I don't understand the high end Pickup Market

DanTravis62 said:
Because saying something is "subjective" is a nothing statement. Everyone is stating their subjective opinions, including you - except you never post any clips of anything backing up your subjective opinion :dunno:
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A clip is not an argument to back up an opinion. You’re confused about a lot of things that I’m going to chock up to immaturity.
I’m just wondering how you can be a moderator without being objective. Take a lesson from @Monkey Man about being a little more even keeled. You push a very overbearing demeanor. I think the power trip your on is going to you’re head.
 
TheBiggestJerk said:
A clip is not an argument to back up an opinion. You’re confused about a lot of things that I’m going to chock up to immaturity.
I’m just wondering how you can be a moderator without being objective. Take a lesson from @Monkey Man about being a little more even keeled. You push a very overbearing demeanor.
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A clip is evidence to back up an opinion - so that others can agree or disagree and be more informed.

You constantly needle people and then get butthurt when you get it back, which I can only attribute to being a baby.

if you can't stand the heat, get out the kitchen, man. This isn't TGP, and i'm allowed to have opinions even if i'm a mod LOL
 
DanTravis62 said:
A clip is evidence to back up an opinion - so that others can agree or disagree and be more informed.

You constantly needle people and then get butthurt when you get it back, which I can only attribute to being a baby.

if you can't stand the heat, get out the kitchen, man. This isn't TGP, and i'm allowed to have opinions even if i'm a mod LOL
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Is that your whole goal in life - to put people in their place via video??
Some call it needling and some call it sifting out the bullshit.
 
TheBiggestJerk said:
Is that your whole goal in life - to put people in their place via video??
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Only when they try to throw their weight around without having a legitimate reason to do so :dunno:

You can't seriously be surprised that some people are going to disagree with a hot take, and want evidence or more data, right?

Well, if you can't hear a difference, how bout try to show me what you're hearing. That's what's happening when I ask for clips.

That's the reason for it - actually hearing the gear we talk about all day every day on the forum. It's not to dunk on you, or something, it's to try to hear what you're subjectively hearing.
 
DanTravis62 said:
Man that sucks, but i've heard that story alot with PRS. Plays great. Looks amazing. Pickups aren't anywhere close to good enough to measure up to everything around it. I'm not a 59/09 fan at all. It depends on what type of tone you want, but i'd probably go for something like a black winter if I was doing heavy stuff, EMG retroactive if i wanted versatility, and duncan custom 5/jazz if I wanted classic type sounds.

As far as it not making a huge difference.... it depends a lot on what you're doing and what you value in a tone. I don't think most of the ridiculous expensive PAF clones are worth buying, though they might be the right choice for someone out there

but I hear a massive difference between the super cheap stuff and the industry standards. And the difference in feel is even bigger. I've done shootout recordings on this before, but there's a huge difference in clarity and string separation between a wilkinson/GFS level pickup and a duncan/dimarzio, and a similar jump from duncan/dimarzio to tone nerd/wagner IMO.
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Don't feel sorry for me, I've made this mistake more than once lol. I even had this one built to my specs. I had a good experience with 59/09 back in a 2011 custom 24, just hated the trem. Built this one with a plate fixed bridge and it's very sterile, brittle, and bright. Huge spike in the upper mids. It may just need a hotter pickup for feel. I like guitars with mids but this one doesn't feel right under my right hand. Hoping it sorts out, we will see. I'm also in the minority that I strongly dislike the bite and brightness in the tremonti bridge pickups. Each tremonti I have sounds different but that upper mid bite is always there.
 
PiggySmallz said:
Don't feel sorry for me, I've made this mistake more than once lol. I even had this one built to my specs. I had a good experience with 59/09 back in a 2011 custom 24, just hated the trem. Built this one with a plate fixed bridge and it's very sterile, brittle, and bright. Huge spike in the upper mids. It may just need a hotter pickup for feel. I like guitars with mids but this one doesn't feel right under my right hand. Hoping it sorts out, we will see. I'm also in the minority that I strongly dislike the bite and brightness in the tremonti bridge pickups. Each tremonti I have sounds different but that upper mid bite is always there.
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Sterile, brittle, and bright is how I would describe the 59/09 in general, so I can imagine the fixed bridge makes it moreso.

I'm going to double down on the Custom 5/Jazz combo recommendation, especially if you want to make it more smooth, balanced and midrange focused. The higher gain ceramic options will get to the same destination, but it's going to be a much spikier midrange.

