Home Recording with Bias by Positive Grid?

  • Thread starter Thread starter PhloridaMan
  • Start date Start date
PhloridaMan

PhloridaMan

Active member
So, I picked up a Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 through a buddy for a good deal brand new this past week. My intentions are to go through and record some riffs I have laying around and to start re-recording a record that my brother and I did back in 2003 and re-arranging the songs to sound less... well... NuMetal-ly lol

My dilemma is, I live in a Condo, and even though I own an end unit, and my man cave is on the exterior side of the basement with a garage between myself and the neighbor, the old prick still complains any chance he gets about the slightest noise. For that reason, I don't get to fire up my Nitro very much sadly. My brother and I have already sat down over Christmas and done the figuring out of the arrangements and he has now put the drum tracks into Superior Drummer (since he has no way to record a full kit and lives in NY while I am in MA) so now I just need to get to doing some guitar and bass tracks.

I follow Ryan Bruce aka Fluff quite a bit and have watched his demo's, but I know he also worked for Positive Grid at some point and feel his opinion on Bias may have been a bit biased for lack of a better term.

Since I have very few opportunities to sit down and jam when my neighbor isn't around, and I am not really interested in dumping $2k+ into an AxeFX, I was wondering if Bias is really as good as it seems and sounds and if it's worth the $150 pricetag. Also, is the amp matching really any good, because the tone with my Splawn is pretty incredible (to me) and I would love to capture that to have it available.

While I wait for responses, I am going to work my way on over to the SEARCH button to see if there is any more info (I probably should have done that first).

Thanks in advance!
 
Would love to, but cost is a big deal. All my money is pretty tied up due to racing commitments. Have to do this frugally...
 
Phil Jacques":3hwr1h6u said:
Would love to, but cost is a big deal. All my money is pretty tied up due to racing commitments. Have to do this frugally...
Click to expand...

I was looking into this as well for a while but to be honest, if you want to go the route of no noise, you probably would be better of going with the Two Notes Live or reactive Load. The Bias stuff adds bass and kills the sparkle. I hoped the amp match feature would be the ticket but it does add a lot of fizz.(or seem to anyway) I have gone on record many times feeling like IR's soften the top end a tad but I also have to admit that with double tracking and panning guitars, you likely would not notice. You guys can score these reactive load units for a good price in the states. Maybe sell some gear if you can and pick one up. Maybe you have a mic or two or some pedals that you can sell and you will have 3-400$ to put towards the purchase.
 
Phil Jacques":3v2owz4w said:
Would love to, but cost is a big deal. All my money is pretty tied up due to racing commitments. Have to do this frugally...
Click to expand...


Try some of the free amp sim plugins before spending money.

LePou amps and LeCab IR loader, or Ignite Emissary with the NadIR loader. Both are very good and free.
 
Phil Jacques":2kturpz2 said:
So, I picked up a Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 through a buddy for a good deal brand new this past week. My intentions are to go through and record some riffs I have laying around and to start re-recording a record that my brother and I did back in 2003 and re-arranging the songs to sound less... well... NuMetal-ly lol

My dilemma is, I live in a Condo, and even though I own an end unit, and my man cave is on the exterior side of the basement with a garage between myself and the neighbor, the old prick still complains any chance he gets about the slightest noise. For that reason, I don't get to fire up my Nitro very much sadly. My brother and I have already sat down over Christmas and done the figuring out of the arrangements and he has now put the drum tracks into Superior Drummer (since he has no way to record a full kit and lives in NY while I am in MA) so now I just need to get to doing some guitar and bass tracks.

I follow Ryan Bruce aka Fluff quite a bit and have watched his demo's, but I know he also worked for Positive Grid at some point and feel his opinion on Bias may have been a bit biased for lack of a better term.

Since I have very few opportunities to sit down and jam when my neighbor isn't around, and I am not really interested in dumping $2k+ into an AxeFX, I was wondering if Bias is really as good as it seems and sounds and if it's worth the $150 pricetag. Also, is the amp matching really any good, because the tone with my Splawn is pretty incredible (to me) and I would love to capture that to have it available.

While I wait for responses, I am going to work my way on over to the SEARCH button to see if there is any more info (I probably should have done that first).

Thanks in advance!
Click to expand...
Go and download it from there site and find out for yourself. It will cut out every 30 seconds until you pay for it but you will still know for yourself then.
 
The answers are already here.

Go try it, go try all the plugins available. All of them are either free or have a free Demo.

Revalver, TSE, Thermionik.

You can get all of them to sound really awesome with enough knowledge and enough tweaking. Some are more of a pain than others.

The AX8 destroys all of them IMO regarding ease of use and killer sound. I understand that is too expensive but nothing can beat a real amp.

You can get some great sounds for $150 plugin but I would go the two notes route like mentioned to be able to use your real amp.

