Kiesel's customer service sucks!

  • Thread starter Thread starter MetalHeadMike
  • Start date Start date
sleewell2":2ceeze42 said:
So many people say they sound dead. Terrible customer service on top of that...


Nope.


Had amazing experiences with both benford and balaguer. Good customer service and great sounding and looking guitars are all possible.

The vibe I get from kiesel employees is that they think they're shit doesn't stink. That type of arrogance bugs me, especially when I keep hearing the guitars are far less than good.
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Yeah, they definitely put that kind of vibe out there. Seems like the companies ego is out of control. They're putting quantity over quality IMHO.
 
Luckily, my one and only Kiesel Aries build came out great and I was able to pick up another (used) Aries build that I like just as much. That's a scary story though. I can't believe they allow their sales people to talk to customers like that. And, that shit about robbing parts off customers' just-built custom guitars...WTF???
 
MetalHeadMike":2t5fgwg9 said:
SavageRiffer":2t5fgwg9 said:
I had a similar problem once when I bought a custom built Kiesel neck-through with a Wilkinson bridge. Everything about it was perfect except that the bridge could not achieve a low action. Even though I had the tremolo screwed as low as the studs would allow, and all the saddles adjusted as low as possible, it was too high off of the fretboard. I contacted Kiesel and told them about it and they basically told me that I can send it back or play it like it is. Well, after 8 weeks of building and 1 week to ship, I was tired of waiting around and didn't want to ship it back and wait more weeks, so I sold it for 1/2 of what I paid and build a beautiful Warmoth. Since then, I only use my own Warmoth builds.
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That sucks man! Especially when everything else about the guitar met your expectations.

That's how I felt. Loved everything about the guitar form the way it sounded to the way it looked to the way it felt, but the action and playability was horrible, and they just couldn't put their pride aside and fix it. At least that's how I see it.

To say"send it back or play it like it is" sounds about like the attitude I dealt with.
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It's hard to criticize them because they do make excellent quality stuff, and of course, they're made in the USA. However, a simple design flaw in the CNC milling of the neck pocket ruined the whole guitar. What I SHOULD have heard from them was "We'll expedite a new build." It was a neck through, so as high as the fretboard sat, there's so simple adjustment. It had to be rebuilt. However, they didn't want to expedite it for me. After waiting 9 weeks to get it in my hands, you would figure they would AT LEAST expedite another build; but when I asked them how long it would take, they said 6-7 weeks. That's poor customer support in my opinion. That was about 4 years ago. If it hasn't improved since or has gotten worse, then that's a damned shame.
 
Mesa and Suhr have the best customer service I've experienced. The kind where they go out of their way to make you happy and correct the problem. I have 2 Kiesels: A Bolt and a Vader 7. My Bolt came out perfect. It really is a killer instrument. My Vader is sweet too. But I had a zero fret on mine as it was one of the first ones in 2015.

Turns out, the fret caused pinging and the string would slide around during bends. People started complaining. Kiesel decided they would replace the zero fret with a nut, free of charge, if the owner wanted it done. They decided they would even change the design of the guitar and not put zero frets on them anymore. However, the offer to fix it, was for a limited time. Did I get an email from them as an owner letting me know of the limited time offer? Nope. I found out on FB. Jeff Kiesel mentioned it during one of his updates. I of course found out after the offer was taken off the table. So they wanted me to pay $100 for the work and $150 for shipping (coast to coast), for a defect. The worst part of it was that I got trashed by their fan-boi donkeys on the site for bringing it up. I ended up having Sal Tine do the work locally. Amazing job that I don't think Kiesel could have done any better. Sal actually had a Vader of his own that he had installed a nut on.

Just this week, I also learned that they offered to swap out the Hipshot saddles on 2015 and some 2016 Vaders because they also caused pinging. But this too was only offered for a limited time. I found out when I noticed the issue on my guitar and did some research. Again, no email as a customer and owner of the affected model. Luckily, Hipshot did the right thing and sent me free replacements. And again, one fan-boi ass munch blamed me for "not being on the ball" and keeping up with the company announcements.

I've had 7 Carvin/Kiesels and this is the only one I had an issue with. Once, I even sent a new build back for a rebuild because I didn't think the flame top was good enough. They honored that with no questions asked.

Would I buy Kiesel again? Yes, I would. It's an excellent product. But they definitely need to do more listening to the customer. That has seemed to fall along the side of the road in some cases. Overall, a good company with an excellent product and an amazing value considering that you're getting US custom shop guitars with tons of options.

PS

IMO, the worst part of the OP's story isn't the way Mike treated him (if that's how it went down). People are imperfect and we all f#ck up some times. Instead, what I find astounding is that the guitar left the shop with the saddles in that condition. I'm sure they'd argue it's "within spec" but when hardware is set at such an extreme position, something is wrong. These guitars come off CNC machines and should be virtually the same every time. And I know, they don't all come that way.

