Can you use a Bogner 101B XTC head w/a 100 watt Marshall cab without blowing something ?

glpg80 said:
@Scumback Speakers
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May have to or i have 2 old British V30's i could do the 1/2 & 1/2 thing. Prolly makes sense.
The 101b also has a 1/2 power switch but i like 100 screamin watts.
Anyone know if the Bogner 101b XTC has serial or parallel loop or both ?
Hopefully i will be a Bogner owner by tomorrow.
 
I been playing 100watt amps into various/ single GB cabs for decades. The only time I blew a speaker was a 100 watt speaker in an isolation box running a dimed 100 plexi but it took many times before it blew.
 
Ask them
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Samhain said:
May have to or i have 2 old British V30's i could do the 1/2 & 1/2 thing. Prolly makes sense.
The 101b also has a 1/2 power switch but i like 100 screamin watts.
Anyone know if the Bogner 101b XTC has serial or parallel loop or both ?
Hopefully i will be a Bogner owner by tomorrow.
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You’re in for a treat. My Bogner is louder than my refreshed 74 6550 loaded Marshall. I only think my metroplex is as loud.
 
Are you intending on maxing out the volume on the Ecstasy? Not really an amp that you max out. There’s a video from Johan Segeborn where he tests how much a greenback will take and it takes a hell of a lot.
 
It might be helpful to get the distorted wattage rating and go from there. Those speakers have probably been used over their power rating for their entire lives considering how many watts a distorted 100w Marshall produces.
 
skoora said:
Are you intending on maxing out the volume on the Ecstasy? Not really an amp that you max out. There’s a video from Johan Segeborn where he tests how much a greenback will take and it takes a hell of a lot.
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No. 4 to 5 on the Master if that would be as high id likely ever go.

Does the 101b XTC have a bias trimmer ?
 
Samhain said:
No. 4 to 5 on the Master if that would be as high id likely ever go.

Does the 101b XTC have a bias trimmer ?
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My XTC will peel paint off walls at 2. It’s a loud amp. You’re likely going to want to have a written will and notify next of kin before flipping standby 😂
 
Samhain said:
G12M 25 watt 75 hz 1978 Blackbacks, not reissues.
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The question is, when you fry those speakers with the Bogner, are you going to admit what you did was kinda dumb? I'll post this Marshall JCM 800 spec pic ONE MORE TIME. Please note that 50w amps produce in excess of 90w at 10% distortion (around 7 on the volume knob). 100w amps put out in excess of 170w at 10% distortion, again around 7 on the volume knob.

So you want to try a 120w Bogner into a 100w Marshall cab that's 43 years old, and do what, play the amp around 3-4 on the volume knob (120w), or 7 on the volume knob (around 190w)?

And don't forget, this spec sheet shows the watts of the guitar plugged straight in, no boosts, pedals, fx, delays or anything that increases the signal out of the amp.

As Dirty Harry would say "So, you feeling lucky, punk?"

Get a cab with four 65w or higher speakers. The Bogner does really well with the Scumback M75's. That's why Reinhold has them in his showroom in North Hollywood, in case you didn't know.


Samhain said:
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Not everyone can afford your speakers Jim, inflation ya know. Were getting squeezed like everyone else/
Some of us do the best we can with what we got.

I just went to Aldi's today 4 bags of groceries = $100 bucks for years we've gotten 6 or seven bags for the same price. Cheap food not gourmet.
Real estate/Gibson guitars you name it sky high prices. $3.60 a gallon gas.
Medical bills[cancer survivor, car repairs.
Music gear is a luxury for me.
Ive never blown an amp or speaker in 45 years.
Thanks for the snark anyway.
Despite all the bullshit we scratch out a living.
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Racerxrated said:
It’s not about need my friend. It’s about what crushing volume does to those poor crying Celestions…pushing a tube amp/speaker cab to its limits is a beautiful thing. If only for a short time anyway.
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I agree. My point is, the sweet spot on most amps aren't on 10. I've had my Greenback cab for about 5 years, and have had numerous 100 watt plus amps run through it awfully loud, and that was typically less than half way on the volume. Most amps bring the goods at 10-11 o'clock. Past that starts to sound less pleasant.
 
Samhain said:
Not everyone can afford your speakers Jim, inflation ya know. Were getting squeezed like everyone else/
Some of us do the best we can with what we got.

