school me on the JCM 800.

[fuzzyguitars]

lots of talk about JCM 800's

vertical

horizontal.

different power tubes



so.

which ones are most desirable and why?

just wondering!

 

[cardinal]

Single channel JCM 800s were the 2204 (50 watt) and 2203 (100 watt). There also were combos (4010 = 2204 in a 1x12; 4210 = 2204 in a 2x12). They're essentially the same as the JMP 2204 and 2203 models, but by the JCM time period, there were no more mustard caps, etc., so maybe the JCM tone is a bit more aggressive. No frills (one channel, no loop, no direct out). Originally vertical inputs, they changed to horizontal in maybe '85? It was cost-cutting (horizontal inputs allowed all the pots and jacks to be placed on the PCB. For the 2204, the only change to the actual circuit (I think) was an increase in the plate voltage. For the 2203, there was even more cost cutting: the change also was accompanied by reduced power filtering, which does impact how they sound and feel. US models have rocker switches and use 6550 tubes. UK and Canadian models use toggle switches and EL34s. My JCM 800 has the 6550 and sounds like what you'd expect a Marshall to sound like, so I think any focus on the type of tube is overblown.

There also are two channel JCM 800s: 2205 (50 watt) and 2210 (100 watt). There were combos too, but I can't remember the model numbers off the top of my head. These have two channels, an effects loop, and line out. Earlier examples may suffer from "channel bleed." I think that was sorted in around 1987. At least for the later models, more gain available than the 2203/4 amps. I don't remember what tubes these came with, but I'm guessing it was the same as the 2203/4 amps.

The 2203 seems to be the most desirable, though I (and others) prefer the 2204 because it's warmer. The 2203 has more low end and high end, but the 2204 certainly isn't lacking either. Late '80s 2205 and 2210s are great amps that are still somewhat under the radar. The early '80s 2205 and 2210 aren't all that great. The horizontal input 2204 amps are OK, but I'd avoid any of the horizontal input models because the price difference between them and the vertical input models isn't big enough for me to want to deal with circuit-mounted pots, lower power filtering on the 2203, etc.

 

[Schaf]

The horizontal input 2204 amps are OK, but I'd avoid any of the horizontal input models because the price difference between them and the vertical input models isn't big enough for me to want to deal with circuit-mounted pots, lower power filtering on the 2203, etc.

I had a 78 JMP 2204, a 82 JCM 2204 an 87 JCM 2204. The 87 was the best sounding of all those.....contrary to popular belief. I still have it and sold the others. Did side by side comparisons, with the exact same speaker cabs. The horizontal input 2204s are still great amps. teh are a little more difficult to repair because of the inputs and pots, but not that much. I'm thinking Jeff Hilligan sold a red vertical input 2204 for 800 shipped. that's the cheapest I've seen one in a while.

The 2204's and 2203's are among the best amps ever built.

 

[cardinal]

The horizontal input 2204 amps are OK, but I'd avoid any of the horizontal input models because the price difference between them and the vertical input models isn't big enough for me to want to deal with circuit-mounted pots, lower power filtering on the 2203, etc.

I had a 78 JMP 2204, a 82 JCM 2204 an 87 JCM 2204. The 87 was the best sounding of all those.....contrary to popular belief. I still have it and sold the others. Did side by side comparisons, with the exact same speaker cabs. The horizontal input 2204s are still great amps. teh are a little more difficult to repair because of the inputs and pots, but not that much. I'm thinking Jeff Hilligan sold a red vertical input 2204 for 800 shipped. that's the cheapest I've seen one in a while.

The 2204's and 2203's are among the best amps ever built.

Yeah, I think the plate voltage went up, so maybe that's what you preferred? Or just inherent variation from amp to amp. I definitely agree: the best way to select an amp is to play it yourself, because you never know otherwise. But you can find vertical input 2204 amps for between $900-$1000, and $800 shipped for Jeff's red horizontal amp was a really low price. So, if you have to buy blind (or deaf), I'd still vote for the vertical input every time. Again, if you can play it, and find a horizontal input amp that rips, I'd go for it. Just keep in mind that if you try to sell it over the Internet, you could end up like Jeff and have to sell it for $800...

 

[1meanplexi]

Any old JCM 800 with Drake Trannies!

 

[fuzzyguitars]

wow

thanks for the info.

I remember back in the 90's when i was looking to buy and amp for mark cameron to mod he suggested i get a 100 watt vertical input jcm 800.

 

[cardinal]

Drakes were the 50 watters. I think the 100 watters used Dagnall transformers.

Vertical inputs would be much easier to mod because they use flying leads for the pots.

 

[Shawn Lutz]

I prefer the single channel ones. I'm a fan of vertical input 2203/04's. My favorite is an 83 2203 with 6550's. I had several of the JCM800 /JMP 2203's and 04's back in the day and the 6550 version was the only one I end up keeping...I still have it, needs a cap job.

