The Small Amp police

[blackba]

I have been notice a good number of posts on another forum where the small amp police come in to say that we are using too big of amps or that we don't need a 412 or two.

Come stand with me in defense of Big amps and 412's. Why do we do it? Cause me like them. If I want to play a 100Watt Marshall with an attenuator I can do so. If I want to run a big amp clean with pedals and like the results, than let me be.

So has anyone had any soundmen, venue owners, or other bandmates questions why you need such a powerful amp or a 412 or two?


I should mention too, that I like small amps. But don't tell me I have to use one or I am wasting my big amp by running it at low volumes.

 

[glpg80]

its knowing there is 126dB of power behind the volume knob that i love. cranking open a 120W amplifier in a open room and letting them breathe is a once in a life time experience for anyone who plays music. its just no contest, combos do not compare not even 2x12's - ive owned them too. yes they are overkill for shows, but for outside venu's two 4x12's is what it takes to cut through the mix AND still be able to hear yourself on stage.

i also like running two cabinets for practice because i can direct one of them at the drummer and the other at myself. in a live mix it makes a large difference unless you have the money to invest in a killer $$$$$ PA system too - which i think the small amp police are forgetting to mention.

plus they look badass and the feel of a 4x12 cabinet is much different than a 1x12 and those who understand tube feeling know what i am saying - 1x12 does not equal 4x12 in tone, playability, low end reproduction, or sound; as they all have their own sound no matter the volume you are playing at.

 

[mboogman]

In my experience, a 4x12 does indeed just sound better. My day of enlightenment came when I finished restoring my old Peavey 4x12 cab that had in high school (late '90s) and brought it up to my church. I had been playing through my Egnater Mod series 2x12 and loving it. Once I hooked up the 4x12 cab, I was blown away. I wasn't even turned up very loud, and was wearing in-ear monitors. Even in that situation, I noticed a difference in tone and feel. Haven't gone back to a smaller cab since.

Small amp guys are OK. But I'll always like the sound of more surface area moving air to less.

 

['63-Strat]

I've noticed similar threads on hcaf and tgp, yes. I honestly don't think it's anything different than other situations where people just post what they use as "the best," etc. A 4X12 *does not* take up any more room on stage than a 2X12 combo, that's a fact. It's also better for monitoring yourself than a 1X12 or 2X12 cab sitting on the floor because you actually have some speakers raised up/pointing near your ears. So you can actually have your amp quieter and hear yourself better with a 4X12 in my experience. The worst offenders volume wise I've dealt with were guys with closed back 2X12s on the floor turning up loud enough to hear themselves right on top of their amps, problem being that out front that ends up being way too loud. I firmly believe you need to get 1X12s and 2X12s off the floor for proper monitoring.

There's no doubt you can use a low wattage amp mic'd up *so long* as you have a good PA/soundman. Personally I don't like guitar in my monitors though , I just want my and/or other singer's vocals. For some things a low wattage amp cranked full up into power tube distortion is great, for some things it's just not, tonewise. Different tools for different things, to say otherwise is just ignorant. Some guy playing classic rock covers with a little amp and light-hitting drummer may love using a tiny amp, but that has no bearing on other situations where such a setup wouldn't work. To each their own.

 

[Shiny_Surface]

TGP has got the fever bigtime on that topic.

A constant undertone of lecturing in how many watts you need to play muzak at the local dining establishment.

 

[miguelr]

I hear ya. I would roll with a 4x12 were it not for limited space in my car. Had a 1x12 before before that's too small for me. Physically and tone wise. Settling for 2x12 as an in between has been just fine for me.

 

[Vrad]

I've really tried hard to like smaller cabs, and there are some great ones out there. But there's nothing like a 4x12... even at low volumes.

 

[shreder75]

I've really tried hard to like smaller cabs, and there are some great ones out there. But there's nothing like a 4x12... even at low volumes.

you should never have sold off that THD..just saying

 

[Vrad]

I've really tried hard to like smaller cabs, and there are some great ones out there. But there's nothing like a 4x12... even at low volumes.

you should never have sold off that THD..just saying

I don't miss it... LOL
As great as that cab was, 2 4x12 is that much more METAL!!