Dave
 
I messaged Jeff on Facebook with a link to this thread
 
Mike, I know we talked about it privately but I have to reiterate that this is fucking bullshit treatment on Kiesel's part. My VM7 came in perfect yet I'm still waiting on the custom Duncans. I'm hoping that Kiesel is paying attention and rectifies this sort of thing for the future because they really do seem to make a great guitar when they're built right.
 
Had good service from them way back in the day but things seem much different now. Last time I called they really acted like they were bothered to listen to anything but credit card numbers.
 
messenger":2v8oflwe said:
I messaged Jeff on Facebook with a link to this thread
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Good :thumbsup:

Maybe he'll read through and see what customers are saying about his company. I had plans on buying more guitars from them in the future but not now.
 
dfrattaroli":2ayh3thy said:
Mesa and Suhr have the best customer service I've experienced. The kind where they go out of their way to make you happy and correct the problem. I have 2 Kiesels: A Bolt and a Vader 7. My Bolt came out perfect. It really is a killer instrument. My Vader is sweet too. But I had a zero fret on mine as it was one of the first ones in 2015.

Turns out, the fret caused pinging and the string would slide around during bends. People started complaining. Kiesel decided they would replace the zero fret with a nut, free of charge, if the owner wanted it done. They decided they would even change the design of the guitar and not put zero frets on them anymore. However, the offer to fix it, was for a limited time. Did I get an email from them as an owner letting me know of the limited time offer? Nope. I found out on FB. Jeff Kiesel mentioned it during one of his updates. I of course found out after the offer was taken off the table. So they wanted me to pay $100 for the work and $150 for shipping (coast to coast), for a defect. The worst part of it was that I got trashed by their fan-boi donkeys on the site for bringing it up. I ended up having Sal Tine do the work locally. Amazing job that I don't think Kiesel could have done any better. Sal actually had a Vader of his own that he had installed a nut on.

Just this week, I also learned that they offered to swap out the Hipshot saddles on 2015 and some 2016 Vaders because they also caused pinging. But this too was only offered for a limited time. I found out when I noticed the issue on my guitar and did some research. Again, no email as a customer and owner of the affected model. Luckily, Hipshot did the right thing and sent me free replacements. And again, one fan-boi ass munch blamed me for "not being on the ball" and keeping up with the company announcements.

I've had 7 Carvin/Kiesels and this is the only one I had an issue with. Once, I even sent a new build back for a rebuild because I didn't think the flame top was good enough. They honored that with no questions asked.

Would I buy Kiesel again? Yes, I would. It's an excellent product. But they definitely need to do more listening to the customer. That has seemed to fall along the side of the road in some cases. Overall, a good company with an excellent product and an amazing value considering that you're getting US custom shop guitars with tons of options.

PS

IMO, the worst part of the OP's story isn't the way Mike treated him (if that's how it went down). People are imperfect and we all f#ck up some times. Instead, what I find astounding is that the guitar left the shop with the saddles in that condition. I'm sure they'd argue it's "within spec" but when hardware is set at such an extreme position, something is wrong. These guitars come off CNC machines and should be virtually the same every time. And I know, they don't all come that way.

Dave
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Thanks for sharing that!

Like I said, I love my 4 year old Carvin ST300c and its one of my favorite guitars, but TBH that was another case where the guitar came with issues straight from the factory. It has the infamous crooked side dots which is not a big deal and didn't bother me all that much. The bigger issue I didn't notice until I went to do a string change about two months after receiving it. It is a Floyd/locking nut and when I did my first string change I was checking tightness on all the hardware and found one of the screws that actually mounts the nut to the neck was completely stripped in the neck wood.

I called Carvin and talked to their lead tech, and he said its wasn't really that big of a deal because the tension of the strings applies downward force on the nut anyway. He said if I wanted I could send it back and he could put some glue in the hole and re-seat the screw. Again the attitude I felt was similar to this most recent experience in that the tech just seemed very put out that I was even calling in about something like that. I thought at the time that sounded like a cop out offer to fix it, but looking back I guess that's all you could do in that case aside from rebuilding since it is a neck-through. I saved myself the shipping and did that myself and its been fine ever since.
 
crankyrayhanky":1tmq6hn8 said:
That's ridiculous. There was another guy NinjaRaf who had a Kiesel last year that looked like a similar bridge and similar issue. I think you were on the right track with a neck shim and/or taller hipshot. This could have & should have been fixed and pretty easy if you are a guitar tech.

I ordered a Multiscale with a different bridge and it came out super nice....but I'm seeing too many stories that look like this issue is not unique.
If you see your guitar on the in stock inventory page update this thread, lol! I want to see more of it.
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Oh Hai!!

