Just got a Lava van Den Hul cable. Holy shit, impressed.

  • Thread starter Thread starter GJgo
  • Start date Start date
Again, there's no magic at play here. It's all measurable. You just have to find a way to move beyond your own cognitive dissonance and confirmation bias.

http://sfguitarworks.com/the-great-cable-myth/

https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/H ... a_14_Cable

https://www.musiciansfriend.com/resource ... ds/m710670

"Although a high amp input impedance keeps the level up and provides smooth tone control action (the downside is that high impedances are more susceptible to picking up noise, RF, and other types of interference), it also accentuates the effects of cable capacitance. A cable that robs highs when used with a high input impedance amp can have no audible effect with a low input impedance amp.

Low guitar output impedance + low amp input impedance. Cable capacitance won’t make much difference, and the capacitor used with a standard tone control may not appear to have much of an effect. Increasing the tone control’s capacitor value will give a more pronounced high frequency cut. (Note: if you replace stock pickups with active pickups, keep this in mind if the tone control doesn’t seem as effective as it had been.) Bottom line: you can use just about any cord, and it won’t make much difference.

Low guitar output impedance + high amp input impedance. With the guitar’s volume control up full, the guitar output connects directly to the amp input, so the same basic comments as above (low guitar output Z with low amp input Z) applies. However, turning down the volume control isolates the guitar output from the amp input. At this point, cable capacitance has more of an effect, especially if the control is a high-resistance type (greater than 250k).

High guitar output impedance + low amp input impedance. Just say no. This maims your guitar’s level and high frequency response, and is not recommended.

High guitar output impedance + high amp input impedance. This is the common, 50s/60s setup scenario with a passive guitar and tube amp. In this case, cable capacitance can have a major effect. In particular, coil cords have a lot more capacitance than standard cords, and can make a huge sonic difference. However, the amp provides minimum loading on the guitar, which with a quality cord, helps to preserve high end "sheen" and overall level.

Taking all the above into account, if you want a more consistent guitar setup that sounds pretty much the same regardless of what cable you use (and is also relatively immune to amplifier loading), consider replacing your stock pickups with active types. Alternately, you can add an impedance converter ("buffer board") right after the guitar output (or for that matter, any effect such as a compressor, distortion box, etc. that has a high input impedance and low output impedance). This will isolate your guitar from any negative effects of high-capacitance cables or low impedance amp inputs."
 
Maybe we need to ask the amp builders what cable they used when they designed the amp. ;)
 
Well to me I hear the biggest difference between stranded and non stranded and the twist of the cable because the noise will be lower and it will be clearer... Those are REAL differences and will make a difference absolutely. Your ears are broken or tinnitus has set in bad if you can't hear the difference between those specific construction types... Beyond that copper is copper and silver is silver. The argument that the wire in the cab is of cheap quality I equate to using compression at various states of a recording a little bit here and there adds up to a lot more in the end and sometimes is desirable... So a cable of higher quality can "open up" that variable. IT MAKES SENSE. Now if it sounds better... That's all about the recipe. Too much good can definitely be bad... Too "good" of a speaker cable to me gets boomy. As stated before it just lets too much of that through or exacerbates the energy in that range because it flows too easily now. I don't care if anyone would want to call
Me a kook but I can tell the difference... Couldn't tell you which is which brand but it does impact MOST DEFINITELY!
 
This is interesting to me. I always used monsters but I want to start making my own cables. I had settled on mogami 2524 to buy in bulk and make my own (recently got a gcx and ground control) so I could make my stuff out say 50' for bigger stages. I'll take all suggestions if someone feels there is something truly better. For the record I also did try a van de hull cable and heard a lot more high end, it seemed shrill to me. The reason I went to monsters 20 years ago was they sounded fatter to me. I could be crazy but there was a difference. The new monsters don't seem to have that anymore.
 
Hey_bert_whtcha_doin_bert":11s6eqog said:
Well to me I hear the biggest difference between stranded and non stranded and the twist of the cable because the noise will be lower and it will be clearer... Those are REAL differences and will make a difference absolutely. Your ears are broken or tinnitus has set in bad if you can't hear the difference between those specific construction types... Beyond that copper is copper and silver is silver. The argument that the wire in the cab is of cheap quality I equate to using compression at various states of a recording a little bit here and there adds up to a lot more in the end and sometimes is desirable... So a cable of higher quality can "open up" that variable. IT MAKES SENSE. Now if it sounds better... That's all about the recipe. Too much good can definitely be bad... Too "good" of a speaker cable to me gets boomy. As stated before it just lets too much of that through or exacerbates the energy in that range because it flows too easily now. I don't care if anyone would want to call
Me a kook but I can tell the difference... Couldn't tell you which is which brand but it does impact MOST DEFINITELY!
Spot on. I totally agree with this. It's very noticeable in both the tone and the ease in dialing in the amp.
 
