Clean to Mean Rack Tones 12/27/25

[Dave L]

Yeah, we´re definitely splitting hairs at this point, they´re all great. I have the 4000 in mix one as a chorus/flanger machine, feeding the reverb and the H3000 in mix two, but I could wire any of them up anywhere for any application and be just as happy.

 

[ChurchHill]

Yeah, the 4000 has its own thing going on, too. It's just as great, maybe more so in some ways, as the 3000. They just don't sound the same, close, but different. I wouldn't trade one for the other. I think the Eclipse fits somewhere between the two. It's got some great sounds, just not quite as charismatic as the others, more modern sounding, maybe. Splitting hairs is exactly what we're doing. They are all great units and still just as viable today as ever.

 

[mentoneman]

i remember the first time hearing a pcm 70 was in my friend’s studio with headphones. that left a major impression on me.

the initial impression was “that’s the SOUND” you hear everywhere in music but don’t know it until you hear one in person

and it was the first time the effect sounded like a source being affected was actually physically moving away from me and spreading out versus just a generic one dimensional washy “reverb” being added.

 

[ChurchHill]

Interesting that you say that. I've been thinking about picking up a PCM70 lately. I've got a Lexicon 300 and a PCM81, but the PCM70 was always on my dream list. Might have to start seriously looking for one.

 

[Anje]

Yep, the Lexicon PCM70 is a true classic! Nothing quite sounds like it, short of going to the bigger old 4U studio giants.

 

[Dave L]

Yeah, I also had the 80 before but never dug it quite like the 70. Fantastic unit in its own right, obviously. My core tone when I´m not fussing around with sounds but just playing is H3000 pitch, plate reverb from a Kurzweil KSP8 and a PCM70 for delays, and then the last bit is when I kick in the 4000 for modulation.

 

[Anje]

Yes, I think we discussed it in a few other threads in the past, the PCM80/81 are really great but much "cleaner" / "hifi" sounding. Much less "character" by default.
They can do great complex effects though, very tweakable; I use mine next to the older stuff mainly for some special effects on particular parts, mostly using an exp pedal.

I had to look up for some photo of the main big guitar rig, love this stuff:

 

[Exo-metal]

Yes, I think we discussed it in a few other threads in the past, the PCM80/81 are really great but much "cleaner" / "hifi" sounding. Much less "character" by default.
They can do great complex effects though, very tweakable; I use mine next to the older stuff mainly for some special effects on particular parts, mostly using an exp pedal.

I had to look up for some photo of the main big guitar rig, love this stuff:

View attachment 439586

Oh dear Lord my heart

 

[mentoneman]

i will also say this about old v new

the newer stuff tends to become increasingly pristine sounding and that has certainly been my experience with the eventide and lexicon stuff. some producers may want that added transparency just as some would rather mix on an SSL console vs Neve or Trident.

but worth mentioning, the more attractive thing about newer boxes is the evolved internal routing/mixing options and improved menu layouts.

 

[mentoneman]

Yes, I think we discussed it in a few other threads in the past, the PCM80/81 are really great but much "cleaner" / "hifi" sounding. Much less "character" by default.
They can do great complex effects though, very tweakable; I use mine next to the older stuff mainly for some special effects on particular parts, mostly using an exp pedal.

I had to look up for some photo of the main big guitar rig, love this stuff:

View attachment 439586

dual 42s….you ANIMAL!
that rig you have is one of the nicest “compact” racks i’ve seen!

 

[Exo-metal]

And he tops it off with Park towers for his stereo mix obviously...what a beast!!!

 

[mentoneman]

for the diehard Eventide fan, here’s a very thorough sashay down the annals of their studio fx evolution

https://reverb.com/news/tech-behind-eventide-h3000-ultra-harmonizer

 

[Anje]

Thanks for the kind words
That rig does sound fantastic.
I have a couple of sized down « B » versions that I used to move around weekly.
I’ve actually been thinking about doing a new version, more to come.

 

[Shask]

i will also say this about old v new

the newer stuff tends to become increasingly pristine sounding and that has certainly been my experience with the eventide and lexicon stuff. some producers may want that added transparency just as some would rather mix on an SSL console vs Neve or Trident.

but worth mentioning, the more attractive thing about newer boxes is the evolved internal routing/mixing options and improved menu layouts.

Yeah, routing and easy editing / computer editor is definitely a plus when it comes to newer stuff.

 

[Little B]

Yes, I think we discussed it in a few other threads in the past, the PCM80/81 are really great but much "cleaner" / "hifi" sounding. Much less "character" by default.
They can do great complex effects though, very tweakable; I use mine next to the older stuff mainly for some special effects on particular parts, mostly using an exp pedal.