I ordered a couple of Kiesels in 2015. SCB6 and DC600. Both pretty similar overall in terms of what I wanted aesthetically, and man did they come out incredible in that sense. But they were both plagued with basically unfixable problems.

Problem 1...both guitars had similar issues to yours with the bridge, but not as extreme. The heights on yours are just insane. Mine were really high, and didn't really have room for adjustment, but I don't remember them being quite that high (though, we are talking a year or so ago when my DC600 went away).

Problem 2...I wanted to replace the pickups in my DC600 with some Dimarzio Dominions. Get the bridge installed perfectly fine. Go to install the neck, and I am adjusting pickup height, and I feel a pinch on my leg...flip the guitar over...screws went through the fucking body. Pull them out...turns out, they use different length of screw for the neck and bridge pickup mounting. The neck pup screws are about .25" longer than the bridge. Why. The. Fuck. Would you do this. Who the fuck thinks to check SCREW LENGTH OF MOUNTING SCREWS when changing pickups. There are many reason these things are fucking standardized. This, for some reason, pissed me off more than anything else because...it just doesn't make any fucking sense.

Problem 3...and really the biggest problem...both guitars sounded very lifeless and dead. I also have an LTD MH400 and an LTD H400. These 2 guitars were $350 each. Both combined cost half of what one of my Kiesels cost. Both LTDs play and sound a million times better than either of my Kiesels. This, to me, is just fucking stupid.

In any case...I ended up trading my SCB6 for my Gibson Gothic V, and I traded my DC600 to a friend locally for an AR15 300 blackout pistol build lol.

The screw thing really sealed the deal for me and no more Kiesel. Sorry, but its just fucking stupid and makes no sense. Your guitar bodies are flat, and there is no neck angle on neck throughs...which means there is literally no reason to have different length screws. When I talked to them...they denied that they used different length screws and then blamed me lol. I sent them a picture of the 2 screws next to each other, and they didn't respond to it. Then they offered to fix it if I paid shipping to and from. This guitar was less than a month old at that point. So sorry that you guys are too retarded to use same length screws, I am not dealing with this crap.

Kiesel has a lot of potential. A semi-custom shop that lets you spec out nearly every fucking detail of your guitar is SUCH a great idea. But their execution needs a lot of work. Customer service needs a lot of work. And apparently, logic, too haha.
 
Well it is great you got a refund. I hate shitbag service like this but man....Idk the "rules" but it kind of seems you are lucky you even get a refund. Between the way they handle things and the fact that you told them you adjusted the truss rod.

I am kind of surprised they didn't say you are not an authorized tech and you aren't getting a refund.
 
rbasaria":1vcgy863 said:
crankyrayhanky":1vcgy863 said:
That's ridiculous. There was another guy NinjaRaf who had a Kiesel last year that looked like a similar bridge and similar issue. I think you were on the right track with a neck shim and/or taller hipshot. This could have & should have been fixed and pretty easy if you are a guitar tech.

I ordered a Multiscale with a different bridge and it came out super nice....but I'm seeing too many stories that look like this issue is not unique.
If you see your guitar on the in stock inventory page update this thread, lol! I want to see more of it.
Click to expand...

Oh Hai!!

I ordered a couple of Kiesels in 2015. SCB6 and DC600. Both pretty similar overall in terms of what I wanted aesthetically, and man did they come out incredible in that sense. But they were both plagued with basically unfixable problems.

Problem 1...both guitars had similar issues to yours with the bridge, but not as extreme. The heights on yours are just insane. Mine were really high, and didn't really have room for adjustment, but I don't remember them being quite that high (though, we are talking a year or so ago when my DC600 went away).

Problem 2...I wanted to replace the pickups in my DC600 with some Dimarzio Dominions. Get the bridge installed perfectly fine. Go to install the neck, and I am adjusting pickup height, and I feel a pinch on my leg...flip the guitar over...screws went through the fucking body. Pull them out...turns out, they use different length of screw for the neck and bridge pickup mounting. The neck pup screws are about .25" longer than the bridge. Why. The. Fuck. Would you do this. Who the fuck things to check SCREW LENGTH OF MOUNTING SCREWS when changing pickups. There are many reason these things are fucking standardized. This, for some reason, pissed me off more than anything else because...it just doesn't make any fucking sense.

Problem 3...and really the biggest problem...both guitars sounded very lifeless and dead. I also have an LTD MH400 and an LTD H400. These 2 guitars were $350 each. Both combined cost half of what one of my Kiesels cost. Both LTDs play and sound a million times better than either of my Kiesels. This, to me, is just fucking stupid.