FourT6and2":2d45iyrn said:
Capacitance is real.
Shielding is real.
Good construction is real.

Magical mojo sauce cables are not real.
Cables that claim to be directional are not real.
Cables that tout touch sensitivity are not real.

Guys, it's just copper wire. There's nothing mystical about it. Get a cable that specs out with low capacitance and you'll have more high-end make it to your amp. Get a cable with good shielding and you'll have less noise make it to your amp. When it comes to speaker cable, this crap just doesn't matter. The signal coming out of your amp is beefy and not as susceptible to noise/EMI/RFI and the capacitance issues isn't really an issue at all. And as far as using super thick wire, the wire inside your amp at the output jack is small. The wire inside your speaker going from the terminals is small. I just rewired a Bogner cab and the super thick wire is just a pain to deal with. But I guess people like to over-do things for peace of mind haha.

The biggest thing to understand is that super expensive, low-cap instrument cable might not actually be what sounds the best for your rig. I know a lot of good amp builders actually prefer cheap cable with long runs to cut down on some high-end.

AND if you play like crap.....Just louder crap comes out.
 
cecilbag":mykzgqma said:
This is interesting to me. I always used monsters but I want to start making my own cables. I had settled on mogami 2524 to buy in bulk and make my own (recently got a gcx and ground control) so I could make my stuff out say 50' for bigger stages. I'll take all suggestions if someone feels there is something truly better. For the record I also did try a van de hull cable and heard a lot more high end, it seemed shrill to me. The reason I went to monsters 20 years ago was they sounded fatter to me. I could be crazy but there was a difference. The new monsters don't seem to have that anymore.

I agree with the monster comment. I have used them for a long time and I cut and old one slightly by dropping a rack case on it. I got a replacement and it sounded very different. Actually like shit. I was pissed off. That's when a friend told me to try Vandenhul. I have a 10 footer and 21 foot cable. I like it a lot.
 
I definitely notice differences. Some were hifi like the Vovox Sonorus. Some have more lows, more highs, and vice versa. I like Cornish Silver Series. I compared it to quite a few too many. I prefer a less stiff cable also. EA Lyric HG sound nice but they are stiff.
 
I like George L's if I'm trying to help out the top end stay in place. I've had a 3ft Monster speaker cable that's 20 years old and it made a noticeable difference back then and still does. But I don't sweat it if I can't use it because of length required etc. I like not to be too anal about this shit anymore and just plug in and play the damn thing.
 
The best way to really be able to break down the differences is to use a pedal looper like an octaswitch and plug a different cable into each loop and directly compare each. Differences among cables become very noticeable. This is how I found Evidence Audio cables to be my favorite.
 
I'll see if I can do some sort of A/B with my little GoPro camera. If that can pick up the difference, then even guys who have been playing too loud for too long should be able to hear the difference!
 
nevusofota":2g2lkp5s said:
The best way to really be able to break down the differences is to use a pedal looper like an octaswitch and plug a different cable into each loop and directly compare each. Differences among cables become very noticeable. This is how I found Evidence Audio cables to be my favorite.

Think about that for a second. Is the pedal buffered?
 
FourT6and2":31e672r1 said:
nevusofota":31e672r1 said:
The best way to really be able to break down the differences is to use a pedal looper like an octaswitch and plug a different cable into each loop and directly compare each. Differences among cables become very noticeable. This is how I found Evidence Audio cables to be my favorite.

Think about that for a second. Is the pedal buffered?
Boom.
 
Ventura":31f4ahg2 said:
FourT6and2":31f4ahg2 said:
nevusofota":31f4ahg2 said:
The best way to really be able to break down the differences is to use a pedal looper like an octaswitch and plug a different cable into each loop and directly compare each. Differences among cables become very noticeable. This is how I found Evidence Audio cables to be my favorite.

Think about that for a second. Is the pedal buffered?
Boom.
No. It's switchable. Think about this: it wouldn't matter anyway as each cable would be influenced equally by the buffer. Boom?
 
nevusofota":3vwznewa said:
Ventura":3vwznewa said:
FourT6and2":3vwznewa said:
nevusofota":3vwznewa said:
The best way to really be able to break down the differences is to use a pedal looper like an octaswitch and plug a different cable into each loop and directly compare each. Differences among cables become very noticeable. This is how I found Evidence Audio cables to be my favorite.