 

[glpg80]

I've really tried hard to like smaller cabs, and there are some great ones out there. But there's nothing like a 4x12... even at low volumes.

you should never have sold off that THD..just saying

I don't miss it... LOL
As great as that cab was, 2 4x12 is that much more wood!!

you had a typo. i fixed it for you

 

[Mr. Burton]

I had this argument with my other guitarist for a long time. He is all about low wattage amps and power tube/speaker distortion,which is cool, but the opposite end of the spectrum from where I am. His (and most people's) argument is that you can't use high wattage amps and multiple cabs in a club setting. My response was that I could care less what he plays through as long as it sounds good. Why should it matter to him what I use??? I told him that if it really mattered to him from a cosmetic standpoint (i.e. being too big and gaudy) that I would buy a Fender Twin combo shell, set it behind me onstage, and keep my rig hidden. He has since picked up a Bogner 4x12 and I think he is starting to get it.

Bottom line is play what you want, how you want, through whatever you want, and have fun doing it. More importantly, don't dog someone because they want something different than you.

That said 4x12's do sound better.

 

[shreder75]

I've really tried hard to like smaller cabs, and there are some great ones out there. But there's nothing like a 4x12... even at low volumes.

you should never have sold off that THD..just saying

I don't miss it... LOL
As great as that cab was, 2 4x12 is that much more METAL!!

meh..was a great sounding cab...

 

[LP Freak]

I still run a 4x12 with my 5w Blackstar.

 

[shreder75]

I still run a 4x12 with my 5w Blackstar.

me too..hee heeee..pushes it pretty good too...I dig that little amp

 

[LP Freak]

I still run a 4x12 with my 5w Blackstar.

me too..hee heeee..pushes it pretty good too...I dig that little amp

Yep

 

[shreder75]

I still run a 4x12 with my 5w Blackstar.

me too..hee heeee..pushes it pretty good too...I dig that little amp

Yep

can sound pretty evil depending on the speakers too..it's tamer through my weber loaded cab but it's pretty pissed through my smallblock cab

 

[Digital Jams]

TGP has got the fever bigtime on that topic.

A constant undertone of lecturing in how many watts you need to play muzak at the local dining establishment.

Ever see the pics of their breakfest club meets before the NJ amp show?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Pasty white 60 something year olds.

Of course they want little amps, they will blow their backs out moving 4x12s.

If my band was playing in a closet I am packing a 4x12...........................

 

[steve_k]

Opinions are like assholes......everybody's got one--especially on a public forum. They are probably still trying to convince their wives that "size doesn't matter".

 

[bubbastain]

Other than my very first amp (Peavey Audition 20) I have never played less than a 4x12 for practice or shows. Anything less just sounds weak. I actually prefer 2 4x12s. IF I was playing softer bluesy/jazzy type stuff at small clubs I would probably be fine with a Fender Blues deluxe 1x12. But I don't. I like massive sounding guitars. So a 4x12 is the minimum requirement. I want to feel my guitar as much as I hear it.

 

[Zachman]

Here is an excerpt from a similar thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluffalo
cranked 4x12's in a small venue are for guitarists who think they are the centre of the universe and that they are the most important.

too bad it only sounds better to themselves, and not anyone else.

-end quote-

My response

I find that mostly that argument is presented by kids who live at home w/ mom, and want to pretend their tiny bedroom 5 watt amps are superior in every situation-- or by hobbyists, amateurs, collectors or purist narcissists who don't have the presence of mind to realize that there are other genres and venues other than coffee houses, pubs and little quaint bars which pay the band $50 a night to play to crowds of not much more than 20 people.

Cranked 4x12's in a small venue.... (Love the ridiculous qualifier) LOL... As if you need to crank a 4x12 to have it sounding bigger/better than a little combo. FWIW, not all of us here only play small venues. There are some of us who have multiple rigs and are actually capable of choosing appropriately what to use, and how to use them.

Sure there are exceptions to the rules, but it's the exceptions which define the rules.

Big boy toys are for big boys, who know how and when to use them appropriately. Just because someone can afford an Enzo Ferrari, doesn't mean one can drive like Mario Andretti, but even if one can't drive it like Mario-- it's still an Enzo, not a Yugo. See.... Exceptions and rules... Also, the guys w/ Ferrari's likely have more than one vehicle, and if they need to haul gear, they usually have a choice which one to take vs which one they're taking to the track. ALL gear are mere tools to get a job done.

Learn to use the tools of the trade... and choose them appropriately and there's no problems, just a selection of solutions.

I just think it's ludicrous that guys who only like/prefer small amps, take issue w/ guys who have other preferences/needs. What the hell is the point? I mean it's not like they have to use, move, setup or tear down someone else's rig right???

Of course, there are guys who play too loud and use gear inappropriately on BOTH sides of the isle, so... with that I would urge you to Just relax.