Do I want a vh4

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Dyllheaven88

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I’ve kind of always wanted to try a vh4 , been a grail amp for me just based on lore , I have a trade offer for a new engl fireball 100 , or I could purge a guitar and a amp to try and snag a vh4. Pros cons can it do the heavy stuff or just Metallica, tool , etc etc ?


Thanks y’all
 
What type of tones do you like? The 'tool sound' is more in the marshall in my opinion.

if you like bright top end and openess.. you won't dig it.

it was a grail amp for me too.... kept it for 5 years and couldn't make it work.
The Herbert however was a different story and much better fit for my style.
 
saxxamafone said:
What type of tones do you like? The 'tool sound' is more in the marshall in my opinion.

if you like bright top end and openess.. you won't dig it.

it was a grail amp for me too.... kept it for 5 years and couldn't make it work.
The Herbert however was a different story and much better fit for my style.
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Is it overly dark sounding ? I’ve had a Einstein Schmidt , lil fokker , and played a herbie mkii , def my ears are more tuned too brighter punchy too end, the compression doesn’t bother me as long as it hits still .
 
Dyllheaven88 said:
Is it overly dark sounding ? I’ve had a Einstein Schmidt , lil fokker , and played a herbie mkii , def my ears are more tuned too brighter punchy too end, the compression doesn’t bother me as long as it hits still .
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I found the VH4 dark yes, dark and very strong mid range which my ears didn't like.
 
I think if you've tried those other Diezel's, you'll know the Diezel gain sound and perhaps it's not for you if you really prefer the brighter style amps.
It's always worth a try to find out for yourself though, but the VH4 is the OG of their signature tone.
I love mine and they are much more than just the Ch3 Metallica and Tool tones though. I also have other amps if I'm needing a tone that the VH4 doesn't excel at.
 
Wizard of Ozz said:
Make sure you play one first. And there have been at least 4 revisions to the circuit since it was released.

Dark, somewhat dull and compressed.
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Dark and Dull is a good description of it. Which isn't necessarily bad, because the same reason it is dark and dull is the same reason everyone loves them. It has an exceptionally clear hi fi distortion that rolls through the low end without being muddy. But since it sits in the mids- and wants to pull to the midlows, it can sound dull compared to the Marshall distortion profile I think most guitarists are used too. The upper mid sound of the Marshalls is the sound of a guitar solo. If you like that hot rodded shining bluesy tone, or that bright metal solo sound, the Diezel might not be for you. This ain't a Marshall inspired amp.

I have a VHX, which is their evolution of the VH4. Basically a VH4 circuit, with some digital switching to change the tonal shape. I bought it before ever playing one, and I really do love it. It's an amazing amp. I got it because I'm a Tool fan, and I'll be honest there's some things I probably would have liked to have known before I got it.

Adam Jones tone is legendary. Regardless of whether you like him or not, it is very sophisticated and specific. While he's known for using a Marshall and either Dual Rec or a Rivera, the core mojo of his tone is really seen as his VH4's. They get all the attention as the mythical super expensive amp that's potentially the greatest distortion you've ever heard. Because of how expensive they are, and the relatively low amount of them on the market, most people who want one haven't had the chance to hear one live, much less even play one. The problem is if you're a Tool fan like me, and you've also never played one on it's own, it's a lot harder to hear when he's not playing it; or at least when he's relying more on the other amps. Without having played one in person, I assumed it was a lot more of his sound than it was, and so mentally, there was this unlimited potential to the sounds I could get out of it. But if that was true, then he wouldn't be using two other amps now would he?

The Lateralus solo? Love it, it's the solo I couldn't wait to play on a Diezel. Guess what? You're hearing more of the Marshall than the VH4.

The talk-box solo in Jambi? More of the Marshall.

Basically any of the bright and smooth part of his sound is gonna be coming from the Marshall.

If you want one and you're not a Tool fan, I still suggest you go check out the artist that made you want to get one (let's be honest most of us want Diezel's because rockstars play them), and listen to them, and just generally assume that any of the bright parts of their tone probably isn't from the Diezel.

On the other hand, they are played by rockstars for a reason. There's really no better tone for what it does, just alternatives. It's a magnificent amp. But you might play one and find out that one part in your favorite song you thought was the Diezel was actually something different.
 
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Personally I don’t think any amp billed as a “big modern high gain” amp has ever disappointed me as much as when I played a VH4.

I was expecting huge, crisp, modern high gain tone, because that is certainly what its visual design language suggests, but what I heard was the opposite. It’s not articulate at all. Or modern sounding. When people say this amp is dark, they don’t mean it sounds like a Bogner, where you have crispy, articulate distortion but with a smoothed out high end like they removed some highs in post. Instead, this amp feels more like they removed all the highs at the amp’s input stage. It’s just a dull, awkwardly grindy, totally inarticulate sort of tone, kind of like a JCM 800 but with totally dead tubes.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news here but personally I think these amps are awful. Also, notice how almost nobody who plays one uses it by itself. That should tell you a lot. If you see somebody blending a VH4 with another amp, it’s likely all of the articulation and detail your hearing is coming from the other amp, while the VH4 is probably blended in for its low end content.