I had to look up for some photo of the main big guitar rig, love this stuff:

View attachment 439586

Very nice! Mix pedal for adding dry or wet/ dry? If that board is a axcess,I had one.great board for sure

 

[mentoneman]

Yeah, I also had the 80 before but never dug it quite like the 70. Fantastic unit in its own right, obviously. My core tone when I´m not fussing around with sounds but just playing is H3000 pitch, plate reverb from a Kurzweil KSP8 and a PCM70 for delays, and then the last bit is when I kick in the 4000 for modulation.

i was never much of a soundscape/shoegaze guy although i can totally appreciate that part of the audio realm that italo and others bask in. i’m more a big fan of the concert hall reverbs primarily, with the delays and choruses and pitch fx thrown in the mix here and there.

the 80/81 has a ton of special fx with dynamic pitch/panning stuff in play that is right up there with the eventides. i also felt that the fundamental sound of my 80 was closer to the 70 than the 91 i used in a PA rack for about a decade. i have the 42 second delay upgrade in mine as well.

a while ago someone in another forum asked me about the reverbs in the 80 compared to modern pedals and i made some quick iphone clips taking my normal concert verbs and just turning up the mix, stretching out the tails and eq filtering a bit differently to accommodate how the sound melts away. added pedal chorus and flipped pickup positions to show just how much those touches change things.

 

[mentoneman]

Yeah, routing and easy editing / computer editor is definitely a plus when it comes to newer stuff.

we interrupt our regularly scheduled vintage lovefest to briefly recognize the new school…

still early into scratching the surface of this combo but at first blush, this has the makings of a pretty potent self-contained micro rig!

makes me wonder if one of those tonex mini pedals and an AM4 could be a super potent micro pedalboard!

don’t wanna get too tied up in this attention black hole atm because rewiring and dialing in the big rig is going to be my main focus for a while!

 

[Shask]

we interrupt our regularly scheduled vintage lovefest to briefly recognize the new school…

View attachment 439617

still early into scratching the surface of this combo but at first blush, this has the makings of a pretty potent self-contained micro rig!

makes me wonder if one of those tonex mini pedals and an AM4 could be a super potent micro pedalboard!

don’t wanna get too tied up in this attention black hole atm because rewiring and dialing in the big rig is going to be my main focus for a while!

I am curious if you think the Fractal can compete with the OG units.

Sometimes I think about a VP4, but I have the bigger units and dont move it, so I dont really need the small unit.

 

[mentoneman]

I am curious if you think the Fractal can compete with the OG units.

Sometimes I think about a VP4, but I have the bigger units and dont move it, so I dont really need the small unit.

without having spent tons of time with the axe II,
i can say that it seems as though the sound of the effects i have demoed are of a very high quality and in the same conversation as the OGs.

where i seem to hear a difference is in the way the core dry tone is being affected and mixed internally with the processed signal. the vibe i’m hearing/feeling triggers my instinct of wanting to use a mixer to preserve the integrity of the source dry signal to cast away any doubts.

part of my homework besides cleaning up my wiring with mogami studio cables and attempting to run the proper XLR-1/4” adapters where possible will be installing/wiring a sliding pedal tray for the triavatar, atomic punk, rnc comp and power supply.
i will likely pull the H9 and spx 900 to make room for the H3k…a worthy swap if you ask me!

 

[VonBonfire]

i was never much of a soundscape/shoegaze guy although i can totally appreciate that part of the audio realm that italo and others bask in. i’m more a big fan of the concert hall reverbs primarily, with the delays and choruses and pitch fx thrown in the mix here and there.

the 80/81 has a ton of special fx with dynamic pitch/panning stuff in play that is right up there with the eventides. i also felt that the fundamental sound of my 80 was closer to the 70 than the 91 i used in a PA rack for about a decade. i have the 42 second delay upgrade in mine as well.

a while ago someone in another forum asked me about the reverbs in the 80 compared to modern pedals and i made some quick iphone clips taking my normal concert verbs and just turning up the mix, stretching out the tails and eq filtering a bit differently to accommodate how the sound melts away. added pedal chorus and flipped pickup positions to show just how much those touches change things.

Sounds awesome. This reminds me of some of the cool tones I could get from my Meris Mercury 7. Problem was I don't have any know how when it comes to ambient stuff but some of the shimmers I could get were out of this world heavenly. I'd love to try the Mercury X but it's too rich for my blood just to have as a toy. I can't afford to keep anything that isn't strictly for business anymore unfortunately.