Sick of everything... Is Vetta II the answer?

[blackba]

My buddy has a Vetta, upgraded to II specs. I have yet to hear it, but his biggest complaint is that the direct sound is not the same as what is coming through the speakers. So you either have to run it direct and tweak all the patches direct and kind of overloop what you are hearing from the amp. Or mic the amp and tweak the amp to what you hear coming out of it.

I can see an Axe-Fx might have a similar issue if you run it through a tube power amp and guitar speakers. Yet take your FOH tones direct, they may not match up well.

 

[crabby]

answer......NO!

if you want that route line 6 spidervalve tube head, it feels way better than vetta,

 

[kasperjensen]

Yeah the Spider Valve MkII seems like a good option. OK, it may not be the greatest amp in the whole world, but you cant argue the price or the practicality of that thing! And from I heard on their web-site, it doesn't sound bad at all.

But you can't argue the price of an Egnater Rebel 20 either...
I just feel that it would be a better option in the long run to either get a Lonestar or a JVM.

The JVM is cheaper and covers a lot of ground, and offers MIDI compatibility straight out the box (although I do have a RJM 16, so there is a way around everything now )
The Lonestar does what it does... and seems to be great amp (expensive though...).

Aaaaaaahhhhhh.... I want something that SINGS! Not that harsh hiss most modern Mesa's seem to have. I have however read accounts of people changing out all the tubes, which got rid of that nasty rectifier illness!

The thing is that the music shops around here don't really have much on offer, so I can't do a trial and error process.
Maybe when I go back home to Denmark for Christmas I can find some to try out there.
Damn it I wish there was a Sam Ash or a GC around here. I was just gobsmacked when I moved to Boston to attend Berklee, and saw what the music shops had to offer! JESUS you guys got it good!

 

[stefvorcide]

If I want to become sick, i'd get a Line 6 item.

No offence anyone btw


Matt (glpg80), i didn't know Michael Romeo used a L6 in the last album?? very surprising, they probly tweaked the shit outta it !! I doubt I could've like the tone in the room tho. Well... when Romeo shreds, everything sounds good

 

[kasperjensen]

I know exactly where you are coming from. EVERYTHING that Line 6 makes has an unmistakable sound to it... I think I have just been fooled by that tiny Bogner logo
Although for some unknown reason, I WANT to believe that they will make a good product.

Can it be that hard to make a really good, warm, singing, all tube 3 channel combo with good effects and MIDI compatibility?

 

[sixstrings]

Wait a minute... You want to get rid of your Mesa Boogie Roadster and get a Line 6? Excuse me but am I the only one who thinks this is kind of absurd?

Have you tried EL34's? Perhaps you should try using EL34's and give it a couple of months before you decide to go the digital route.

I've used 6L6's and EL34's in the Roadster and I'll tell you it sounds quite impressive both ways. Man there are so many routes to take besides Line 6 and all those modelers out there.

If you want to go the effects route then Rocktron makes a pretty good preamp called the Voodoo Valve which has a lot of features and good sound. You can find good bargains on them. I think it sounds better than anything Line 6 makes. It's also a fraction of the price of AxeFX. It's got all the effects and settings you need.

+1 on getting a good power amp like Mesa or Engl to run your stuff through. Lots of great stuff out there but if Line 6 floats your boat then go for it.

 

[kasperjensen]

Wait a minute... You want to get rid of your Mesa Boogie Roadster and get a Line 6? Excuse me but am I the only one who thinks this is kind of absurd?

Have you tried EL34's? Perhaps you should try using EL34's and give it a couple of months before you decide to go the digital route.

I've used 6L6's and EL34's in the Roadster and I'll tell you it sounds quite impressive both ways. Man there are so many routes to take besides Line 6 and all those modelers out there.

If you want to go the effects route then Rocktron makes a pretty good preamp called the Voodoo Valve which has a lot of features and good sound. You can find good bargains on them. I think it sounds better than anything Line 6 makes. It's also a fraction of the price of AxeFX. It's got all the effects and settings you need.

+1 on getting a good power amp like Mesa or Engl to run your stuff through. Lots of great stuff out there but if Line 6 floats your boat then go for it.

I am not getting rid of my Roadster, because while I am tired of it, it is still a really good amp. And I will try to change the tubes, to see if I like that better.
I just want something a lot simpler for every day use, and then came the attack of the Line 6 illness...

Thank you guys, for beating some sense into my head.