If you’re just looking for a single amp to give you gigantic rockstar distortion, run as far as you can from the VH4.
 
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Check out the Diezel sub-forum and scroll through a few pages. That should tell you all you need to know.
 
TheGreatGreen said:
Personally I don’t think I’ve ever been as disappointed to play any “big modern high gain” amp as I was when I played a VH4.

I was expecting huge, crisp, modern high gain tone, because that is certainly what its visual design language suggests, but what I heard was the opposite. It’s not articulate at all. Or modern sounding. Or even “big“ sounding. When people say this amp is dark, they don’t mean it sounds like a Bogner, where you have crispy, articulate distortion but with a smoothed out high end like they removed some highs in post. Instead, this amp feels more like they removed all the highs at the amp’s input stage. It’s just a dull, awkwardly grindy, totally inarticulate sort of tone, kind of like a JCM 800 but with totally dead tubes.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news here but personally I think these amps are awful. Also, notice how almost nobody who plays one uses it by itself. That should tell you a lot. If you see somebody blending a VH4 with another amp, it’s likely all of the articulation and detail your hearing is coming from the other amp, while the VH4 is probably blended in for its low end content.

If you’re just looking for a single amp to give you gigantic rockstar distortion, run as far as you can from the VH4.
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I feel this way when I got vh4 . But I’ve got to know it and it stays in my herd . I get some great tones out of it . I do prefer Herbert mk 1 . I have an old one that hangs with my Hermanson and Wizards and it super tight . So at first vh4 perplexed me . But I like have tons of flavors and vh4 became one I like
 
C0UNT3RP01NT said:
Basically any of the bright and smooth part of his sound is gonna be coming from the Marshall.
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agree, you'll get more tool tones out of an old marshall than you will out of a vh4.

I sold my vh4 because it was too dull for my ears.

The band Staind is a reason I bought mine... they're a good example of a tone that's more vh4 than marshall
 
Never cared what they sound like, fucking goofy looking and expensive
 
TheGreatGreen said:
I was expecting huge, crisp, modern high gain tone, because that is certainly what its visual design language suggests, but what I heard was the opposite. It’s not articulate at all. Or modern sounding. Or even “big“ sounding.
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Agree with your description of vh4, the herbert for me however is much more suited and has more crisp highs that i was missing in the vh4
 
spguitar said:
Uhhhhh :oops:


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I mean you can highlight as many poorly recorded cell phone videos as you want but I still don't hear any articulation there. I hear a very dull, fuzzy, undefined sound that happens to be distorted enough to produce harmonics over a large range of the frequency spectrum. I've also played them in person and listened to them properly mic'd, recorded, and played through monitors, and I know what they sound like.

Another thing, an oversaturation of upper harmonic fizz like what I can make out in those videos is not the same thing as articulation. You can get upper harmonic fizz out of a 100 Hz sine wave if you filter and distort it enough.

I could even concede that the amp would probably help a guitar sound really good if it was used in a multi-amp rig where it only handled lows and the other amp handled the highs. It also might suit somebody who wanted a big, sludgy sound for sustained open chord playing. But for most people who like more articulate type gain circuits like you get from Mesa, Marshall, 5150's, Bogner, etc, the VH4 is probably not what you're looking for.
 
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I mean the other problem I had when I was doing research is that people either love it or hate it. Then someone would ask what's a good alternative, and they would recommend some equally hard to find or even more obscure amp. If you only spent time on these forums, you would think your local guitar center would be half boutique amps.

Diezel has the brand recognition that's for sure. Despite being a big Tool fan, I was pretty discerning about what I wanted from a high end amp. I know that I fell in love with the Diezel sound because of Tool. For my own sound, I was trying to figure out if that was the one I wanted. People made recommendations but they were amps played by bands I didn't listen to, and I had never seen in a guitar store.

I'm not saying they're better or worse really. Tone is subjective. But when you're taking a $4000 shot in the dark, you're gonna go with what your guitar hero's play. Maybe in a few years when I got some money, I'll take another big shot and then I can decide which I want to keep. But for now, I think the amp is amazing. It certainly isn't the last word in tone, but it's way damn better than anything else I've ever played.
 
If you love it, that's awesome and I applaud any guitar player who is able to find something they're happy with and stick to it.

I also just feel an obligation to provide a view of it that is my honest, less than positive experience with it. I certainly could have used more negative opinions when looking for gear. Sometimes you try really hard to force yourself to like something because you want to like it because of what it is, and surely it's you that's the problem because you just can't handle the amp correctly, right? "If only I stick with it just a liiiiitle while longer..." etc, only to discover in the end that you wasted a whole lot of time trying to fit a round peg into a square hole when you should have moved on long ago.
 
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