My AxeFx is having me consider selling my amps

[FIREBALL]

i am a avid hater of the axe fx for many reasons, and yes i have played one.

i hate tweaking a single unit to get all of your tones. its a simple knob person's fucking nightmare.
it has no balls. it has bass, and records like bass, but has no balls/man junk that make your hair move.
what is recorded and what is perceived live are two different needs in my books.
the volume you play your tube amplifiers at also divides players as well.
any unit in my books that has a cost of over $800 and needs constant updates that also do not allow for multiple tasks ala a PC is not worth it.
its still a modeler in my books, and will increase effeciency for guys in the studio paying $$$$ for studio time, or live where they play direct to the FOH.
and lastly, there are dynamics in tubes and tube amplifiers that cannot be replicated with solid state. i dont care how well it is designed, i picked out the modelers in a blind test on the forum before i even played one.

if it fits your needs, go for it. is it a substitute? depends on your ears, age, and needs once again. to me it is nothing but a tool, just like eventides. but i will say at least herberts, bogners, engls, marshalls, and all other amplifiers are tubed and have the dynamics (albeit some lacking more than others) that any modeler algorithm will have a bitch replicating.

i agree with u..i dont get the hype

 

[TheMagicEight]

Before I had any sort of great amp, I got pretty far into the modelers and trying to get them to sound good. This was quite a few years back and things have changed quite a bit, but I've continued with the modeling software because I can't always play as loud as I want at 2am. I've given up recently and have been just micing my amps with the volume knob just barely cracked open, which has yielded far more satisfying results. This has left a bad taste for modelers in my mouth, but with Vai and Petrucci using them, I might just give it a shot.

I guess the other issue I - and other people - have with it is that it's no longer "simple" technology. With my tube amps, I know exactly how the signal travels and how the tone is obtained, and I don't have the first clue what's happening with the modeler. I definitely don't want to judge it before actually trying the Axe out, but I suppose my big fear is that the years I've committed to finding my sound - the amount of effort it's taken to get to where I am - will go to waste because a preset on a digital box sounds just as good. There's something mystical about an awesome tube amp and I'd hate to see that go away. Kind of like Autotune, but for guitar IMO.

 

[jcj]

To the OP....congrats! I dig mine, glad you're digging yours!

I have some KIILER tube amps, yet the Axe stays

Hmmmmmm......I must have tin ears........

 

[gbsmusic]

Wow glpg80, I think it's nap time, or maybe you need a "Time Out"

 

[Gainfreak]

I always hear people say that the Axe-FX lacks balls and doesn't hang with a real amp at louder volumes. But wouldn't that have more to do with what poweramp you're using?

I still have yet to be convinced that it can touch the real amps it's trying to sound like, but still, considering it's got all those effects, you can record direct, you can use it with your amp, etc. It still sounds like a good buy.

It has to do with the poweramp you use and how you set up the volume within the unit itself and how you setup everything in the signal chain.

I was having issues with volume on my AXE-FX at live gigs. To be quite honest with you I was getting smoked by my other guitar player at my last two gigs and it was the first time in history the soundman kept asking me if I could turn up and I had my volume on the Ax-fx almost on full. It would have been easy for me to write off the AXE-FX and make a post on the net and spread a rumor that it doesn't cut it live or it has no balls but given that I have a 1500 watt poweramp logic dictates that the problem was with the driver and not the axe LMAO. I spent some time with the axe-fx and I noticed that when I cut out the effects the volume jumped up a bit which then told me that everything you add to the chain will effect the volume and you need to adjust that accordingly..... Lesson number one learned
The next thing I noticed is that on my patches when I went into my amp sims that the volume was set to minus 4.35db...not the main amps master volume but there is a place where you scroll over and it will have volume in Db.(going by memory here!) I set that to zero DB and guess what? Problem solved. Now the volume on 2 is the same I had when almost maxed out. Now fast forward to my last gig..... I crushed the other guitarist in the band and actually had to turn down.

Now on another note and you guys can take this how you want it. Even with the previous volume issues I had, the soundman said I don't know WTF you are using but you have one of the best/FATTEST tones that ive ever heard. We've played the same place 3 times already and he has said that same statement 3 times already. To add more props to the AXE-FX the new guitar player of my band is a straight into Marshall type of guy who was worried about me using the Axe-FX. After listening to his tone I dialed in a patch to mimic his sound. Let's just say he has no issues now All of this may sound like grand internet BS stories but it's 100% true.