In any case...I ended up trading my SCB6 for my Gibson Gothic V, and I traded my DC600 to a friend locally for an AR15 300 blackout pistol build lol.

The screw thing really sealed the deal for me and no more Kiesel. Sorry, but its just fucking stupid and makes no sense. Your guitar bodies are flat, and there is no neck angle on neck throughs...which means there is literally no reason to have different length screws. When I talked to them...they denied that they used different length screws and then blamed me lol. Then they offered to fix it if I paid shipping to and from. This guitar was less than a month old at that point. So sorry that you guys are too retarded to use same length screws, I am not dealing with this crap.

Kiesel has a lot of potential. A semi-custom shop that lets you spec out nearly every fucking detail of your guitar is SUCH a great idea. But their execution needs a lot of work. Customer service needs a lot of work. And apparently, logic, too haha.
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Not good my friend. Sounds like I'm not the only one that's had issues.
 
Another member mentioned this, and I'm not sure if this picture shows the neck angle/pocket as maybe contributing to the issue I had with saddle height, but here is the only pic that would show that relationship:

DSC03554%202_zpsiefgjylb.jpg
 
maddnotez":3swjh8r9 said:
Well it is great you got a refund. I hate shitbag service like this but man....Idk the "rules" but it kind of seems you are lucky you even get a refund. Between the way they handle things and the fact that you told them you adjusted the truss rod.

I am kind of surprised they didn't say you are not an authorized tech and you aren't getting a refund.
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Yeah man, I was sweating bullets about the refund considering the actual 10 day trial period had lapsed by the time they got the guitar back the second time. I'll have to say the sales manager did give me his word early on when I first called in to discuss the issue stating that they would not stick a customer with a guitar that wasn't working for them and I'm thankful that worked out.
 
On a completely separate note...Mesa has by far the best customer service I have experienced. My Mark IV started acting wonky in early November. Ended up taking it to a local authorized service center. These guys had the amp for 10 FUCKING WEEKS! I called them every week after them having it for 3 weeks and me not hearing anything. Their site says 7-10 days. So I started making weekly calls. Only talked to the actual tech once, talked to a different person each week. Finally got sick of it and called Mesa. Talked to Rich. Explain the situation and he says...wait, 10 weeks?! That's just ridiculous. Calls me back 20 minutes later after talking to the tech lol. Next day, I picked the amp up and shipped it to Mesa. When I picked it up, the dude tells me...I shoulda sent it to Mesa a month ago. I should've just sent it to them in the first place. The amp is now on its way back to me and should be here Tuesday. Total time that Mesa had the amp before calling me to tell me it was ready: 1. Fucking. Week. Why these local guys had it for 10 weeks is beyond me.
 
Thanks for posting this. I wouldn't buy a guitar from them just on principal alone just from this thread. That's pathetic for this guy to be employed by Kiesel period. I have often thought if taking a chance and buying one of the guitars on the completed list.Not now. I'd rather buy something from a builder that gives a fuck! Only as good as your worst mistake. No one is perfect and.mistakes happen.. understood. The customer is always right..fucking sales 101! Simple, what a waste that's a nice looking guitar. To bad. I will void any of their shit! Thanks 4 the heads up! Peace!!
 
Keisel/Carvin & Peavey stuff i won't deal with.

You can never sell that stuff, your stuck with it forever like luggage.

Carvin once made a Credit Card purchase with my card without my authorization.
 
Beandust":3ou9ddd6 said:
Thanks for posting this. I wouldn't buy a guitar from them just on principal alone just from this thread. That's pathetic for this guy to be employed by Kiesel period. I have often thought if taking a chance and buying one of the guitars on the completed list.Not now. I'd rather buy something from a builder that gives a fuck! Only as good as your worst mistake. No one is perfect and.mistakes happen.. understood. The customer is always right..fucking sales 101! Simple, what a waste that's a nice looking guitar. To bad. I will void any of their shit! Thanks 4 the heads up! Peace!!
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Yeah, I have never had one and maybe never will. Definitely not new.

I have heard nothing but bad things about Kiesel. Maybe one or two guys saying that had a good guitar and a good experience. The rest have been bad.
 
I had a great experience and love my AM7:


That being said, I was looking at another axe later this Spring and was 99% ready for another Kiesel. After reading this thread, I can't help but be dissuaded. I'm not so surprised that they take parts off of finished guitars for NAMM as I can imagine there is a big pressure there, but the fact that they say it out loud with such arrogance and seem blind to the notion that it is waaaay wrong once the guitar is paid.

Sending out hipshots that are maxxed out is not acceptable.

I think a Kiesel rep has to fix this and make it public. Otherwise I have serious deGAS right now.
 
Man, sorry to read about the OP's experience. Been wanting to check out the Aries 6 for some time now.
 
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