Edit by custom 5 I mean the SH-14 - not the SH-5 custom. I'm talking about the Custom 5 alnico
 
anomaly said:
There seems to be a point where there is diminished returns on pickups over the $150 mark. After that I don't really hear anything better really... That said, I've bought $50 pickups that sound excellent as well. Like the BL l-500xl. They used to be around $50 each.
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I agree. I haven't dug super deep into the pickup rabbit hole, but I've noticed this as well. I've had Bare Knuckles, EMGS, Duncan, Dimarzio. BK's are good pickups but IMO not worth the hefty price tag. For some reason I don't get along with DiMarzio's don't know why but they just sound off to me. I find if I need to change pickups I've basically settled on a Duncan SH5 Custom or an EMG 81. Call me basic, but it works for me. I've also noticed that I tend to favor ceramic pickups vs alnico pickups.
 
rsm said:
:yes:


View attachment 400778


https://www.dimarzio.com/
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DiMarzio = Weiners

Fuck them and their double-cream trademark (can't trademark a color if the color is a selling point of a product - John Deere couldn't trademark their green because farmers could specifically want green tractor, UPS could trademark their brown vans because it functions as a logo). Glad Gibson is finally fighting back on that nonsense.
 
TheBiggestJerk said:
We’re all still talking about wire and little bar magnets and plastic bobbins right?
< $8 in materials…
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What an uninformed take. Sure, pickups may contain just a few dollars worth of parts, but how much does an automated winder cost? And who's going to properly set it up and operate it? What, you don't need that and can do it by hand? Great, I'm sure you'll get it perfect the first time. Or the 50th if you're lucky. And by that time, you'll realize your time is worth way more than the $8 you've invested "in materials". And that's an extremely conservative estimate because there will undoubtedly be some wasted material used up in more than a few unsuccessful efforts before you get anything satisfactory. And you're up to speed with the concepts of magnet degaussing, charging, etc? You're probably one of those guys that thinks any amp over $1500 is a total ripoff too.
 
High end guitars can easily get into the $10k range these days. When you're at that point, what's $800 on a set of pickups?

The fact that I'm willing to spend $3k on a guitar and maybe $400 on a set of pickups & don't even consider those high end purchases is kind of ridiculous when I think about it.
 
Maybe I'm biased because they are made in USA/California........

I'm more than happy with Seymour Duncans and they always do it for me. Nothing fancy but they get the job done.....



Duncans know what they are doing......


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TheBiggestJerk said:
What makes a $100 Dimarzio different than a $850 TMM (take my money) ???

They get the bobbins from the same place, the magnets from the same place and the wire ($6 in CU) from the same place, wound on the same machines.

What’s the OBJECTIVE DIFFERENCE?
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Exactly my point. How many different ways can you wrap wire around a magnet? The difference is the marketing.
 
Killcrop said:
Exactly my point. How many different ways can you wrap wire around a magnet? The difference is the marketing.
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No, the difference is the 1000s of hours in R&D people spend perfecting their version of the pickup.

Guitars are literally just 20$ in wood with a couple pounds 3$ of pot metal. There's no reason guitars should cost more than 50$.

See how stupid that sounds?
 
thegame said:
What an uninformed take. Sure, pickups may contain just a few dollars worth of parts, but how much does an automated winder cost? And who's going to properly set it up and operate it? What, you don't need that and can do it by hand? Great, I'm sure you'll get it perfect the first time. Or the 50th if you're lucky. And by that time, you'll realize your time is worth way more than the $8 you've invested "in materials". And that's an extremely conservative estimate because there will undoubtedly be some wasted material used up in more than a few unsuccessful efforts before you get anything satisfactory. And you're up to speed with the concepts of magnet degaussing, charging, etc? You're probably one of those guys that thinks any amp over $1500 is a total ripoff too.
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The problem is there IS marketing bullshit that goes on - especially for pickups that cost a grand.

But that mentality is one people use when they've never actually had to spend time MAKING something. Like from scratch.

Maybe PRS was onto something with that whole "go to home Depot and make a guitar" thing, because I can't believe I have to explain this and basic economics to adults.
 
GreatRedDragon said:
DiMarzio = Winners

Fuck them and their double-cream trademark (can't trademark a color if the color is a selling point of a product - John Deere couldn't trademark their green because farmers could specifically want green tractor, UPS could trademark their brown vans because it functions as a logo). Glad Gibson is finally fighting back on that nonsense.
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Fixed
 
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