Listen, I don't give a Ratts ass what people use... Truly. I've said this many times and I'll freaking say it again. The axe-fx is a tool like any amp out there. if you don't dig it FINE. What's the big fucking deal? The thing that does bug me is when people spread fiction off as fact and that's when I have to laugh. If you don't like the axe-fx...AWESOME there are many amps out there but if you make a sweeping generalization based on playing the thing for a few minutes or you parrot something that you heard on the net and claim it as fact then you are an idiot regardless of what piece of gear you are using!

(Im not using anyone as an example here.. I'm just stating what Ive seen lol!_)

On another note... Danny... If you want to try the axe-fx you are welcome to try it anytime you want

 

[thiswaythatway]

I always hear people say that the Axe-FX lacks balls and doesn't hang with a real amp at louder volumes. But wouldn't that have more to do with what poweramp you're using?

I still have yet to be convinced that it can touch the real amps it's trying to sound like, but still, considering it's got all those effects, you can record direct, you can use it with your amp, etc. It still sounds like a good buy.

It has to do with the poweramp you use and how you set up the volume within the unit itself and how you setup everything in the signal chain.

I was having issues with volume on my AXE-FX at live gigs. To be quite honest with you I was getting smoked by my other guitar player at my last two gigs and it was the first time in history the soundman kept asking me if I could turn up and I had my volume on the Ax-fx almost on full. It would have been easy for me to write off the AXE-FX and make a post on the net and spread a rumor that it doesn't cut it live or it has no balls but given that I have a 1500 watt poweramp logic dictates that the problem was with the driver and not the axe LMAO. I spent some time with the axe-fx and I noticed that when I cut out the effects the volume jumped up a bit which then told me that everything you add to the chain will effect the volume and you need to adjust that accordingly..... Lesson number one learned
The next thing I noticed is that on my patches when I went into my amp sims that the volume was set to minus 4.35db...not the main amps master volume but there is a place where you scroll over and it will have volume in Db.(going by memory here!) I set that to zero DB and guess what? Problem solved. Now the volume on 2 is the same I had when almost maxed out. Now fast forward to my last gig..... I crushed the other guitarist in the band and actually had to turn down.

Now on another note and you guys can take this how you want it. Even with the previous volume issues I had, the soundman said I don't know WTF you are using but you have one of the best/FATTEST tones that ive ever heard. We've played the same place 3 times already and he has said that same statement 3 times already. To add more props to the AXE-FX the new guitar player of my band is a straight into Marshall type of guy who was worried about me using the Axe-FX. After listening to his tone I dialed in a patch to mimic his sound. Let's just say he has no issues now All of this may sound like grand internet BS stories but it's 100% true.

Listen, I don't give a Ratts ass what people use... Truly. I've said this many times and I'll freaking say it again. The axe-fx is a tool like any amp out there. if you don't dig it FINE. What's the big fucking deal? The thing that does bug me is when people spread fiction off as fact and that's when I have to laugh. If you don't like the axe-fx...AWESOME there are many amps out there but if you make a sweeping generalization based on playing the thing for a few minutes or you parrot something that you heard on the net and claim it as fact then you are an idiot regardless of what piece of gear you are using!

(Im not using anyone as an example here.. I'm just stating what Ive seen lol!_)

On another note... Danny... If you want to try the axe-fx you are welcome to try it anytime you want

You metal freak! What are you doing up soo early? My daughter is eating toast and milk and the dog is getting everything that's getting thrown on the floor. It's been harder to get out but i guess I'll see you Saturday.

 

[spawnofthesith]

Congrats on your AxeFx dude, cool to hear that it is exceeding your expectations.


I'm not a hater of the AxeFX per sey, but it definitely isn't something for me. I am a hater of the overhype it gets though A bit overrated in my opinion. I just haven't heard anything that would merit a lot of the worship it gets. Clips sound good, but nothing amazing or groundbreaking, and I have seen multiple artists live with the axe (Devin Townsend, Dweezil Zappa, Cynic, etc.) and again, it sounded fine but nothing jaw dropping or astounding (well Cynic was the exception in the fact that their tone was absolutely horrible that night). I guess bottom line, my opinion is that it is a cool unit, but I don't think its gonna be replacing tubes any time soon. If I was a strictly recording person, I would get one, but I don't the the Axefx is all that great for live application

 

[Gainfreak]

I always hear people say that the Axe-FX lacks balls and doesn't hang with a real amp at louder volumes. But wouldn't that have more to do with what poweramp you're using?

I still have yet to be convinced that it can touch the real amps it's trying to sound like, but still, considering it's got all those effects, you can record direct, you can use it with your amp, etc. It still sounds like a good buy.

It has to do with the poweramp you use and how you set up the volume within the unit itself and how you setup everything in the signal chain.

