlind]

I've had a good shred on some of the early models. James, the UK distributor for Diezel, has a cool BM Tele. One of the first Doug made They're awesome guitars. More of a collector's item nowadays of course. I also played Pin from Sikth's BM a few times when my old band used to support them occasionally.

I think Doug only builds private stock instruments now. You'll be looking at serious money to get him to build you one and he will, of course, for the right price.

 

[Workhorse]

^ As someone thats owned Daemoness and Blackmachine...Im going to be completely honest and say the Daemoness is not as nice. Its still a fucking sick guitar but its not a BM.

May I ask when you got your Daemoness? Was it a recent build or pre 2010?

 

[Stealthtastic]

^ As someone thats owned Daemoness and Blackmachine...Im going to be completely honest and say the Daemoness is not as nice. Its still a fucking sick guitar but its not a BM.

May I ask when you got your Daemoness? Was it a recent build or pre 2010?

Relatively recent, i think 2011-2012ish? It plays really well but i dunno, theres something about the bm

 

[grooveHT]

Hi Alex,

Thanks for the interest in my guitars. I don’t know if your aware of this but guys who are into metal hate pop music. The reason we hate it is that it is the soundtrack to the society that metal rebels against. Rampant commercialism of the human soul, vapid obsession with the self, almost non existant attention spans (who’s No1 this week?), detestable senses of entitlement (“I wanna be a billionaire, sooo freakin’ bad..” Bruno Mars). The list goes on. Most pop music that airs these days, typically documents human behaviours that occur at the end of a civilisation. [SIC]

Let us for a minute juxtapose these multitudes of sin with the entirely more socially concerned and responsible attitudes that inspire metal musicians. Metal sees the bigger picture. We see a story of mankind. We see the journey to modern thought. We see history, and the progression of ideas and actions. We see the failure of the human ego when granted power. We see foolish, wise, brave, cowardly,strong and weak people. The main thrust of metals philosophical message is that there is a possibility that the world could end as mankind continues to wail on towards its own self made destruction. For someone born behind the iron curtain Alex, I thought these themes would really resonate with you. But apparently you would rather work with Britney Spears. Please correct me if I’m wrong. I would love to hear that I am wrong about you because then I would know that one more extra person is as concerned for mankind as I am. But, as things stand, I cannot endorse you. I cannot even sell you a guitar.

Dylan

So, you guys applaud this? Really? Because to me this is the most ridiculous, pretentious bullshit I think I've ever read. How about, "Sorry man, I don't have any endorsement spots at this time." If he doesn't want to sell the guy guy a guitar? This guy is trying to make a living playing guitar, which is a hard fucking thing to do. So what if he makes his bread playing for Brittney? Maybe he records killer metal stuff when he's not with her. I guess this guy thinks it's better to starve for the troo metulz. Pathetic. I guess I don't get being so disrespectful to a guitar player who asked for an endorsement and is trying to make a living.

Like any type of music, metal has it's good and bad. To portray metal music as some kind of deep, savior of the world music and Spears pop as all that is evil is dumb and the guy should be embarrassed frankly. Enjoyment of music is subjective and it's just entertainment, nothing that is going to change the world. People like what they like and if the guy really believes the drivel he wrote, he still didn't have to spew it at a guy just trying to make a living who asked for an endorsement.

Support this guy all you want, but even if I was interested in his guitars (I'm not) and I could get one, I wouldn't buy one...

Steve

Dammit Steve, thanks for writing this more eloquently than I would have, so I didn't have to type out a reply myself. Instead, I can just write "What Steve said."

 

[Workhorse]

Hi Alex,

Thanks for the interest in my guitars. I don’t know if your aware of this but guys who are into metal hate pop music. The reason we hate it is that it is the soundtrack to the society that metal rebels against. Rampant commercialism of the human soul, vapid obsession with the self, almost non existant attention spans (who’s No1 this week?), detestable senses of entitlement (“I wanna be a billionaire, sooo freakin’ bad..” Bruno Mars). The list goes on. Most pop music that airs these days, typically documents human behaviours that occur at the end of a civilisation. [SIC]

Let us for a minute juxtapose these multitudes of sin with the entirely more socially concerned and responsible attitudes that inspire metal musicians. Metal sees the bigger picture. We see a story of mankind. We see the journey to modern thought. We see history, and the progression of ideas and actions. We see the failure of the human ego when granted power. We see foolish, wise, brave, cowardly,strong and weak people. The main thrust of metals philosophical message is that there is a possibility that the world could end as mankind continues to wail on towards its own self made destruction. For someone born behind the iron curtain Alex, I thought these themes would really resonate with you. But apparently you would rather work with Britney Spears. Please correct me if I’m wrong. I would love to hear that I am wrong about you because then I would know that one more extra person is as concerned for mankind as I am. But, as things stand, I cannot endorse you. I cannot even sell you a guitar.

Dylan

So, you guys applaud this? Really? Because to me this is the most ridiculous, pretentious bullshit I think I've ever read. How about, "Sorry man, I don't have any endorsement spots at this time." If he doesn't want to sell the guy guy a guitar? This guy is trying to make a living playing guitar, which is a hard fucking thing to do. So what if he makes his bread playing for Brittney? Maybe he records killer metal stuff when he's not with her. I guess this guy thinks it's better to starve for the troo metulz. Pathetic. I guess I don't get being so disrespectful to a guitar player who asked for an endorsement and is trying to make a living.

Like any type of music, metal has it's good and bad. To portray metal music as some kind of deep, savior of the world music and Spears pop as all that is evil is dumb and the guy should be embarrassed frankly. Enjoyment of music is subjective and it's just entertainment, nothing that is going to change the world. People like what they like and if the guy really believes the drivel he wrote, he still didn't have to spew it at a guy just trying to make a living who asked for an endorsement.

Support this guy all you want, but even if I was interested in his guitars (I'm not) and I could get one, I wouldn't buy one...

Steve

I would have to somewhat disagree with you. I agree, Dylans post was a little rough for a guy who wanted an endorsement from whom, but I think you missed out on why he started a shop. Dylan could have easily turned his guitar building abilities and worked for a custom shop like Jackson/Ibanez/ESP - he was already working in a high end custom workshop in the UK. He instead, went to build his own business and dedicated it to heavy metal, he is a little philosophical about it - but I enjoy an intellectual argument like any other - it's not like he is the first philosophize about the meaning of heavy metal.

For the record, you are not 'making bread' by working for Spears or Rihanna, thats an entirely different ballpark - he's gotten involved in pretty high end project with Eminem, so trust me, he's making really good money. While I understand, rent needs to be paid and kids need to be raised, Dylan might feel that true musicianship comes at the expense of that - something not everyone believes.

Also, you're pretty darn stupid if you've made a career in pop music, and then expect endorsement from an almost exclusively heavy metal luthier.

Not to overkill, but I am all happy with my experience with him, and friends of mine who own his guitars have nothing but praise for his instruments.

 

[Spaceboy]

SSO.... I hate that freaking website especially the mods and clicky teenage population. I have been banned there multiple times for the most childish reasons, including making a comment about not liking a certain popular band's vocals.

 

[JimmyBlind]

SSO.... I hate that freaking website especially the mods and clicky teenage population. I have been banned there multiple times for the most childish reasons, including making a comment about not liking a certain popular band's vocals.

Poor show when, on a music-related forum, subjective opinion is censored.

Fuck that forum. I joined this forum because it's balanced & has at least some humility about it.

 

[Anonymous]

I would have to somewhat disagree with you. I agree, Dylans post was a little rough for a guy who wanted an endorsement from whom, but I think you missed out on why he started a shop. Dylan could have easily turned his guitar building abilities and worked for a custom shop like Jackson/Ibanez/ESP - he was already working in a high end custom workshop in the UK. He instead, went to build his own business and dedicated it to heavy metal, he is a little philosophical about it - but I enjoy an intellectual argument like any other - it's not like he is the first philosophize about the meaning of heavy metal.

Disagree all you want and Dylan can have whatever philosophy that suits him and work for whoever he wants including himself, I could give a fuck less. I don't give a shit why he started his shop, that is not relevant. It's perfectly fine to cater to a certain genre of musicians and not want to be associated with others (I think it's stupid, but he can do what he wants, I have no problem with that), there was just no reason to be rude to a guy who had a simple ask and no reason to spew his personal, troo metulz drivel on the guy. That is the only thing that really matters to me in evaluating the situation. Metal means absolutely zero to the vast majority of the people in the world and, even if it did, it is musical entertainment, not a movement for a new world order.

For the record, you are not 'making bread' by working for Spears or Rihanna, thats an entirely different ballpark - he's gotten involved in pretty high end project with Eminem, so trust me, he's making really good money. While I understand, rent needs to be paid and kids need to be raised, Dylan might feel that true musicianship comes at the expense of that - something not everyone believes.

It's idiotic to think that just because you don't like a particular style of music that the hired guns playing it are not true musicians because they happen to play on it. Maybe he's working on a killer, metal-oriented solo record, but Dylan would never know that because he was a horse's ass to the guy for no reason. Also, what does it matter whether the guy is making a ton of money or just skating by? All I said was that he was making a living playing guitar, which is a very difficult thing to do. If he's making a ton, more power to him. Still no reason to be rude to the guy.

Also, you're pretty darn stupid if you've made a career in pop music, and then expect endorsement from an almost exclusively heavy metal luthier.

Fuck that. Who is Dylan? God? How much does this guy have to investigate the fucking luthier's personal belief system? Once again, how do you or anyone else know what this guy does in his spare time. Perhaps he does nothing but troo metulz. He asked for an endorsement. Pretty easy to just say no and move on... but this pompous ass felt he had to insult the guy and spew his mindless drivel...

Not to overkill, but I am all happy with my experience with him, and friends of mine who own his guitars have nothing but praise for his instruments.

Wonderful, however, if I'd have received an email like the one he sent, my response would have been, "Go fuck yourself". The only way I'd get one of his guitars is to buy one used and make a million videos of myself playing the greatest hits of Britney... Bitches...

Steve

 

[Tuckerbomb]

What's funny is that all this guy has to do is find one second hand and use it on every upcoming tour & video. That right there would do more harm to the "metal only" image than the endorsement would.

 

[Anonymous]

What's funny is that all this guy has to do is find one second hand and use it on every upcoming tour & video. That right there would do more harm to the "metal only" image than the endorsement would.

Really! I'd paint it pink with an airbrush of Britney on it...

Steve