IMO Bias is great especially if you are a tweaker. But if you are looking for a no nonsense, plug in and sound awesome plug in I do not recommend BIAS. TSE or Revalver IMO is better.



Real amp/Two Notes > AX8 > Plugins like TSE or Revalver > Bias.
 
i have Positive Grid. You can use the plugin with garageband or whatever software and with that Scarlett interface. Throw on some headphones. Yup double track it and sound good.

edit: and if gets buggy, restart the mac.
 
Thanks guys, I didn't even know half of those options exist.

I sold off all of my gear a while back so I literally just have my 5 guitars, 1 bass and my Nitro with Orange PPC412...

I'll definitely take a look at everything and see. I'm not trying to make a perfect pro quality recording. Just trying to get everything worked out and somewhat in a solid respectable demo form so maybe one day we can do some real recording. Nothing beats real drums and real amp obviously. I'm not a super active player anymore so just trying to kind of catalog all of the music I have written for now at least and see what the future holds.
 
Here's a link to a clip I threw together using bias and ez drummer. It was my first go at it with both and spent about 45 minutes in all putting it together in Reaper. I think it's a great tool, but I still would rather the real deal amplifier when applicable.
::edit:: I used the same model interface you just picked up to record the below track with.

https://soundcloud.com/chuck-dees-916047231/41-riffage
 
I can definitely hear what you guys are talking about regarding losing the sparkle on the high end and adding some bottom. I am sure there are some ways to make that work though. I am generally okay with tweaking so... I'm going to sit down with the demo tomorrow and see what I can come up with for a tone. I would definitely love to Mic up the Splawn, but like I said, right now that's not possible, especially at the levels I would have to play to make it really sound right.
 
IMO, it takes a lot of tweaking to get Bias sounding somewhat like I want it to. I can tell you that if you want to get the best sounds possible with it, the price does not end at $150. I also have Bias fx, which allows for dual amp set ups, and all of the Redwirez, and Ownhammer IR packs.I have the Torpedo Wall of sound 3, the redwirez IR loader, but the best sound to my ears has been loading a single Cab IR into a convolution reverb plugin in Logic. Even after all of that, I find it lacking. The clean, high gain sounds seem to work decently, but there doesn't seem to be a middle ground. I like a moderate gain setting, and a cranked master. I have not been to get a sound like that, that I thought was usable. I will say that it makes for a killer practice rig for those times when you have to be considerate of others.
So, I have Bias, with all of the options, and I am presently waiting on a very slow mailman (not the hardcore moped guy from this site with the same name) to deliver my Suhr Reactive Load, so I can get back to using my amps. YMMV.
 
Let's talk about the noise complaint issue. Are there quiet hours or curfew hours? Surely you can't be expected to be whisper quiet 24/7 - you have to have some sort of freedom. Otherwise you may have to consider either moving or just not having tube amps at home. If your neighbor complains during hours you are allowed by the city and your complex management company to play loud (within reason of course) - he can piss off and you don't have to worry about it or him. Or you could approach him and work out a compromising deal.

/harsh
 
sahlomonic":1cvzfx9d said:
Let's talk about the noise complaint issue. Are there quiet hours or curfew hours? Surely you can't be expected to be whisper quiet 24/7 - you have to have some sort of freedom. Otherwise you may have to consider either moving or just not having tube amps at home. If your neighbor complains during hours you are allowed by the city and your complex management company to play loud (within reason of course) - he can piss off and you don't have to worry about it or him. Or you could approach him and work out a compromising deal.

/harsh
Click to expand...

Yeah, it sucks. No written quiet or curfew hours, but it does state multiple disturbance complaints can result in "sanctions" which according to a friend who use to live here and had it happen to him over his Corvette's loud exhaust, means they can force you to move out. Since we just bought not long ago, we really don't feel like leaving just yet lol At least until we can both find good jobs down in FL somewhere so we can escape snow and hell.

The neighbor is a 72 year old retired guy that lives with his 4 cats. He's a nice enough guy, but he literally calls if you turn your tv up too loud. It's a little silly. We tried talking to him but had no luck. We do have an email in to the association to try and resolve this issue, because we constantly hear him listening to louder TV and Music but we never complain. There should be some give and take. And it's not like I am having a full band rehearsing either. Just me, and my guitar, on the far outside wall of the house at a moderate level to try and get the tubes working and get a good tone. :thumbsdown: :confused:

Aside from that, I downloaded ProTools First and Bias FX (basic) that came licensed with my Scarlett. I am actually very intrigued by it to the point I may go for the full version. I have only been using the Tosin Abasi High Gain setting and really haven't explored much else, but so far it's doing the trick for what I wanted a lot better than I expected from everyones description. The only problem I seem to be having now, is Bias paired with ProTools is bogging my computer when I try and record at times :doh: :doh: :doh: Time to upgrade PC's I suppose...