I was having issues with volume on my AXE-FX at live gigs. To be quite honest with you I was getting smoked by my other guitar player at my last two gigs and it was the first time in history the soundman kept asking me if I could turn up and I had my volume on the Ax-fx almost on full. It would have been easy for me to write off the AXE-FX and make a post on the net and spread a rumor that it doesn't cut it live or it has no balls but given that I have a 1500 watt poweramp logic dictates that the problem was with the driver and not the axe LMAO. I spent some time with the axe-fx and I noticed that when I cut out the effects the volume jumped up a bit which then told me that everything you add to the chain will effect the volume and you need to adjust that accordingly..... Lesson number one learned
The next thing I noticed is that on my patches when I went into my amp sims that the volume was set to minus 4.35db...not the main amps master volume but there is a place where you scroll over and it will have volume in Db.(going by memory here!) I set that to zero DB and guess what? Problem solved. Now the volume on 2 is the same I had when almost maxed out. Now fast forward to my last gig..... I crushed the other guitarist in the band and actually had to turn down.

Now on another note and you guys can take this how you want it. Even with the previous volume issues I had, the soundman said I don't know WTF you are using but you have one of the best/FATTEST tones that ive ever heard. We've played the same place 3 times already and he has said that same statement 3 times already. To add more props to the AXE-FX the new guitar player of my band is a straight into Marshall type of guy who was worried about me using the Axe-FX. After listening to his tone I dialed in a patch to mimic his sound. Let's just say he has no issues now All of this may sound like grand internet BS stories but it's 100% true.

Listen, I don't give a Ratts ass what people use... Truly. I've said this many times and I'll freaking say it again. The axe-fx is a tool like any amp out there. if you don't dig it FINE. What's the big fucking deal? The thing that does bug me is when people spread fiction off as fact and that's when I have to laugh. If you don't like the axe-fx...AWESOME there are many amps out there but if you make a sweeping generalization based on playing the thing for a few minutes or you parrot something that you heard on the net and claim it as fact then you are an idiot regardless of what piece of gear you are using!

(Im not using anyone as an example here.. I'm just stating what Ive seen lol!_)

On another note... Danny... If you want to try the axe-fx you are welcome to try it anytime you want

You metal freak! What are you doing up soo early? My daughter is eating toast and milk and the dog is getting everything that's getting thrown on the floor. It's been harder to get out but i guess I'll see you Saturday.

Wassup Brother!! I'm up so early because I couldn't sleep lol I totally understand how hard it must be for you to get out these days but I will most definitely see you saturday!!

 

[Gainfreak]

Congrats on your AxeFx dude, cool to hear that it is exceeding your expectations.


I'm not a hater of the AxeFX per sey, but it definitely isn't something for me. I am a hater of the overhype it gets though A bit overrated in my opinion. I just haven't heard anything that would merit a lot of the worship it gets. Clips sound good, but nothing amazing or groundbreaking, and I have seen multiple artists live with the axe (Devin Townsend, Dweezil Zappa, Cynic, etc.) and again, it sounded fine but nothing jaw dropping or astounding (well Cynic was the exception in the fact that their tone was absolutely horrible that night). I guess bottom line, my opinion is that it is a cool unit, but I don't think its gonna be replacing tubes any time soon. If I was a strictly recording person, I would get one, but I don't the the Axefx is all that great for live application

I think the Axe-fx has been out long enough for there to be some truth to the Hype. When something gets overhyped and it doesn't hold water the product will go away... Not so with the axe. With that said, Like I said, It's not going to be for everyone and I respect that

and just to stick my 0.02 in. Ive seen many bands live over the years that had shit tone and that goes for bands that use the best of the best when it comes to tube amps. I cannot pass off bad sound because of the amp used because the hard fact is that there is a lot going on when it comes to live sound. In Fact you can't blame it only on the gear because there are Way to many variables

 

[spawnofthesith]

I think the Axe-fx has been out long enough for there to be some truth to the Hype. When something gets overhyped and it doesn't hold water the product will go away... Not so with the axe. With that said, Like I said, It's not going to be for everyone and I respect that

and just to stick my 0.02 in. Ive seen many bands live over the years that had shit tone and that goes for bands that use the best of the best when it comes to tube amps. I cannot pass off bad sound because of the amp used because the hard fact is that there is a lot going on when it comes to live sound. In Fact you can't blame it only on the gear because there are Way to many variables

Perhaps overhyped wasn't the proper word choice, overrated (by some users) might be more what I meant. I mean again I think it is a really cool unit, but the asshatery I have seen by a lot of users on a lot of forums, especially on HCAF, is always a bit of a turn off.

And that is also true about the live sound.

