Why might someone not prefer a 412?

[JimmyBlind]

I'll also add that some of the best tones i've heard have come from 2x12 combos. Namely the 5150 combo & the JCM800 lead combo.

 

[mikebatt]

The single problem I have with 2x12's is not having one with an angled baffle. Having the sound beamed at my knees is a problem on stage.

Without an angled baffle, it is harder to hear yourself, so you turn up, and blast people in the first row, and the onstage mix, and what the mics pick up...well...that suffers to.

But a 4x12...I cannot see lugging one up three flights of narrow stairs by myself, no matter how good it sounds.

 

[rupe]

I never thought about the point regarding mic'ing a single speaker kinda makes the 412 moot. But I have to wonder if that's not entirely true. There's air behind it that all four are mucking around with.

If it was only the relative lack of bass in 2x12 and 1x12 cabs that makes most people think they don't sound as good as 4x12s, things would be easier. But more speakers = more phase interaction (frequency peaks and notches) between them (even using the same type) = a more complex tone, especially in the midrange. Its simple physics and not debatable. What is subjective is which one sounds best to you.

That all becomes null and void when close mic'ing.

Absolutely not.

Absolutely. Insignificant

Truth...in all but perhaps the most controlled studio environment with multiple mics, there is no significant difference. Even with a single close mic in the studio you won't hear anything appreciable...live it's a complete non-issue. Simple mic placement will have an exponentially greater affect on tone.

I used to use a 4x12 live for me as I don't like hearing my guitar coming back at me through the monitors. Then I came across a 2x12 cab that could actually hang with any of my 4x12s...and it's extremely light weight and portable to boot. The only time I could see using 4x12s live again is if I'm doing an unmiked gig or I want a cool looking back line.

 

[dirtyfunkg]

I haven't gigged a 4x12 since high school. For several reasons that I will detail now:

1. It's heavy and unwieldy. Actually, it's really not the weight, just the awkwardness of loading it into and out of my car, especially when there are several flights of stairs involved. Couple that with my recurring sciatica and disk problem in L5/S1, I'm strongly considering moving a bunch of gear and going to an Axe-FX live rig and using my Fryettes for studio and unmiked gigs only.

2. It's unnecessary for an indoor, miked show. The throw is usually too far, it's beamy, and I'm perfectly happy (in fact, happier) with using my wedges or using IEM's for hearing myself. I'd rather get a better idea of what the audience is hearing.

3. I find soundguys tend to appreciate not having to deal with all of that stage volume/air movement. It's really hard to make a band like Dinosaur Jr. or even Local H sound really good when the stage volume is so cluttered in a 300-400 capacity club.

 

[Dingleberries]

The only thing better than a full stack is two full stacks in stereo
Having said that, I use a 2x12 on an amp stand.

 

[Norton666]

With my cover band , I would NEVER take out anything bigger than a 2x12. Multiple reasons , that all of the gigging , cover band musicians have touched on. Most importantly for me though , is that if I were to wheel in a 4x12 half stack to a wedding reception , they would shit ! I play in a cover band to make money. It's a business for me. How can we deliver the best CROWD sound possible??.. The answer is little to no stage volume. I don't care what area/market you're in , the cover bands that are making the most money , aren't wheeling in giant rigs. They have in ears , quiet drums (whether it be electronic or behind plexiglass) and a solid production. When you have all of those , a killer guitar rig starts to seem like an afterthought. That being said............

In my original band , there's no way on Lemmys green earth you will ever catch me with less than a half stack ! Original bands don't have the luxury of a solid PA , or a PA at all for that matter!!! I've toured the country multiple times and shown up to a venue with a 4 channel powered mixer into speakers on stands. In that scenario , it's all about the power being emitted from the stage. The vocals are just icing , and much like car insurance , are only there because they have to be! I won't be caught dead with a 2x12 in that situation. Turn that shit up and let's show them what a band sounds like without all the bells and whistles!!!

 

[blackba]

The single problem I have with 2x12's is not having one with an angled baffle. Having the sound beamed at my knees is a problem on stage.

Without an angled baffle, it is harder to hear yourself, so you turn up, and blast people in the first row, and the onstage mix, and what the mics pick up...well...that suffers to.

But a 4x12...I cannot see lugging one up three flights of narrow stairs by myself, no matter how good it sounds.

Try turning the horrizontal 212 on its side. It will give better left to right spread and get one of the speakers closer to your ear. Of course they do make veritcal 212's with angled baffles as well.

 

['63-Strat]

I have a bogner 2X12 and 4X12 and will use either depending on the situation. Even though a 2X12 can be just as loud as a 4X12 there are definitely times when wheeling in a 4X12 is the wrong call as some others have noted. Sometimes the soundguy or bar owner will freak out before you've even played a note (And I am NOT that guy that plays too loud for a venue, it's purely just the visual of a 4X12). Also, depends on whether I have to fit more people in my car or not. If it's just me and the g/f, no prob I can fit my whole rig w 4X12 and 2 guitars easy. If I have to bring me, my bass player, both our rigs and the g/f? Gotta bring the 2X12. Now personally, I *HATE* listening to my guitar tone through floor monitors, so I can monitor myself better with a 4X12 but the 2X12 is fine too. I have found the Bogner 2X12 sounds the biggest of any 2X12 I've played fwiw. Ideally? Yes, I prefer my 4X12 though.

Another thing is genre, I play mostly rock and metal and a closed back cab sounds best for that IMO (though have played all types of styles). For some things I would definitely want an open back 2X12.