Still wish I could just plug into the Splawn without worrying about getting a phone call...
 
voodooradio1":qk0rnlb1 said:
IMO, it takes a lot of tweaking to get Bias sounding somewhat like I want it to. I can tell you that if you want to get the best sounds possible with it, the price does not end at $150. I also have Bias fx, which allows for dual amp set ups, and all of the Redwirez, and Ownhammer IR packs.I have the Torpedo Wall of sound 3, the redwirez IR loader, but the best sound to my ears has been loading a single Cab IR into a convolution reverb plugin in Logic. Even after all of that, I find it lacking. The clean, high gain sounds seem to work decently, but there doesn't seem to be a middle ground. I like a moderate gain setting, and a cranked master. I have not been to get a sound like that, that I thought was usable. I will say that it makes for a killer practice rig for those times when you have to be considerate of others.
So, I have Bias, with all of the options, and I am presently waiting on a very slow mailman (not the hardcore moped guy from this site with the same name) to deliver my Suhr Reactive Load, so I can get back to using my amps. YMMV.
Click to expand...

The reactive load is just a DI box is it not? No cabinet emulation etc? Do you plan on using it with one of the BIAS cab and Mic simulations to work together? I am curious about this option... I admit very openly that I am not as well versed on gear today like I was 10 years ago since my life focus has shifted.
 
This is basically what I have been working on. Re-Recording this horrible mess of music we wrote back in 2001 and recorded on a $200 budget back in 2003 as a bunch of 15-19 year olds with no clue lol!

https://soundcloud.com/phil-jacques-243 ... enty-eight

I am almost embarrassed to post that but who cares lol It's fun to listen to now and laugh. We are re-doing the arrangements and modernizing the way the song is written and played a bit. As long as the tone is better than this, we will be happy.

Anyone want to play a fun guessing game and guess what horrible amplifier was used to achieve this epicly horrible tone? lol!
 
I think Bias is fine for laying down ideas but not going to make the cut if you are recording an album.
 
Check out these threads here on RT. There's some good info in here from myself and several others regarding amp sims. I'll quote myself from one of the threads, as it's 6:37 AM and I've been awake for over 24 hours.

Info on different amp sims - viewtopic.php?f=3&t=185272
Info on Bias and some tips regarding using it - viewtopic.php?f=3&t=184149
Info about different amp sim options - viewtopic.php?f=3&t=184556
Info about different audio interfaces - viewtopic.php?f=3&t=183872
Info on FRFR Cabs. Might not be very useful in your case, but posting for others - viewtopic.php?f=3&t=182327

Here's some tips I posted in one of these threads regarding using amp sims.

"Try using a low pass and high pass filter at the end of your signal chain. It can really help filter out the "digitalness".

Running a boost in front (either a real boost or a plugin) can help too. Boosting the input into the amp sim seems to generate a more lifelike tone for me. I use the free TSE Audio tubescreamer plugin for high gain sounds, along with my OD pedalboard in front of the interface. Bad Monkey, a homebrew treble booster, and a B.K Butler Tube Driver. You can always use the pedals included with Bias FX, of course. It looks like a lot of fun to play around with. Check out the TSE Audio stuff as well. It's all free and very useable. That's the beauty of VSTs/sims. Rarely are you limited by choice.

Here's a link to the TSE Audio stuff. https://www.tseaudio.com/software/tse808

Mercurial Audio also has a free TS style plugin which sounds really nice in my limited experience. Their amp sims are really good too. There is a free version of their U530 with some limitations. There is a couple of different JCM800 style plugins for free on their site, as well as an emulation of a Cornford amp that sounds really cool. I should use that one a bit more.

Mercurial Audio - https://mercuriall.com/cms/

Does Bias FX have a BOSS OC-2 emu? I've been looking for a VST that can do the filtered low octave thing. Adding a low octave to only the low strings on the guitar. I'd like to use it to fill out the bottom end when I do solo acoustic shows. I'm already using my Macbook with my acoustic rig, so running an emu instead of a pedal would be nice. Right now I use a Waves plugin called LoAir to add some depth to the low end. It helps, but it's not exactly what I'm looking for.

One more thing you can try is adding a channel strip/mic-pre plugin at the top of your signal chain. Waves make a bunch of channel strip emulations based on classic mixing desks. I use the Schelps 73 with acoustic, and the SSL Channel with electric guitars. It's not really their intended use (LoAir isn't for guitars either) but it sounds great to me."

Hopefully this helps you out mate.

Sleepy Edit - Cleaned up a bad copy/paste.
 
CaseyCor":1i5jhb4a said:
Check out these threads here on RT. There's some good info in here from myself and several others regarding amp sims. I'll quote myself from one of the threads, as it's 6:37 AM and I've been awake for over 24 hours.