Ideally I would like to see a peaceful world where tube amp users aren't sticking their noses up at anyone who uses the AxeFx, and AxeFx users don't present a pretentious attitude of superiority to all those have not been "enlightened" to the ways of the axe. Two extremes of course here, but its the internet and you see a lot of both

In the end, my opinion try everything out, and when you find what works for you, stick to it, and disregard any haters.

 

[cliffc8488]

Irony, you have it in spades.

 

[mentoneman]

it seems as though what i've said all along, from the pre-ownership listening to the clips phase to now, is exactly what i am experiencing with the axe.

the stereo rack effects are huge and the best i've ever personally owned.
the synth sounds are head turning.
the delays in this box are ridiculously awesome, from echoplex to memory man to 2290, probably the most accurately reproduced features in the box.
the reverb is lexicon comparable.
some of the pedal effects are great and things like compressors and dirt boxes have evolved greatly in it and the simplicity of routing these things digitally without rack interfaces, cable, space requirements are a dream come true


the amps
here's where it gets tricky. i'm getting great SOUNDS in the territories of the amp models i'm using, granted every tone i dial in has drive pedals, paraeq, cab sims, and one or more post amp effects.
their just not BEHAVING in a manner i'm familiar with. if you just bang on a rock preset it's fine, but for subtle hybrid pick players like myself, sometimes it's too flat, sometimes its too harsh, sometimes too waxy in the mids, particularly when you get to rolling of gtr volume....

like gainy said, the levels must be monitored all along the way to keep things optimized and consistent to the output. i'm doing my best to optimize each link in the chain for levels coming in and going out. maybe rather than roll of gtr volume i need to apply a volume pedal in the loop or expression pedal a precise volume parameter somewhere to obtain the rsult.

this weekend i auditioned the carol ann model next to my real carol ann and in some areas of the neck it sounded extremely accurate, but in certain areas of the neck it was a dead modeling giveaway. and pound for pound the real amp is way more inspiring to play with real compression pedals and drive pedals, and real speakers. i was going to add real delays to that list but the axe delays are so good i'd be perfectly happy using one in the axe. delay freaks really need to hear the box for that aspect.

again, every time you add a new link in the axe it is 85-95 percent of the real thing, mostly feel and response, which makes the cumulative result of a complex chain substantially off the mark, and keeps you seeking ways to restore missing elements by adding or cutting somewhere down the line.

the cae lead tone is extremely similar to what i've played and heard live on single notes but chords sound funny.

the strummed rhythms of my plexi/trainwreck tone is full and twangy but kinda dead on single notes.

the modded plexi tone is great but i want to dial the sharp presence back down into the warmth a bit, but presence control doesn't control "that" presence.

so it dawned on me for the axe that i'm going try to take a different approach i've used in the past in rack world. for each main tone i use, i'm going to set one for rhythm, one for lead, of the same basic preset, from cleans to dirty.

fender sparkly effected clean, stripped down clean lead
plexiwreck rhythm, plexiwreck lead
carol ann rhythm, carol ann lead
modded plexi rhythm, modded plexi lead
etc.

and for the cost of one speaker i can purchase a whole bunch of redwirez speakers so i figure that's worth a try to, although the computer side of the axe for me is pretty unromatic to say the least! appreciate the functionality but hate using it.
but then again when's the last time you played your guitar and switched between ej clean and a real violin?

 

[Rogue]

Ideally I would like to see a peaceful world where tube amp users aren't sticking their noses up at anyone who uses the AxeFx, and AxeFx users don't present a pretentious attitude of superiority to all those have not been "enlightened" to the ways of the axe.

Good luck with that.

 

[Shiny_Surface]

As usual all it takes is one negative opinion for a pile on to ensue.

A testament to how successful a viral marketing internet campaign can be.

 

[polaris20]

I had to check the URL bar...... I thought I was back at HCAF for awhile there.

 

[Bob Savage]

I think the Axe-fx has been out long enough for there to be some truth to the Hype. When something gets overhyped and it doesn't hold water the product will go away... Not so with the axe. With that said, Like I said, It's not going to be for everyone and I respect that

I find it humorous that after this many years anybody could claim it's just the "modeler of the month" and that the hype will die very soon. As you said, like it or not, it's a high quality unit that serves very well for both amp simulation and effects.

 

[Bob Savage]

Ideally I would like to see a peaceful world where tube amp users aren't sticking their noses up at anyone who uses the AxeFx, and AxeFx users don't present a pretentious attitude of superiority to all those have not been "enlightened" to the ways of the axe. Two extremes of course here, but its the internet and you see a lot of both

There are snobs of all kinds but that's no reason to allow the extremists to steer ones view of any particular amp/device/thing. If extremists/snobs were setting the standards of "good," there would be nothing good.

