Tinnitus

[Adam of Angels]

Anybody deal with chronic tinnitus? I've been playing guitar for most of my life, and if I wasn't playing through loud amps, I was listening to loud music... I suppose I should have listened to everybody when they said I was going to ruin my ears

In any case, being amp and guitar lovers, I can't help but figure I'm not alone here on this one. Actually, I always had low grade tinnitus, but about 3 years ago an old Peavey whistled at me very, very loudly when I was about 10 inches from the cab. Ever since then, I've been sort of plagued with a lot of high pitched tones in my left ear and some in my right. Sometimes it's a nightmare, most of the time I ignore it.

The problem, though, is that since it's noise induced, I'm figuring that I might have to hang up the trade (or rather, give up on the idea of touring and what not). This is a painful thought, since guitar is above and beyond my main passion in life, and I have developed my skills a lot over the years. Even with ear protection, I would still be exposed to dangerous noise levels, or else I would have already gone the route of expensive custom plugs.

Anyway, since you guys are an amp loving bunch, I wonder how you deal with issues like this. I can live with the tinnitus as it is, but if it got significantly worse, that would suck.

I guess one of the main things I'm wondering is, if you have constant tinnitus and still tour/play live, what do you do to prevent it from getting worse? I don't know of any gear or ear pieces that can keep low frequencies from doing their damage, for example.

 

[Aristocat]

It really sucks. I've had it for several years now and it's an on again, off again type of thing. There's an OTC type of thing you can take if you go to Walgreens. I haven't tried it yet but from what I remember, it's pretty expensive and some of the pharmacists don't know as to whether or not it'll actually work.

That's the best I have unfortunately. I'm in your camp ATM.

 

[crwnedblasphemy]

I know this sounds wild, but on Calm Radio(internet radio), one of their stations has a frequency to offset it. You listen to with headphones...

Check it out if ya like...

 

[severinsteel]

Apparently 17% of the population are affected by it. I'm with you in that mine bugs me. It sucks, but it's an occupational hazard of being a guitarist or even a rock musician in general. Two of my colleagues who are professional guitarists have it pretty bad, so I know it's pretty common for us. I've done some research, and there is a unique therapy I heard about. Basically you figure out what frequency or frequencies are ringing, and remove said frequencies from a selection of songs via audio editing software. Apparently, if you listen to the music (probably with headphones) over a period of a year of so, your tinnitus symptoms will lesson. I haven't tried it myself, but it's worth a try. Until then, a good fan in your bedroom at night does wonders.

 

[H Golf Sport]

I've had it since as long as I can remember.
Been working on Jet aircraft for the past 20+ years. Taxiway is right in front of our hangar about 100' away. Jets constantly going back and forth all day. I spend lots of time in confined spaces with pneumatic drills, rivit guns, etc...
I don't really notice the ringing unless its dead quiet at night, or I'm in an isolation booth for my annual hearing test.

If you don't want the ringing to get worse wear plugs at anything over TV volumes. Earplugs at any concert, club, loud vol event, mowing the lawn, period!!! One exception and my ears will ring loudly for days. Cymbals especially kill me.
Buy a bunch of those hearos http://www.amazon.com/Hearos-Earplugs-Fidelity-Series-1-Pair/dp/B000V9PKZA or equivalent and keep one on your keychain so its always with you. I have them in my car, luggage, several sets in my music room etc... They are cheap buy a bunch. I find you can actually hear the music way better at concerts while wearing them.

Simple really, protect your hearing or lose it.