I just went to Aldi's today 4 bags of groceries = $100 bucks for years we've gotten 6 or seven bags for the same price. Cheap food not gourmet.
Real estate/Gibson guitars you name it sky high prices. $3.60 a gallon gas.
Medical bills[cancer survivor, car repairs.
Music gear is a luxury for me.
Ive never blown an amp or speaker in 45 years.
Thanks for the snark anyway.
Despite all the bullshit we scratch out a living.
1ql968.jpg
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I've been saying the same thing about power handling of speakers (double what your amp is rated at for safety) for 19 years. I'm sure I've mentioned it here many times since I joined over a dozen years ago. There are two long threads on this very subject on the TGP and Marshall Amp Forums right now, and then this one here on this forum a few weeks back.

https://www.rig-talk.com/forum/threads/scumback-m75-65w-agi-tale.228190/
After answering the same question on three forums, I get a little short with members, sorry.

On the other hand, you know with a 120w into a 100w cab that you can't be thinking you're good to go, either.

And just because you've never fried anything (yet), what you're proposing here is a voice coil melting experiment.

I just moved from California, you don't need to explain gas prices of $5 per gallon and going up, food (it's half of CA here in AZ), medical costs (too much crap to detail including my own cancer scares in 2008 and a new one I found out about yesterday), so excuse me while I try to keep you from making a stupid mistake and frying four old BlackBacks that you probably would like to keep intact, correct?

So, with that, I'll just bow out of this thread with another DH quote "Man's gotta know his limitations." Good luck, keep it under 4 on the Bogner.
 
I've pounded an EVH 412 with EVH speakers (25w Heritage greenbacks) with a few 120w amps and many 100w amps including multiple Wizards for the last 5-6 years. No issues what so ever.
 
MetalHeadMike said:
I've pounded an EVH 412 with EVH speakers (25w Heritage greenbacks) with a few 120w amps and many 100w amps including multiple Wizards for the last 5-6 years. No issues what so ever.
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But we're not talking 43 year old vintage spec speakers like Samhain's BlackBacks from 78. The voice coils are way different on the old ones vs what they call a 25w Heritage G12M now.
 
Scumback Speakers said:
I've been saying the same thing about power handling of speakers (double what your amp is rated at for safety) for 19 years. I'm sure I've mentioned it here many times since I joined over a dozen years ago. There are two long threads on this very subject on the TGP and Marshall Amp Forums right now, and then this one here on this forum a few weeks back.

https://www.rig-talk.com/forum/threads/scumback-m75-65w-agi-tale.228190/
After answering the same question on three forums, I get a little short with members, sorry.

On the other hand, you know with a 120w into a 100w cab that you can't be thinking you're good to go, either.

And just because you've never fried anything (yet), what you're proposing here is a voice coil melting experiment.

I just moved from California, you don't need to explain gas prices of $5 per gallon and going up, food (it's half of CA here in AZ), medical costs (too much crap to detail including my own cancer scares in 2008 and a new one I found out about yesterday), so excuse me while I try to keep you from making a stupid mistake and frying four old BlackBacks that you probably would like to keep intact, correct?

So, with that, I'll just bow out of this thread with another DH quote "Man's gotta know his limitations." Good luck, keep it under 4 on the Bogner.
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In 1981 while reporting for duty to my first ship just off the plane @ the San Diego airport i went to the cig machine as i had run out. $7 bucks a pack that was 40 years ago. I could never afford LA life prices now. Good thing i quit the tobacco 20 years ago.
Jim i like your speakers and you got me dead to rights with the power handling so its i that owe you the apology.
$169 for an M75 is not that bad. We do okay but things are tight at the moment. I was feeling indignant and like a victim for some reason yesterday but we are blessed. Life is good.
As for the Bogner it will be a trade deal.
Regards/peace.
 
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The tricky thing about this topic is that players tend to use their n=1 experiment to justify their actions. In other words "I cranked my 100w Marshall into my 100w cab and had no problems."

What I've learned is that voice coils can take a beating, but just like anything they wear out over time...especially when abused. So yeah, newish speakers are gonna handle some abuse but if you continue to exceed their rated spec, they will eventually fail. How long will this take? I'd contact Bogner and see if they have some data to share. Every amp is different, but Jim's post is a good example that 4xEL34 doesn't top out at 100 watts!
 
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