Tone Monster
Well-known member
He is corect. He is bitter. Is there a solution? Probably not.
Atropos_Project
New member
Barking up the wrong tree to an extent. The issue lies not with musicians, but with listeners. Music isn't an appreciated art form in this society, it's an expectation.
And if Lefsetz is ever correct about anything music-related, I've yet to read it.
And if Lefsetz is ever correct about anything music-related, I've yet to read it.
Badronald
New member
I don't know that it's bitterness as much as sadness. Luke has made a ton of money and has a secure place in the history of music.
Is there a solution? Probably not. I've got guys I work with. Grown men who take their kids to Bieber and Gaga concerts. They come to work the next day and instead of saying "man that sucked, I did it for the kids", they say things like "it was an awesome show, wow she's really good".
Therein lies the problem. It's NOT good. It's shit. But as long as that's what people settle for, that's what they'll get.
Is there a solution? Probably not. I've got guys I work with. Grown men who take their kids to Bieber and Gaga concerts. They come to work the next day and instead of saying "man that sucked, I did it for the kids", they say things like "it was an awesome show, wow she's really good".
Therein lies the problem. It's NOT good. It's shit. But as long as that's what people settle for, that's what they'll get.
MississippiMetal
New member
Badronald":1ns1nb6w said:
+1
And the funny thing is, they don't give a shit what you think about their shitty music. They'll listen to it anyway. I'll get In the car with my lady and she'll have the radio on some godawful station that plays the latest Chris Brown/Drake/Mackelmore/Katy Perry crap, and I'll complain about it. She changes the station to a classic rock station and we'll both rock out to Bad Company or something. But the very next time I get back in the car it's right back on that awful Top 40 station again.
mystixboi
Well-known member
Badronald":2tuaqimo said:
I don’t think you can compare Beiber to Gaga… Gaga is a huge talent and puts on an amazing show. She’s a great songwriter and can sing well.
I took my wife to a Taylor Swift concert and that was an awesome show too. These people entertain…. Period.
I appreciate good pop song writing but I also appreciate Dream Theater, Vai, Satch, etc.
Different strokes…
The music business is just like any other businesss… sink or swim. Don’t like it, then move on.
W
Wayniac3
Well-known member
Yep - McMusic... easy marketing/hype/image. Same discussion I'd have with my ex all the time. I hate American idol, mostly because I know a ton of people more talented than that. She'd always say "then why don't they give it a shot?!". My comment back: "They did - slogging it out in bars, shitholes, gin joints and clubs for years. That's how it used to be - you worked, got exposure, played your ass off,and hoped for a break".
Several former local guys here have had success at varying national/international levels - with WASP, House of Lords, Loudness, Obsession, bass for Dokken, Steelheart., XYZ, Vinnie Vincient (aka Vinny Cusano), John Mayer and Jeff Porcaro, etc. But none, besides James Christian, as a vocalist.
Edit: The Carpenters, Lix Phair, and Mark McGrath as well.
Now, it has nothing to do with talent, or that fact that they have a team of writers and producers making that product for them, and dictating every move. It's all about image and marketing.
BTW - love the shade of that EBMM Luke in the article.
Several former local guys here have had success at varying national/international levels - with WASP, House of Lords, Loudness, Obsession, bass for Dokken, Steelheart., XYZ, Vinnie Vincient (aka Vinny Cusano), John Mayer and Jeff Porcaro, etc. But none, besides James Christian, as a vocalist.
Edit: The Carpenters, Lix Phair, and Mark McGrath as well.
Now, it has nothing to do with talent, or that fact that they have a team of writers and producers making that product for them, and dictating every move. It's all about image and marketing.
BTW - love the shade of that EBMM Luke in the article.
Badronald
New member
mystixboi":3q1wzy7v said:
Sure I can. If you enjoy that stuff it doesn't matter to me.
Everyone has opinions, but you'll never convince me in a million years that Gaga, Swift or Beiber consists of "good" songwriting, NEVER. It's horrible garbage.
amiller
New member
Taylor Swift and the word "awesome" in the same sentence. 
Badronald
New member
amiller":12ae37l2 said:Taylor Swift and the word "awesome" in the same sentence.
Taylor Swift and "what the hell key is she singing in"? is more like it.
amiller
New member
Badronald":3o8t5ls0 said:amiller":3o8t5ls0 said:Taylor Swift and the word "awesome" in the same sentence.
Taylor Swift and "what the hell key is she singing in"? is more like it.
My thoughts exactly.
D
dallasb
New member
mystixboi":1pfdynbe said:
Remember when bands all said Fuck the Industry? Remember when aspiring artists and all their fans said the same thing?