Info on different amp sims - viewtopic.php?f=3&t=185272
Info on Bias and some tips regarding using it - viewtopic.php?f=3&t=184149
Info about different amp sim options - viewtopic.php?f=3&t=184556

One more thing you can try is adding a channel strip/mic-pre plugin at the top of your signal chain. Waves make a bunch of channel strip emulations based on classic mixing desks. I use the Schelps 73 with acoustic, and the SSL Channel with electric guitars. It's not really their intended use (LoAir isn't for guitars either) but it sounds great to me.

Here's some tips I posted in one of these threads regarding using amp sims.

"Try using a low pass and high pass filter at the end of your signal chain. It can really help filter out the "digitalness".

Running a boost in front (either a real boost or a plugin) can help too. Boosting the input into the amp sim seems to generate a more lifelike tone for me. I use the free TSE Audio tubescreamer plugin for high gain sounds, along with my OD pedalboard in front of the interface. Bad Monkey, a homebrew treble booster, and a B.K Butler Tube Driver. You can always use the pedals included with Bias FX, of course. It looks like a lot of fun to play around with. Check out the TSE Audio stuff as well. It's all free and very useable. That's the beauty of VSTs/sims. Rarely are you limited by choice.

Here's a link to the TSE Audio stuff. https://www.tseaudio.com/software/tse808

Mercurial Audio also has a free TS style plugin which sounds really nice in my limited experience. Their amp sims are really good too. There is a free version of their U530 with some limitations. There is a couple of different JCM800 style plugins for free on their site, as well as an emulation of a Cornford amp that sounds really cool. I should use that one a bit more.

Mercurial Audio - https://mercuriall.com/cms/

Does Bias FX have a BOSS OC-2 emu? I've been looking for a VST that can do the filtered low octave thing. Adding a low octave to only the low strings on the guitar. I'd like to use it to fill out the bottom end when I do solo acoustic shows. I'm already using my Macbook with my acoustic rig, so running an emu instead of a pedal would be nice. Right now I use a Waves plugin called LoAir to add some depth to the low end. It helps, but it's not exactly what I'm looking for.

One more thing you can try is adding a channel strip/mic-pre plugin at the top of your signal chain. Waves make a bunch of channel strip emulations based on classic mixing desks. I use the Schelps 73 with acoustic, and the SSL Channel with electric guitars. It's not really their intended use (LoAir isn't for guitars either) but it sounds great to me."

Hopefully this helps you out mate.
Click to expand...

That info is MUCH appreciated! I'll be doing a lot of reading as I go. So far, I'm at least happy with the quality I am getting but it can always be better. I know it will never match up to the real thing, but for now I have to deal. I don't have the money to really sink into major studio time or I might consider that path as an option. Racing is priority right now so that's where the majority of my time and money goes.
 
I suggest grabbing the free amp sims from LePou as well as his IR loader LeCab. Add the demo versions of Themionik for a metric shit ton of great sounding amp options. The demos are fully functional but display a timed message when opening the plugin's UI after you've used it for 2 weeks. It doesn't interrupt your playing in any way. It's just a bit inconvenient when you want to tweak some settings. Buy it if you like it, of course!

Make sure you've got some good cabinet IRs (impulse responses)! That might be the most important part. There's a lot of free ones out there which can be pretty good, but you should look into buying some of the RedWirez and OwnHammer stuff. Get the free TSE Tubescreamer boost too. I use this plugin like 90% of the time. The boost, along with the high and low pass filters REALLY help out.

I've been using their Mark IIC+ and Mark IV sims in conjunction with LePou's Lecto for my main high gain sound lately. I run these amp sims in a wet/dry/wet setup, done entirely with plugins inside Logic Pro. I haven't even been using my boost pedals lately. My Macbook is out of commission at the moment, but when it's back up and running I'll have some clips.
 
Phil Jacques":1w64nili said:
This is basically what I have been working on. Re-Recording this horrible mess of music we wrote back in 2001 and recorded on a $200 budget back in 2003 as a bunch of 15-19 year olds with no clue lol!

https://soundcloud.com/phil-jacques-243 ... enty-eight

I am almost embarrassed to post that but who cares lol It's fun to listen to now and laugh. We are re-doing the arrangements and modernizing the way the song is written and played a bit. As long as the tone is better than this, we will be happy.

Anyone want to play a fun guessing game and guess what horrible amplifier was used to achieve this epicly horrible tone? lol!
Click to expand...

Hey, the vocals may be out in spots or a tad weak in the soft parts but the heavy singing works and the album sounds authentic. I mean is that actually REAL drums?!!! Not a fucking machine.. even if some sound replacement was used here or there, it is nowhere near the robotic replaced drum sounds of today. The guitars are alive as well. It sounded a tad boxy but imagine with a decent room to mix in you would be off to the races. Real people, real music. Dig it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top