 

[EVHpickdust]

I've got a 1982 JCM800 2203. It's L O U D!!!

Hit some power chords on it and it feels like you've been punched in the chest...that's only on 2.

It's a great amp. Simple. Does the job well.

 

[fuzzyguitars]

My friend had mark camerons 2203 chicken head with two 6550's for about a year as a loaner amp while mark did a mod for him.

loud as hell!

 

[Racerxrated]

I've had vertical, horizontal, JMPs and JCMs..all 2204s. They ALL sounded good to my ears..the 86 I had probably sounded the best. I will say that the 87 and newer channel switchers..2205s and 10s can sound just as good and be had cheaper..they really shine through the right speakers though. G12 65s and G12 80s are IMO the best with these amps. V30s can be REALLY bright..Greenies are good too.

 

[moronmountain]

FWIW the 2205's and 2210's used silicon diodes to get the extra gain from the dirty channels. It's basically like the channel had a distortion pedal built into it. The clean channel didn't use them, and was somewhat closer sounding to an older Marshall if you used the volume knob (no gain knob on the clean channel) as a gain knob, and the master volume to get your level. However, the clean channel didn't have a mid control. Just some useless info if you need it.

 

[tallcoolone]

Old Marshalls all sound and feel a little bit (sometimes a lot) different from one another. Don't listen to what someone tells you "the best" is--plug into as many as you can and eventually you'll get a feel as to when you find a "good one". And you really can't beat those.

And if you aren't in a band and/or you cant turn it up, don't even bother. These amps were made to breathe...

 

[AndyK]

And if you aren't in a band and/or you cant turn it up, don't even bother. These amps were made to breathe...

Unless you have one modded!

 

[cardinal]

And if you aren't in a band and/or you cant turn it up, don't even bother. These amps were made to breathe...

Unless you have one modded!

I have a bone stock '82 4010 (2204 in a combo) that sounds great at very reasonable volumes into whatever cabinet I have laying around. Obviously sounds best when it's peeling paint from the walls, but great crunch at respectable volumes and is a raging metal monster if hit with an OD pedal for a boost.

 

[tallcoolone]

And if you aren't in a band and/or you cant turn it up, don't even bother. These amps were made to breathe...

Unless you have one modded!

I have a bone stock '82 4010 (2204 in a combo) that sounds great at very reasonable volumes into whatever cabinet I have laying around. Obviously sounds best when it's peeling paint from the walls, but great crunch at respectable volumes and is a raging metal monster if hit with an OD pedal for a boost.

When I say breathe I mean be turned up to rock drummer volume. If you aren't playing with a drummer, why on earth would you own a JCM800? Not exactly a good pick for Madison Square Bedroom IMO, "modded" or no.

 

[EVHpickdust]

If you aren't playing with a drummer, why on earth would you own a JCM800?

Because it's cool.

 

[Schaf]

And if you aren't in a band and/or you cant turn it up, don't even bother. These amps were made to breathe...

I will concede they sound better cranked but with the right boost or OD they can sound great at lower volumes. TV levels no. But a decent practice level, there's no reason you can't get good tone out of it if dialed in right with a boost or OD. It's all in the EQ. But the louder you get it, the highs do get warmer sounding. But that's the nature of the amp.

If this looks familiar, it came from another post verbatum.

 

[cardinal]

And if you aren't in a band and/or you cant turn it up, don't even bother. These amps were made to breathe...

Unless you have one modded!

I have a bone stock '82 4010 (2204 in a combo) that sounds great at very reasonable volumes into whatever cabinet I have laying around. Obviously sounds best when it's peeling paint from the walls, but great crunch at respectable volumes and is a raging metal monster if hit with an OD pedal for a boost.

When I say breathe I mean be turned up to rock drummer volume. If you aren't playing with a drummer, why on earth would you own a JCM800? Not exactly a good pick for Madison Square Bedroom IMO, "modded" or no.

Your post makes no sense whatsoever. If I'm happy with the amp as I'm using it, how could I have made not "a good pick"? Thanks for your concern for my amp happiness, I guess.

 

[splawner]

And if you aren't in a band and/or you cant turn it up, don't even bother. These amps were made to breathe...

Unless you have one modded!

I have a bone stock '82 4010 (2204 in a combo) that sounds great at very reasonable volumes into whatever cabinet I have laying around. Obviously sounds best when it's peeling paint from the walls, but great crunch at respectable volumes and is a raging metal monster if hit with an OD pedal for a boost.

When I say breathe I mean be turned up to rock drummer volume. If you aren't playing with a drummer, why on earth would you own a JCM800? Not exactly a good pick for Madison Square Bedroom IMO, "modded" or no.

Why not? I have one and boost it with a SD-1 and it sounds really good at bedroom volumes