 

[DEWD]

I had to check the URL bar...... I thought I was back at HCAF for awhile there.

That's what I was thinking too.

 

[thiswaythatway]

it seems as though what i've said all along, from the pre-ownership listening to the clips phase to now, is exactly what i am experiencing with the axe.

the stereo rack effects are huge and the best i've ever personally owned.
the synth sounds are head turning.
the delays in this box are ridiculously awesome, from echoplex to memory man to 2290, probably the most accurately reproduced features in the box.
the reverb is lexicon comparable.
some of the pedal effects are great and things like compressors and dirt boxes have evolved greatly in it and the simplicity of routing these things digitally without rack interfaces, cable, space requirements are a dream come true


the amps
here's where it gets tricky. i'm getting great SOUNDS in the territories of the amp models i'm using, granted every tone i dial in has drive pedals, paraeq, cab sims, and one or more post amp effects.
their just not BEHAVING in a manner i'm familiar with. if you just bang on a rock preset it's fine, but for subtle hybrid pick players like myself, sometimes it's too flat, sometimes its too harsh, sometimes too waxy in the mids, particularly when you get to rolling of gtr volume....

like gainy said, the levels must be monitored all along the way to keep things optimized and consistent to the output. i'm doing my best to optimize each link in the chain for levels coming in and going out. maybe rather than roll of gtr volume i need to apply a volume pedal in the loop or expression pedal a precise volume parameter somewhere to obtain the rsult.

this weekend i auditioned the carol ann model next to my real carol ann and in some areas of the neck it sounded extremely accurate, but in certain areas of the neck it was a dead modeling giveaway. and pound for pound the real amp is way more inspiring to play with real compression pedals and drive pedals, and real speakers. i was going to add real delays to that list but the axe delays are so good i'd be perfectly happy using one in the axe. delay freaks really need to hear the box for that aspect.

again, every time you add a new link in the axe it is 85-95 percent of the real thing, mostly feel and response, which makes the cumulative result of a complex chain substantially off the mark, and keeps you seeking ways to restore missing elements by adding or cutting somewhere down the line.

the cae lead tone is extremely similar to what i've played and heard live on single notes but chords sound funny.

the strummed rhythms of my plexi/trainwreck tone is full and twangy but kinda dead on single notes.

the modded plexi tone is great but i want to dial the sharp presence back down into the warmth a bit, but presence control doesn't control "that" presence.

so it dawned on me for the axe that i'm going try to take a different approach i've used in the past in rack world. for each main tone i use, i'm going to set one for rhythm, one for lead, of the same basic preset, from cleans to dirty.

fender sparkly effected clean, stripped down clean lead
plexiwreck rhythm, plexiwreck lead
carol ann rhythm, carol ann lead
modded plexi rhythm, modded plexi lead
etc.

and for the cost of one speaker i can purchase a whole bunch of redwirez speakers so i figure that's worth a try to, although the computer side of the axe for me is pretty unromatic to say the least! appreciate the functionality but hate using it.
but then again when's the last time you played your guitar and switched between ej clean and a real violin?

Thanks for the info. The Axe does sound like it can do a great job in the FX loop of an amp or with the 4cm. If i were going to build a pedalboard, let's take a Timeline or Timefactor which are $400 new, and that's just for a delay pedal. Timeline's are now selling for close to $500 on the used market. By the time you get a chorus box, reverb, a phaser, etc, the price goes up past the cost of an Axe-fx standard, and you have a cluttered board and you have to do the tap dance if everything isn't MIDI. Although, some guys, myself included, still like to reach down and twist a knob.

I do feel a bit of disconnect with MIDI and not being able to abjust by twisting a knob, but eliminating multiple cables and boxes also has advantages. AGH, I'm confused. Like i said though, for $1500 it's a good buy for what you get. With the Axe out, does it make sense to drop money on something like a G-System when the Axe can do everything and more?

 

[thiswaythatway]

I think the Axe-fx has been out long enough for there to be some truth to the Hype. When something gets overhyped and it doesn't hold water the product will go away... Not so with the axe. With that said, Like I said, It's not going to be for everyone and I respect that

I find it humorous that after this many years anybody could claim it's just the "modeler of the month" and that the hype will die very soon. As you said, like it or not, it's a high quality unit that serves very well for both amp simulation and effects.

I remember a year ago when a lot of guys, including a disabled garbage man from Babylon NY, claimed the Axe was going to be littered all over Ebay by now and selling for chump change. The standards sell for $1350. Why bother? Just spend the extra $150 on a new one.