Compared a D-moll with a Schmidt

[vlammie]

Some background info; I was an early adaptor of Diezel, I bought a VH4 + 4x12 around 2000-2001, but sadly had to sell it living in an appartment for some years.
I' ve considered buying it back, but wanted to check out the newer offerings (back in the day, the VH4 and VH4S were the only models).

The schmidt intrigued me, and after reading some posts here the D-moll also, especially considering the price tag for the non-metal faceplate version.
Yesterday, I put the Schmidt and D-moll side to side using a mesa 4x12 with vintage 30's, both had KT77 power amp tubes.
I never heard a Herbert, but I know the VH4 pretty well (from memory), and also played a einstein 50 a while ago.

Schmidt:
very nice amp, sounds more 'wooly' than the other diezels, but I feel this one needs some volume to open up. Other diezels sound great even with the master volume pretty low, but the Schmidt doesn't have any.
Very useful reverb, better than others I heard (Fender, boogie). Also, lots of gain in ch3 for an amp aimed at blues and jazz payers.
I don't have a band, so for home playing cranking is not really the way to go.
But a very good amp, and I'm sure by switching the output valves and using different speakers it can sound excellent.

D-moll:
Ch1: wow! The most 3D, dynamic clean I ever heard from a Diezel. This channel alone is worth the price. Cranking the results still in a cleanish sound, at least with my singel-coil equipped guitar (a H.S. Anderson Mad Cat).
Ch2 and Ch3: very useful gain knob, when going from zero to 10 it sounds like more and more preamp tubes get activated, it has a very broad and useful range, which is pretty rare. Boosting the mids gives you the low-mid rooaar that I associate with the better marshalls, but a Marshall tone stack will cut the low end, while Diezels have plenty of oomph.
I liked setting the channels with the mid boosted, and using the mid-cut option to go back 'flat'. This way, it works as a reverse mid-boost.

So the D-moll it is, I actually like it better than my beloved VH4 (from memory).
I just wonder if the 2x12 rear-loaded oversize hempcone cabinet is the way to go?
I don't like the upper-mid spike of vintage 30's (same peak as a SM57 microphone for my ears).

Anyone who's playing a D-moll with this cab?
I play mostly clean and slighty distorted crunch, palm-mute tightness is no issue for me, I just want the best dynamic response to my picking, and an open sound.

 

[vlammie]

By the way, which poweramp tubes can go in the D-moll?
The manual is not clear about this. I guess EL34, 6L6, KT77, anything else?
6550 / 6V6 ?

Thanks!

 

[jonilas]

I never heard a D-Moll, but I am actually using a Schmidt in an appartment.

As you said, it sounds way better when the volume is considerably loud to play in an appartment, but it still sounds good at bedroom volume. I have to say that I changed the tubes to 6V6S (from the original EL34) to reduce the power to 15Watts, but it´s still a loud head to play with the volume crancked up.

Also, a superb clean in channel 1,a good crunch on channel 2, and enough gain on channel 3 for any metalhead , but I prefer to push channel 2 with a booster to get a lead sound, sounds better (and cleaner) to me this way.

Now, I am thinking about getting an attenuator (I know that Peter don´t like attenuators on Diezel amps, but...) to play with head at low volume, but with the tubes being pushed to get a warm sound from the Schmidt.

 

[TooL46_2]

I changed the tubes to 6V6S (from the original EL34)

I'm not familiar with Schmidt's schematic but changing from EL34 to 6V6S is usually not a good idea.

Here's some reasons why:
1/ different loads -- EL34 (pair) usually works for 3k4-4k2 ohms load, whereas 6V6 (pair) normally should work for 8k ohms. Unless you connect your speakers accordingly (8ohm speaker into 4ohm speaker connector, for example) you're possibly frying your output tubes
2/ EL34 usually works with higher voltages than 6V6S (especially the second grid). I know 6V6S (I'm using them myself) are rated for higher voltages but unless I knew what voltages are inside Schmidt -- I wouldn't make such a radical change.

Did you consult anyone before changing the tubes?

 

[vlammie]

I changed the tubes to 6V6S (from the original EL34)

I'm not familiar with Schmidt's schematic but changing from EL34 to 6V6S is usually not a good idea.

Here's some reasons why:
1/ different loads -- EL34 (pair) usually works for 3k4-4k2 ohms load, whereas 6V6 (pair) normally should work for 8k ohms. Unless you connect your speakers accordingly (8ohm speaker into 4ohm speaker connector, for example) you're possibly frying your output tubes
2/ EL34 usually works with higher voltages than 6V6S (especially the second grid). I know 6V6S (I'm using them myself) are rated for higher voltages but unless I knew what voltages are inside Schmidt -- I wouldn't make such a radical change.

Did you consult anyone before changing the tubes?

The Schmidt is auto-biasing, so it's designed to take different tubes, including 6V6.
Perfectly safe, but I wouldn't do this on other Diezel's.

Which brings me back to my previous question: which poweramp tubes are compatible with the D-moll?
Peter, care to chime in? Only KT77, or also EL34 and 6L6? 6550?

 

[Kev]

About powertubes:
Schmidt: Its self-biasing and you can hook it up with 6V6, 6L6, EL34, KT 77 among others.
D-Moll: Can run on any normal high-wattage powertube (to add e.g. 5881 to your list) but needs biasing.

About speakers:
All I can say about the Hempcones in a Diezel cab is that they have a skinny bottom end, nice open highs and mids (not as focused as V30s, K100s or T75s) and a loose feel. They sound quite different from any other speaker I've heard.

Here is my review I made last year on all the Cabs together with the D-Moll:
FL 4x12 Vintage 30: Read the whole review
FL 4x12 G12-K100: More modern sounding, more emphasized overtones.
RL 4x12 Vintage 30: Darker sounding, looser feel, fatter bottom end.
RL 4x12 Hempcone: Very present sounding without any harshness, looser feel, skinny bottom end.
FL 2x12 Vintage 30: Very similar to the FL4x12V30, but imo nicer contour in the mids and a slightly brighter high-end. But of course less low-end. (My new favorite!!!)
RL 2x12 Vintage 30: Similar dark sound as the RL4x12V30, but a directer feel (not as direct, as on the FL-cabs), the same amount of low end as on a 4x12(!!!).

This is the whole review:
viewtopic.php?p=1329444#p1329444

 

[TooL46_2]

My apologies -- I haven't looked at Schmidt's specs before writing my post... Rookie's mistake... I lived under the impression that pair of EL34s has usually fixed bias. I'll shut up now

 

[Peter Diezel]

KT77-JJ