 

[chris lykins]

So I guess I should chime in. Im an ear, nose, and throat doctor who was also a professional guitarist in a touring thrash band back in the day. The best way to think of tinnitus is as a phantom limb type phenomenon, the sound is being generated in your brain as a result of damage to the high frequencies in your cochlea. I have very loud tinnitus that I can practically hear over my speaking voice. I've had it so long that its basically a part of my life and I can ignore it. One, no OTC meds have been consistently proven helpful. One study demonstrated that 150-200 mg of Ginko Biloba helped about 50% of people. Two, if there is an element of depression involved anti depressant meds have been shown to be helpful but of course there are side effects. Thirdly, in patients where it is intolerably loud, tinnitus habituation training is very helpful. Its basically a form of bio feedback thats taught by specific audiologists (so call around in your area). Like any form of PT, you have to be willing to put in the work for it to be effective.
For what its worth I still play through a bogner shiva, but wear earplugs or keep the volume reasonable. Down load a sound meter ap for your phone to monitor things and its the highs that kill your ears.

 

[Disfigured]

I have been a tinnitus sufferer since 2002. When I first developed T I was convinced I would have to give up guitar. Since then I have gone to many concerts without earplugs, played guitar in front of my amp cranked, and all sorts of stupid shit, lol. It has gotten progressively worse, but it's still tolerable most of the time. The worst part was the first few months adjusting to it in 2002.

There are no drugs, and certainly no herbal medications that get rid of T. I have tried Xanax and it does seem to lower the volume of T, but Xanax has many undesirable side effects and should never be taken on a long term basis. What the anti-anxiety drug is actually doing is reducing your anxiety level which in turn lowers the perceived volume of T. This is also the principle behind many successful therapies like the William Shatner endorsed Tinnitus Retraining Therapy.

To further explain, our brains are wired so that if something enters into the environment to us as a potential threat, our brain begins to focus more attention on that element and away from other less important elements. For example if you hear footsteps downstairs or creaking in the night your brain turns up the perceived volume on this sound relative to other sounds you are used to, and it seems louder than it actually is.

When you first develop T, or if it becomes worse through noise exposure, your brain, thinking there is something wrong, turns up the noise on the T. If you can retrain the T to no longer be a concern to you, the perceived volume will actually decrease.

To the best of my understanding, this is how tinnitus retraining therapy works: you wear a hearing aid that makes a whoosh sound, but DOES NOT actually mask the sound of the T, because after all you don't want to mask it or you won't get used to it. You wear the hearing aid for weeks or months and then one day, it is removed. Your brain, used to the whoosh sound, is alarmed that the sound is no longer there and focuses your attention on the frequencies of that sound that you used to hear that has now been replaced with silence, thus taking the attention away from the T and significantly reducing the perceived volume of the T. Some people say at this point in therapy they can hardly even hear the T unless they try hard to focus on it.

Bottom line, your T might be loud, but more than likely it is just perceived volume and a lot lower in volume than you think.
But it probably shouldn't affect your future in guitar playing, provided you wear good ear protection to prevent further damage.
The problem is the expensive ear plugs sound better, but they still let some damaging frequencies through, because they don't reduce the volume completely.
It's unlikely you will get further hearing damage if you wear cheap industrial strength earplugs like those used in factories.
As for dealing with the T you do have, I have some really good masking CDs for sleep, I don't always use them, but I keep them at a low enough volume to barely mask the T.

 

[RobShug]

I have very low level tinnitus and went the route of investing in musician ear plugs that are custom molded to your ear canals. I'm getting ready to get a new pair since the pair I have is over 20 years old and was quoted a price of $170.00 from my local ENT audiologist.
In my case they really work well & they are especially usefull when attending a concert. I sat 8th row on a recent Paul McCartney show & heard everything clearly & it felt great to leave a show without noise hangover!!! It is a worthwhile investment .

 

[syncrodude007]

Black Oak Arkansas show in 72...now ringing 24/7...I wear molded earplugs now and that helps save what's left...

 

[tubortski]

I'd say I have an average case.

I don't see as many concerts, play gigs, or have band rehearsals as frequently any more. But, In 2003, got some nice molded ear plugs and use them as often as I can. There is no shame in using them. I hear things better, actually.

If your not affected by this yet, here is a good read: http://www.hearnet.com/at_risk/risk_at_risk.shtml

 

[Anonymous]

huh?