Come Wednesday morning, I am going to go and see if I can fall in love with a Fender combo, and just be done with it
Seems to work just fine if you pair one with a Zen Drive and Robben Ford... so there is no excuse!

 

[kasperjensen]

BTW I have a Mesa 20/20, which I have good results with before. So at least I won't have to spend more if I decide to go with an AxeFx.

 

[kasperjensen]

Six Strings... how do you like your Mark V? Does it SING?

 

[mctallica1]

Axe Fx.

I have owned a who's who of high quality amps, both production and boutique and I prefer the Axe Fx. It sounds and feels as good as anything I have owned and is infinitely more flexible.

I currently own both a Standard and an Ultra and almost never turn the Ultra on. I bought it to have more processing power, "just in case", but the fact is, I don't even come close to maxing CPU on my Standard.


The closest I came to the flexibility I want in the tube world is the Randall/Egnater modular gear. Great stuff and there are some superb folks doing mods to modules to take them over the top.

Currently, I run my Axe through a QSC GX5 power amp into 2 4x12 cabs OR into 2 Dynaudio BM5a powered monitors. I like both for different reasons/purposes.

FWIW, if I were on a budget and wanted a good quality modeling setup, I would have a HD147. I could gig with that amp and be happy with the tone, but I never got the feel I wanted. I did get closer using a VHT Valvulator in front of it though

 

[chunktone]

Not a Line 6 fan at all. If you want versatile and flexible and don't care about tone, then yes, Line 6 is the answer.

you cant tell me parts of symphony X suck so bad tone wise you wont listen to it at all right? because romeo used on in the studio along side the 60 watt fireball and its hard to tell between the two after studio polishing

with that being said i also looked into a vetta II at one point, and all i found in my research was a plethora of issues and problems with them needing serious repairs, sometimes costing well into the $500 range for new boards.

so that alone caused me to look away big time.

I do like Symphony X, but honestly I couldn't care less what Romeo uses. I don't base an amp on recordings of artist XXXXX. I base my opinion on what they sound like in real life, and that is why I find Line 6 laking. they are a good practice amp, but that's about it imho.

 

[sixstrings]

Six Strings... how do you like your Mark V? Does it SING?

Dude it's my favorite Mesa Boogie of all. Now bear in mind that I'm saying this having owned the following Mesa Boogies:

Mark IV
F50
Roadster
Lonestar
Lonestar Special
Dual Rect
Stiletto Ace
Express 5:50

At first impression, it sounded kind of like a Roadster with even better tone and improved clean sounds. Furthermore, it sounds a little better with EL34's than the Roadster or Dual Rect does in my opinion. I've tried EL34's in both of those amps.

This amp does SING! It's so full of tone. I just love to turn my pick at an angle, dig in and squeeze out all that juicy tone. The clarity is freaking amazing. Man it sustains for days and shreds like hell. Amazingly, although it has all the channels you can use and distortion on tap, it sounds magnificent with my OD pedals. My OD820 sounds superb on the Tweed setting, and my Dr. Swamp adds that bit of sparkle to the drive channels.

I'm not 100% satisfied with the stock C90 speaker, but maybe like 95% satisfied. I could live with it. I'd like to experiment with some more speakers. If my Jensen Jet Blackbird fits in there, I'll give it a try. There are also a couple of other Eminence speakers I'd like to try.

I've already put it through a Mesa 2x12 with V30's and a Budda 2x12. So far I'm liking it through the Budda 2x12 because it's real crisp sounding.

I should note that I also directly compared the Mark V with the Mark IV and Mark IIC+. I think the Mark IIC+ setting is dead on. In fact, If I'm not mistaken, Mesa even says the Mark V actually has the IIC+ circuit in it. The Mark IV mode is pretty damned close but not dead on like the IIC+. If anything, when set to Mark IV, it's slightly more focused and tighter. I really don't give a shit if it nails the IV because I really like how it sounds. I can rock the IIC+ mode all freaking day though for soloing.

It has this setting called "extreme" and I'm not sure what they were trying to achieve with it but it sounds cool as hell. It's a little less gainy and has a good presence. All I know is that with my OD820 as a light boost on that channel, it gets downright evil sounding. I love it.

There's so much cool shit about this amp that it would take a long essay to explain it. Freaking killer amp. The variac power setting sounds incredibe in 10w mode.

Awesome amp. I'd recommend it to anyone but with the warning that you're going to have to spend some time tweaking it. When those people who've owned them for a couple of days or weeks say things about the Mark V, don't pay it much attention because it takes a couple of months to really settle it in. The speaker needs to break in too.