Remember when they said Radio is dead. Fuck radio
So now the industry promotes from a base of contestants on am talent shows. Lets build these stars right before the viewers and guarantee successful sales.
Radio- still very relevant even with as much available on the web. Funny thing is the most sought after music is what is label produced. What persons besides a handful of the bands' friends are looking for their independent home made diy recorded music? Not too many.
The music business is a business. It has to be. It has people in place to make it successful. Most independent artists are not business savvy.
What's interesting is so many DIY bands are not competing or even classified with industry produced artists. They instead compete with millions of shmos with a DAW posting on cd baby or itunes.
I had a guy at the studio tell me something he found that summed it up. An independent artist he recorded was talking to some girl about his upcoming cd. She said that's nice. You should see my sisters on Youtube. They did some silly song they made on afternoon and are up to 15 million views in two weeks. I'm so proud of them.
Spaceboy
Well-known member
Just remember Taylor Swift is brought to us by the same talented ears that brought us The Backstreet Boys... hah.
chunktone
Active member
MississippiMetal":1ho45s5j said:
I would never support that crap, but that's just part of a bigger problem. We have an entire generation that believes they are entitled to all music free. This has taken away the incentive for anyone to create new music for anything other than personal enjoyment and the creative outlet.
V
Viesczy
New member
Steve is just old and irrelevant and he can't stand it.
His yapping about McRecords is bunk, there has always been artists exploited by the Man. That is the definition of "pop" music.
The industry is RIGGED against artists who create works over a period of time, always has been and thankfully we see the chance for artists to prosper by doing the recording themselves without the "recoupment" (aka slavery) being hung on their neck now.
Rather than whining, Steve should focus on evolving and making music that transcends time rather than being of time. George Benson was smart enough to realize that he could still have artisticy integrity and pop success if he simply changes a few things in his approach.
FWIW he hasn't been relevant for 25 years.
Derek
His yapping about McRecords is bunk, there has always been artists exploited by the Man. That is the definition of "pop" music.
The industry is RIGGED against artists who create works over a period of time, always has been and thankfully we see the chance for artists to prosper by doing the recording themselves without the "recoupment" (aka slavery) being hung on their neck now.
Rather than whining, Steve should focus on evolving and making music that transcends time rather than being of time. George Benson was smart enough to realize that he could still have artisticy integrity and pop success if he simply changes a few things in his approach.
FWIW he hasn't been relevant for 25 years.
Derek
Ventura
Well-known member
Taylor could have some redeeming qualities whilst smiling like a donut.
But as for Luke, guy's been around and seen a lot. He is honest - whether or not that honesty translates into bitterness, hard to say where it starts and where it ends. He's straight up. I've always appreciated his point of few - cuz he says it like it is.
But as for Luke, guy's been around and seen a lot. He is honest - whether or not that honesty translates into bitterness, hard to say where it starts and where it ends. He's straight up. I've always appreciated his point of few - cuz he says it like it is.
controlled_voltage
Banned
Well-known member
bollocks
there are loads of great YOUNG "underground" bands in every genre that are surviving minus the old business model.
luke is a grumpy dinosaur who has no right to complain.
yea he is a good guitar player but honestly , toto?
no thanks
one thing you can count on in life is change.
the more you ignore it and don't adapt the more miserable you will be.
there are loads of great YOUNG "underground" bands in every genre that are surviving minus the old business model.
luke is a grumpy dinosaur who has no right to complain.
yea he is a good guitar player but honestly , toto?
no thanks
one thing you can count on in life is change.
the more you ignore it and don't adapt the more miserable you will be.
amiller
New member
I highly recommend picking up Steve's latest work, "Transitions." 'Killer writing, playing and singing. I'll take that over the majority of stuff that's supposed to be "relevant" today.
http://www.amazon.com/Transition-Steve-Lukather/dp/B00A6HHJ9C/ref=pd_sim_m_2/179-4614807-2847707
http://www.amazon.com/Transition-Steve-Lukather/dp/B00A6HHJ9C/ref=pd_sim_m_2/179-4614807-2847707
Ventura
Well-known member
And I just have to add, I think Luke's a monster player. He's got skills that only time and experience can give someone. I may not "like" all his music, but I will say that listening to him play guitar, I know he's a very accomplished, well seasoned player with reams of time under his fingers. That alone I appreciate and respect.
S
shgshg
Banned
New member
Saw him play last year and I still have a smile on my face just thinking about it. I'd KILL to have that sort of "irrelevance".Viesczy":2qo3zgtt said: