Techdeth
RESIDENT ROCK PROFESSOR
I just got my student one . Ran it through greenbacks . Sounded great
TotallyRadGuitars
Well-known member
That's a good point, and I probably wouldn't have believed you just a few years ago, but recently I nabbed a Rev F recto and played it side by side with my Rev G and 3ch. I know, totally different Mesas, but while they can all do the same "type" of sound, probably modded could be identical, it's true that there's something about the Rev F that I only feel while playing, even if I could never pick it out in a blind test if it was dialed to sound the same as the others. Someone else was telling me about some kind of phantom capacitance or... something... forgot how it was worded exactly, I'll need to dig through my emails. But long story short, something about the boards and parts used as a sum makes an amp feel different, so even if you recreated the exact circuit but used different manufacturing materials (ex. a different type of silicon for the PCB), it wouldn't be the same. I haven't verified any of this, might just be all smoke and mirrors, but sounds like the same kind of thing here.
RaceU4her
Well-known member
I read about the mythical feel of iic+’s and Cameron’s for 20 years on forums and just kind of thought “whatever”, the slight difference in feel of the amps I had wouldn’t really sway me one way or the other, I figured it was just guys hyping up their amps.. then I got a Cameron and iic+ and now I’m one of them preaching about the feel. I’ve not played a mark iii, but if the iii feels close to what all my other amps feel like even if it sounds as good as the iic+ I can understand the price difference. It’s like having two equally hot chicks and one of them just lays there dead fish style and the other has that special touch and fucks your brains out and wants it harder, you’re gonna be willing to bust out the wallet for expensive dinners to keep her around where as the other maybe gets a 6 piece nugget happy meal.
R
Racerxrated
Well-known member
Comparing a Mk III to a C+ is kinda like comparing a DSL to a JMP 2203/1959. The DSL sounds good, does the job well and people like the tone, playing out or recording. But, then someone brings a JMP in…boosted or not, and everyone is blown the fuck away as to how amazeballs it sounds. The DSL gets sold. Or starts collecting dust.
Edit: I should add that a Coli is in a different category altogether. A C+ Coli is the king but a B or 3 Coli, because of the monster power section shared is not too far behind…just the feel is unique with the C+.
Edit: I should add that a Coli is in a different category altogether. A C+ Coli is the king but a B or 3 Coli, because of the monster power section shared is not too far behind…just the feel is unique with the C+.
Bxlxaxkxe
Amp ho
Just as an FYI- I happen to have a c+ and VII at the moment. I don’t deserve either amp but here we are lol.
The 7 really doesn’t “nail” the c+ sound or feel if I’m being nitpicky which we all are. But that’s not a bad thing. It has its own sound and feel and each amp makes me play differently. I can get them to sound pretty similar but when you’re the one playing, you realize they are different amps with their own thing happening.
The VII is really aggressive and modern and really pushes me to play faster, aggressive more “metal” type stuff. It’s angry. There is a lot of high end available in the amp - lately I’ve been bringing down the treble on the GEQ. There’s some depth in the low end that the c+ doesn’t have. The feel is tighter than the c+ but not wizard immediate so it’s still fun to play.
The C+ is more liquid, fluffy if you will. This particular one is really more of a rock/hard rock amp IMO. It’s thick and articulate at the same time- almost feels like two guitar tracks happening simultaneously. There’s more give vs the tighter Mark 7. It’s less “I’m fucking angry” and more “I’ve been doing some soul searching lately”. Just kill me for saying that
Whichever one my ears get used to, I tend to prefer.
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mooncobra
Well-known member
so this amp fucks hard?
glpg80
Well-known member
I’ve yet to find a IIC+ clip that compares. The headroom let’s you getaway with dialing out more bass than normal and cranking hard on the GEQ 80Hz to make up for it and it doesn’t thin out. Just gets more aggressive. She’s a beast and knows it wont break ??
anomaly
Well-known member
Have you used the VII in a band context? I'm wondering if they work well in a live situation? as we know the IIC+ is hard to make cut through at times. You gotta use your 750hz slider quite a bit.
V
VESmedic
Well-known member
tallcoolone
Well-known member
Marks have def shot up in price in the past 3-5yrs just like everything else. I grabbed a real clean 60w red stripe MkIII combo with the EV12L and EQ for $1400 a month ago. Sounds great, not really my thing but I wanted to spend some time with one since it’s such an iconic amp. With the EV and GEQ I see these 2 tube versions selling for $2k+ nowadays
Not sure I could gig with it tho—just too different a tone from the Marshalls and Friedmans I usually run with. Not enough cut/bite for me
Not sure I could gig with it tho—just too different a tone from the Marshalls and Friedmans I usually run with. Not enough cut/bite for me
GJgo
Well-known member
IMO the MkIII is by far the best Mark for thrash and it's not even close. While all of them are raw, the red/blue/green especially thrash hard as they are even more aggressive. For decades the III (and IIB for other reasons) has been underrated, I suspect prices are only going up from here.
After playing the VII in the live (metal/thrash) band, I wouldn't fuck it with someone else's dick. Possibly the worst live mix amp I've ever had, the notes were completely inaudible by every guy in the band. Pure mush.
After playing the VII in the live (metal/thrash) band, I wouldn't fuck it with someone else's dick. Possibly the worst live mix amp I've ever had, the notes were completely inaudible by every guy in the band. Pure mush.
Torgo2003
Active member
What's your favorite amp to play live for those type of tones?
GJgo
Well-known member
A Mark III+, for sure. From the hoards of Mesas I've had, the top two for what I want to do are my loop modded IIB Coli and my blue stripe III+ "coli". (It's really a 60, but I'm slaving it into a M180 which is a IIC+ Coli power section in a rack.) This particular III+ is fairly new to me but it's blowing doors at rehearsal. Can't wait to gig it and find out who the winner is.
The IIC+ still wins for recording but it loses live to these guys.
glpg80
Well-known member
That’s insane it doesn’t fit in a pocket within the mix. Did you experiment with sliders or EQ to find out where in the spectrum it was lacking at least? Was it just too much gain? I know I’ve been hesitant to go down the Herbert hole because of their awful live attitude even though they make great studio amps.
GJgo
Well-known member
Of course, I spent most of a 3 hour rehearsal trying all the modes & settings hoping to find something that works. Never did. Closest it came was C+ mode with abnormally low gain. To be fair before this I actually liked the amp a lot, but to me how an amp works in the live mix is king and that's where my amps go to live or die.
Not exactly sure how to describe it but you can hear it here if you know what to listen for. Picture the note attack of the OGs is very sharp, like a right angle. Now picture the note attack of the MkVII, it's more like a beveled edge. When you're playing fast & aggressive that lack of attack definition smears all the notes together.
glpg80
Well-known member
I hear what you mean and what you’re pointing out now. Does a treble booster into the amp fix it? It has to be fixed pre preamp and not post since it looks like they’re cutting massive amounts of top end for stability. Adding it after won’t work spectrally since there’s an aggressive low pass filter going on. Makes me think I want to get one just to mod it to fix that glaring problem
Techdeth
RESIDENT ROCK PROFESSOR
This I agree with
GJgo
Well-known member
Well, a traditional boost doesn't help. You can hear it here. In the live band it actually made it worse, and I like boosting Marks!
I feel bad because the VII has a LOT going for it and I think will be amazing for a lot of modern / bedroom / studio players. For guys that want a high power tube amp that pushes a lot of air though, this is not it. OG mark prices are still in no danger.
glpg80
Well-known member
Does the JP2C have the same problem?
anomaly
Well-known member
For 80's thrash you might be right, they got that nasty aggression to them. I still prefer the IIC+ and IV though for anything 90's and up.