 

[kasperjensen]

Six Strings... how do you like your Mark V? Does it SING?

Dude it's my favorite Mesa Boogie of all. Now bear in mind that I'm saying this having owned the following Mesa Boogies:

Mark IV
F50
Roadster
Lonestar
Lonestar Special
Dual Rect
Stiletto Ace
Express 5:50

At first impression, it sounded kind of like a Roadster with even better tone and improved clean sounds. Furthermore, it sounds a little better with EL34's than the Roadster or Dual Rect does in my opinion. I've tried EL34's in both of those amps.

This amp does SING! It's so full of tone. I just love to turn my pick at an angle, dig in and squeeze out all that juicy tone. The clarity is freaking amazing. Man it sustains for days and shreds like hell. Amazingly, although it has all the channels you can use and distortion on tap, it sounds magnificent with my OD pedals. My OD820 sounds superb on the Tweed setting, and my Dr. Swamp adds that bit of sparkle to the drive channels.

I'm not 100% satisfied with the stock C90 speaker, but maybe like 95% satisfied. I could live with it. I'd like to experiment with some more speakers. If my Jensen Jet Blackbird fits in there, I'll give it a try. There are also a couple of other Eminence speakers I'd like to try.

I've already put it through a Mesa 2x12 with V30's and a Budda 2x12. So far I'm liking it through the Budda 2x12 because it's real crisp sounding.

I should note that I also directly compared the Mark V with the Mark IV and Mark IIC+. I think the Mark IIC+ setting is dead on. In fact, If I'm not mistaken, Mesa even says the Mark V actually has the IIC+ circuit in it. The Mark IV mode is pretty damned close but not dead on like the IIC+. If anything, when set to Mark IV, it's slightly more focused and tighter. I really don't give a shit if it nails the IV because I really like how it sounds. I can rock the IIC+ mode all freaking day though for soloing.

It has this setting called "extreme" and I'm not sure what they were trying to achieve with it but it sounds cool as hell. It's a little less gainy and has a good presence. All I know is that with my OD820 as a light boost on that channel, it gets downright evil sounding. I love it.

There's so much cool shit about this amp that it would take a long essay to explain it. Freaking killer amp. The variac power setting sounds incredibe in 10w mode.

Awesome amp. I'd recommend it to anyone but with the warning that you're going to have to spend some time tweaking it. When those people who've owned them for a couple of days or weeks say things about the Mark V, don't pay it much attention because it takes a couple of months to really settle it in. The speaker needs to break in too.

Thank you for the input. That does sound like a really good amp. From the few (good quality) clips I can find on youtube, I am really liking it. It is quite expensive, but as always, you get what you pay for (in most cases anyway).
I would like to try one out before deciding for myself though. With my effects!

I still think the JVM420C is really good option, for practicality, sound, versatility, and price.

Lets see what Santa (credit card) brings me this xmas

 

[kasperjensen]

Went back in my studio thing today, and played about with the Roadster for a while.

Finally found a sound that was pleasing my ears.

I tried a few pedals in front of it, which worked really well. MXR Zakk Wylde OverDrive > MXR Comp > BB Sonic Stomp.
Set channel 1 on fat mode, all dials more or less at 12, except the bass which I added a bit more of.
Using the neck PU on my Custom 24 in single coil mode, I got very close to Andy Timmons tone on his "Resolution" song.
So tomorrow I will try and set the rig up with my RJM, using various different overdrive pedals... It still wont be very practical, but at least it will be a lot closer to a solution that I can work with for the time being.

 

[Beret]

Let me preface by saying all of this is subjective. The "harsh hiss most modern Mesa's seem to have" is due to how people set them up, it's not the amplifier's fault. Your Roadster is quite capable of singing. People typically take an amp in the rectifier family, stick it in modern mode, crank the gain until it's fizzy (enter harsh hiss), scoop the mids, and then wonder why it doesn't cut or sing. I'm not saying you're doing that, but especially with something as versatile as the Roadster, let your ears tell you what works and start tweaking. Because the way you have the amplifier set one day won't necessarily be what you want a month from now.

All of that being said, if you don't want a big rig but you want all of the versatility without sacrificing tone, the Axe FX is the way to go. It lets you do virtually anything you want to do, use pretty much any amplifier, and it can change as your tastes change. Take a 4 space rack with a power conditioner, Axe FX, and a power amp and you're ready for anything. Take a cab with you to monitor-less gigs and you're covered. I just recommend setting up your patches for the PA with a full range speaker rather than your guitar cab so you can really get in the ballpark of what it's going to sound like going through the PA.