 

[rupe]

I had custom fitted db reducing ear plugs (still full sound spectrum so none of the typical high end loss of a cheap earplug).
At night, going to sleep with some music or other sounds (tv, nature sounds, etc) can be of help.
My issue isn't too bad...the only time I find it troublesome is when trying to sleep in a dead silent room. My father OTOH suffers from a severe case (only 3% of sufferers reach his level). He has special ear plug/hearing aid combos that play soft bell tones to distract him from the noise and is on anti-anxiety medication as well to help calm his nerves. It's actually debilitating for him and is forcing an earlier retirement than he had planned (although he's retirement age already).

 

[Bob Savage]

Yes, I have tinitus fairly severely in my left ear and mildly in the right. I've been taking pretty good care of my ears for the last decade or so but long after the damage was done.

Mine comes from multiple things though, not just music. Working in the Aerospace/Aircraft industry as a mechanic, I used to be exposed to all kinds of loud, high frequency noise (riveting was horrible), amongst other industries I've worked in. The loud music certainly didn't help.

I have custom fitted ear plugs that are great and I wear them, but I still dislike doing so because no matter how good they are, the goal is to roll off the top end because that's where the damage occurs, which of course affects the experience.

Oh well, I'm just hoping that it doesn't get much worse. I've heard some horrific stories about people that had severe cases.

 

[Bob Savage]

So I guess I should chime in. Im an ear, nose, and throat doctor who was also a professional guitarist in a touring thrash band back in the day. The best way to think of tinnitus is as a phantom limb type phenomenon, the sound is being generated in your brain as a result of damage to the high frequencies in your cochlea. I have very loud tinnitus that I can practically hear over my speaking voice. I've had it so long that its basically a part of my life and I can ignore it. One, no OTC meds have been consistently proven helpful. One study demonstrated that 150-200 mg of Ginko Biloba helped about 50% of people. Two, if there is an element of depression involved anti depressant meds have been shown to be helpful but of course there are side effects. Thirdly, in patients where it is intolerably loud, tinnitus habituation training is very helpful. Its basically a form of bio feedback thats taught by specific audiologists (so call around in your area). Like any form of PT, you have to be willing to put in the work for it to be effective.
For what its worth I still play through a bogner shiva, but wear earplugs or keep the volume reasonable. Down load a sound meter ap for your phone to monitor things and its the highs that kill your ears.

Good info, thanks doc.

 

[flash6969]

Jeff Beck has suffered from this for many years & still gigs. Might be worth looking into his advice & stories on the condition also??

 

[roknroll]

I've had it since before I turned 20. Now 62. I just ignore it.
High quality custom plugs will help you save whats left. They are worth the couple hundred.

 

[Adam of Angels]

Well, I guess what I mean to say is, I'm not at all opposed to investing as much as I have to into the best ear protection available, but, have any of you with bad tinnitus noticed an increase in symptoms after playing live or being around noise a lot with ear protection?

 

[Bob Savage]

, have any of you with bad tinnitus noticed an increase in symptoms after playing live or being around noise a lot with ear protection?

Heck yes. Ringing in the ears after exposure to loins noise/music isn't exclusive to those with tinitus. My ears rang for days after some concerts when I was young and had no symptoms of tinitus.

That ringing after exposure to loud environments is telling you something.

 

[Adam of Angels]

That was while wearing heavy duty ear protection though? I haven't tested it out much, because the prospect of worsened symptoms is not very appealing.

 

[H Golf Sport]

Well, I guess what I mean to say is, I'm not at all opposed to investing as much as I have to into the best ear protection available, but, have any of you with bad tinnitus noticed an increase in symptoms after playing live or being around noise a lot with ear protection?

No. As long as I have plugs no increase.
Problem is always having them with you. If you only have one pair and your wife pulls you into the club one night after you were out having dinner...
That pair back in your music room or guitar case isn't going to do you much good.