Liberals: Dysgenic Non Compos Mentis

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And the first paragraph doesn't say anything about all non believers.
But the second verse does. Are you suggesting that only the beast and the false prophet will be eternally tormented in the lake of fire, and even that is not to be taken literally?

… Matthew 25:41

41 “Then he will say to those on his left, Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

Matthew 25:46

46 And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

I don’t see how punishment can refer to simply death with no consciousness “for eternity” as this is self contradictory.
 
Would it make sense to call capital punishment eternal punishment? There ain't no coming back...
 
But the second verse does. Are you suggesting that only the beast and the false prophet will be eternally tormented in the lake of fire, and even that is not to be taken literally?

… Matthew 25:41

41 “Then he will say to those on his left, Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

Matthew 25:46

46 And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

I don’t see how punishment can refer to simply death with no consciousness “for eternity” as this is self contradictory.
Again, your quote references satan and his angels. And as I’ve told you a couple times now, the Bible refers to hell as eternity separate from god. If it was meant burning in hell why would there not be a verse anywhere saying that in regards to non believers?

I will say, if that is what Christians actually believe then it explains why I’m not Christian. Who the fuck would want to worship a god that you do so under pain of eternity burning in a lake of fire ?
 
Again, your quote references satan and his angels. And as I’ve told you a couple times now, the Bible refers to hell as eternity separate from god. If it was meant burning in hell why would there not be a verse anywhere saying that in regards to non believers?

I will say, if that is what Christians actually believe then it explains why I’m not Christian. Who the fuck would want to worship a god that you do so under pain of eternity burning in a lake of fire ?
I agree, how is it a real choice, if choosing otherwise leads to eternal punishment? The Matthew verses are regarding the goats and sheep, IE the believers and unbelievers, IE humans — not Satan and angels. The unbelievers are to suffer eternal punishment. So again, I ask, how can one suffer eternal punishment if it they are not being punished forever? Here in the united states, a capital punishment is considered a finite event. Sure, some may believe the executed are going on to be punished forever, but one would not typically understand being executed and thus missing out on what would have been great as eternal punishment. And again, the Revelation verses say the unbelievers are going to go in the lake of fire where Satan and the beast are being eternally tormented. I think it's reasonable to conclude, given the Matthew verses for example, that they will suffer the same fate. Sure, it's not as explicit as it could be. But I don't think a lack of unambiguous writing on this is a good argument. Like everything in the bible, there is a degree of interpretation or debate to be had. So if you don't believe that the bible teaches eternal conscious torment of the unbeliever that's fine — I just don't think it's as cut and dry as you seemed to state.
 
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I agree, how is it a real choice, if choosing otherwise leads to eternal punishment? The Matthew verses are regarding the goats and sheep, IE the believers and unbelievers, IE humans — not Satan and angels. The unbelievers are to suffer eternal punishment. So again, I ask, how can one suffer eternal punishment if it they are not being punished forever? Here in the united states, a capital punishment is considered a finite event. Sure, some may believe the executed are going on to be punished forever, but one would not understand simply being executed and thus missing out on what would have been great as being "Eternally punished." And again, the Revelation verses say the unbelievers are going to go in the lake of fire where Satan and the beast are being eternally tormented. I think it's reasonable to conclude, given the Matthew verses for example, that they will suffer the same fate. Sure, it's not as explicit as it could be. But I don't think a lack of unambiguous writing on this is a very strong argument against eternal conscious torment for the unbeliever. Like everything in the bible, there is a degree of interpretation or debate to be had. So if you believe, like many Christians, don't believe that the bible teaches eternal conscious torment of the unbeliever then that's fine — I just don't think it's as cut and dry as you initially stated.
There is nothing cut and dry about anything in the Bible.
 
I will say, if that is what Christians actually believe then it explains why I’m not Christian. Who the fuck would want to worship a god that you do so under pain of eternity burning in a lake of fire ?
I struggled with that for a long while. I used to complain that Christianity was like a shotgun wedding. The answer is he is God, he sets the rules, we cannot change that reality. He is holy and cannot be in the presence of sin. Because he loves us and wants no one to go to hell he sent his son to atone for our sin in our stead so we can be imputed as holy and therefore acceptable in his sight. Eternity is a long time to be tormented. I don't wish that on anyone and hope that they can make peace with God in this life before it's too late. This is why @VonBonfire praying for the dead has no effect. We can't change their fate.
 
He is holy and cannot be in the presence of sin.
Seems to me that if he is watching and judging everything we do and his holy spirit is floating around us, he is already surrounded by a whole lotta "sin" ...But you're telling me his "holiness" makes him send people to hell even though he doesn't really want to? :ROFLMAO:
 
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Eternity is a long time to be tormented
Yeah no kidding. It really takes some mental twisting to try to rationalize the justice in that. That's why I think there are a good portion of sadistic psychos that adhere to the religion. Not all, but enough, especially in the US.
 
Seems to me that if he is watching and judging everything we do and his holy spirit is floating around us, he is already surrounded by a whole lotta "sin" ...But you're telling me his "holiness" makes him send people to hell even though he doesn't really want to? :ROFLMAO:
The Holy Spirit only dwells with "the elect" ie. those who are saved and are already covered by the blood of Jesus. The Holy Spirit is actually God ie one of the Godhead - the Father/Son/Holy Spirit.
 
The Holy Spirit only dwells with "the elect" ie. those who are saved and are already covered by the blood of Jesus. The Holy Spirit is actually God ie one of the Godhead - the Father/Son/Holy Spirit.
Is the holy spirit god or one of the "godhead"? Because it can't be god and one of the godhead at the same time, if the godhead is god. That's just simple logic.
 
Is the holy spirit god or one of the "godhead"? Because it can't be god and one of the godhead at the same time, if the godhead is god. That's just simple logic.
That's the nature of the Trinity.
 
I do. Your salvation is between You and God. Not between third parties praying for you when you are dead after you haven't accepted Christ.
Yes and you'll say grape juice not wine is fine and strumming acoustic guitars and no divine liturgy in a pole barn somewhere is the real faith. I have nothing to debate with you because to me protestantism isn't really even christianity and you're just another schismatic scripture speculator when it's all been long established theology over a thousand years ago.

Is the holy spirit god or one of the "godhead"? Because it can't be god and one of the godhead at the same time, if the godhead is god. That's just simple logic.
"I believe in the holy spirit, the Lord, and giver of life, who proceedeth from the father who with the father and son together is worshipped and glorified. Who spake by the prophets."
 
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