I've owned several Mesas including a LoneStar combo and I own two Mesas now (one of them being a Roadster) and I also own an Axe FX. I don't regret any of those purchases. I love good tube amps but no one at a gig listening is going to tell the difference with the Axe FX. (We need to get one of those blind folded Pepsi challenges and A/B tube amps vs. the Axe.)

~B

Aaaaaaahhhhhh.... I want something that SINGS! Not that harsh hiss most modern Mesa's seem to have. I have however read accounts of people changing out all the tubes, which got rid of that nasty rectifier illness!

 

[sixstrings]

I've noticed that when I've hear really good Mesa tone, the gain settings are lower than I would have thought. The tone comes from either technique or sheer volume. Some of the coolest high-gain stuff I've heard has a lot to do with high-output humbuckers pushing the amp. You're not likely to get that kind of grind with vintage pickups no matter what pedals you use.

I've come to the conclusion lately that for real good heavy metal distorted tone, you start with some great sounding high-output humbuckers. You don't really need a pedal if your amp has a respectable amount of gain.

When I think of the ideal amount of gain for rocking and soloing, I generally think of bands like Judas Priest and Motorhead. I do enjoy metal a great deal, so the gainy stuff is great too. When it comes to THE tone I like though, I'm prefer something a bit more old school.

Thank God I bought this Mark V because it gives me all the damned sounds I want and it's a relatively small combo for 90 freaking watts!

 

[shreder75]

don't get a vetta...you're going to hate it..
I had one for a while...I thought it was the greatest thing since sliced bread after having a couple of high end tube amps that I just didn't really care for...I wont' mention which ones they were =)

anywho, I thought the effects and the stereo effect with having the extension cabinet was the bee's knees....but I was always tweaking the damn thing...'THIS will be the patch for sure this time! the ultimate tone EVAR!!!'..never got there

and then I brought it to band practice..and no matter how loud or how I dialed it in, I would get swallowed by the other guitar player..by by vetta...

I think line six makes some cool useful stuff..some pedals, the pod and all that jazz..but for the pricepoint of a vetta??? paying too much for too little tone in my book

 

[kasperjensen]

I have been tweaking the Mesa ever since I got it, but was never really happy with, until I tried it with the OD pedal in front of the clean channel.
I never really play high-gain stuff, and I seldom use the modern mode. Nor do I scoop the mids.
I usually use raw or vintage with medium gain. The amp sounds like a cat when the gain is dimed, so I steer very clear of that.
I think this whole thing came across like I absolutely hate the thing, but thats not the case. I can get a very decent warm tone from it, but just not quite what I want for everyday use. I am keeping it, simply because for rock rhythm and metal, its an absolute monster.

I did, however, buy a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe today, which I have just fallen in love with. Gonna use one or two pedals in front of it, but not more. Its just perfect for that really warm organic clean, and slightly pushed crunch. Not to mention the price! And as far as practicality goes... Its great. Small pedal board and this combo and you are away. Great working amp.

The Axe-FX is really appealing, still.

I know Line 6 is almost a swear-word around here, but I have actually achieved good results. Spent an age tweaking the POD XT Live for playing at a club through the summer. Went through a BB Sonic Stomp before going to the desk and out into the clubs speaker system (friggin massive!), and the sound out front was surprisingly good. It was so good that I didn't once consider taking an amp and mic'in it up.
I also went on tour with a band in the UK, and only used the POD, which sounded really big out front. It would probably be slightly better with a tubeamp, but its more likely to go wrong, and more to load.
So I can imagine that an AxeFx would be even better. Would love to get one when I have some more money.

But anyway... I am off to play some delicious strat tones

 

[Sixstring]

Keep the Mesa, ditch all of your outboard gear and Get an Axe FX and some sort of Midi board with a Volume pedal or two for continuous commands and have it all. Great tube tone when you want it, great effects when you want it, Awesome digital sims when you need it. Thats how I made the move and finally went ampless and I have never looked back, eventually I may get another tube amp but for now I have no need for one. The Axe has curbed all my GAS for any amp. My main problem now is Guitar Acquisition Syndrome

 

[kasperjensen]

Yeah that Hot Rod Deluxe has made me really happy. WOOOOOO!

I wonder how long it will be until the next attack of the ole GAS comes along... again!