Think about that for a second. Is the pedal buffered?
Boom.
No. It's switchable. Think about this: it wouldn't matter anyway as each cable would be influenced equally by the buffer. Boom?

No. Not boom. Because a buffer buffers the signal well beyond being influenced by one cable having a capacitance of 22pF/ft vs another that is like 30pF/ft, or whatever the numbers are. But if you can turn the buffer off, it's a step in the right direction :)

But it's a looper. And the signal it's outputting is recorded. So I'm guessing it has to have a buffer because it is actively sending a signal out. It's not a passive device. Maybe I'm wrong about that one. But I don't see a pedal sending a recorded signal out without that signal also being buffered. Otherwise you'd be hearing silence. This is also why delay pedals that are true bypass don't have trailing delays when you switch the pedal off, but non-true bypass delay pedal will have trails when you switch them off. Because they are buffered. Make sense?
 
FourT6and2":1jmqrz9b said:
nevusofota":1jmqrz9b said:
Ventura":1jmqrz9b said:
FourT6and2":1jmqrz9b said:
nevusofota":1jmqrz9b said:
The best way to really be able to break down the differences is to use a pedal looper like an octaswitch and plug a different cable into each loop and directly compare each. Differences among cables become very noticeable. This is how I found Evidence Audio cables to be my favorite.

Think about that for a second. Is the pedal buffered?
Boom.
No. It's switchable. Think about this: it wouldn't matter anyway as each cable would be influenced equally by the buffer. Boom?

No. Not boom. Because a buffer buffers the signal well beyond being influenced by one cable having a capacitance of 22pF/ft vs another that is like 30pF/ft, or whatever the numbers are. But if you can turn the buffer off, it's a step in the right direction :)

But it's a looper. And the signal it's outputting is recorded. So I'm guessing it has to have a buffer because it is actively sending a signal out. It's not a passive device. Maybe I'm wrong about that one. But I don't see a pedal sending a recorded signal out without that signal also being buffered. Otherwise you'd be hearing silence. This is also why delay pedals that are true bypass don't have trailing delays when you switch the pedal off, but non-true bypass delay pedal will have trails when you switch them off. Because they are buffered. Make sense?

No, wait. I'm referring to a PEDAL looper. I apologize, maybe I wasn't clear. Differences in cables become obvious when connecting the output to the input of a single loop using the same cable. Do this for multiple loops then directly compare each loop. I never heard a difference between cables until I did this. Here's an example of a pedal looper.

https://www.musiciansfriend.com/amplifie ... ing-system
 
nevusofota":23i2tnlw said:
FourT6and2":23i2tnlw said:
nevusofota":23i2tnlw said:
Ventura":23i2tnlw said:
FourT6and2":23i2tnlw said:
nevusofota":23i2tnlw said:
The best way to really be able to break down the differences is to use a pedal looper like an octaswitch and plug a different cable into each loop and directly compare each. Differences among cables become very noticeable. This is how I found Evidence Audio cables to be my favorite.

Think about that for a second. Is the pedal buffered?
Boom.
No. It's switchable. Think about this: it wouldn't matter anyway as each cable would be influenced equally by the buffer. Boom?

No. Not boom. Because a buffer buffers the signal well beyond being influenced by one cable having a capacitance of 22pF/ft vs another that is like 30pF/ft, or whatever the numbers are. But if you can turn the buffer off, it's a step in the right direction :)

But it's a looper. And the signal it's outputting is recorded. So I'm guessing it has to have a buffer because it is actively sending a signal out. It's not a passive device. Maybe I'm wrong about that one. But I don't see a pedal sending a recorded signal out without that signal also being buffered. Otherwise you'd be hearing silence. This is also why delay pedals that are true bypass don't have trailing delays when you switch the pedal off, but non-true bypass delay pedal will have trails when you switch them off. Because they are buffered. Make sense?

No, wait. I'm referring to a PEDAL looper. I apologize, maybe I wasn't clear. Differences in cables become obvious when connecting the output to the input of a single loop using the same cable. Do this for multiple loops then directly compare each loop. I never heard a difference between cables until I did this. Here's an example of a pedal looper.

https://www.musiciansfriend.com/amplifie ... ing-system

Wait.... what? You lost me haha
 
Back
Top