NAD! '82 Marshall 4104 with EV's

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Just got my MXR Timmy in the mail today after drooling over @LPMojoGL's tones he got with his 4104 and Timmy. Gonna take some playing around with to get a feel for, but so far it seems like it can hit the front-end harder than my EQ pedal and that adding some clipping with the Gain knob adds something that I don't quite get just from clean boosts. Into a clean channel it seems a little wooley, but the same settings into a dirty amp seem to do the complete opposite and add edge and grind. Interesting. Clips at some point in the future...
 
Just got my MXR Timmy in the mail today after drooling over @LPMojoGL's tones he got with his 4104 and Timmy. Gonna take some playing around with to get a feel for, but so far it seems like it can hit the front-end harder than my EQ pedal and that adding some clipping with the Gain knob adds something that I don't quite get just from clean boosts. Into a clean channel it seems a little wooley, but the same settings into a dirty amp seem to do the complete opposite and add edge and grind. Interesting. Clips at some point in the future...
Sorry I haven't stayed up to date with the listening and feedback on your experiments. The bluetooth transmitter in my laptop died so all I have are junk speakers minus going into my phone, logging in, activating bluettooth and digging up this thread.

I've been using my Blue Note in a similar fashion to the way you are using that Timmy for many years now. Truthfully most of my settings are just a mostly cranked amp and all my pedal knobs set at 12 with maybe gain up to 1 or 2 o clock.
 
Sorry I haven't stayed up to date with the listening and feedback on your experiments. The bluetooth transmitter in my laptop died so all I have are junk speakers minus going into my phone, logging in, activating bluettooth and digging up this thread.
No worries!
I've been using my Blue Note in a similar fashion to the way you are using that Timmy for many years now. Truthfully most of my settings are just a mostly cranked amp and all my pedal knobs set at 12 with maybe gain up to 1 or 2 o clock.
Seems like a pretty common use case. Originally I was against adding any diode clipping, but after hearing both @LPMojoGL's demos with the Timmy adding a little clipping and hearing my friend's GT500 with set for boost and little clipping into my amp, I figured there might be something to it.
 
e a pretty common use case. Originally I was against adding any diode clipping, but after hearing both @LPMojoGL's demos with the Timmy adding a little clipping and hearing my friend's GT500 with set for boost and little clipping into my amp, I figured there might be something to it.
Seems to stay and feel very organic when I get a little drive from the pedal and mix it with a bit of power amp drive from the amp, but not press either of them too hard for drive.. I think the Timmy and Blue Note are fairly similar. It'll be interesting to hear how you like your results.
 
Seems to stay and feel very organic when I get a little drive from the pedal and mix it with a bit of power amp drive from the amp, but not press either of them too hard for drive.. I think the Timmy and Blue Note are fairly similar. It'll be interesting to hear how you like your results.
A quick glance at some schematics online shows that they seem to be fairly similar electrically as well, though the blue note might have slightly more built-in tone shaping. I'd have to look closer though to tell for sure what's going on. The FAT control on the blue note, however, looks almost identical in function to the Bass control on the Timmy, just with a few values changed.
 
Just got my MXR Timmy in the mail today after drooling over @LPMojoGL's tones he got with his 4104 and Timmy. Gonna take some playing around with to get a feel for, but so far it seems like it can hit the front-end harder than my EQ pedal and that adding some clipping with the Gain knob adds something that I don't quite get just from clean boosts. Into a clean channel it seems a little wooley, but the same settings into a dirty amp seem to do the complete opposite and add edge and grind. Interesting. Clips at some point in the future...
FWIW, my go-to settings on the Timmy are volume and bass 2 (everything is o'clock), treble and gain 11, diode selector in the middle position.
This gives a big volume push, with little diode clipping and the most headroom for better dynamics, while cutting the bass, and retaining the natural treble sound.

That's with a V2 Timmy.
After reading the manual, it seems that the tone knobs work in the opposite direction on the MXR.
On my Timmy, full bass and treble are with the knobs fully counter clockwise. On the MXR, full bass and treble is fully clockwise, like the newest Tim. On the MXR, the toggle switch is most open in the middle (my preferred), more saturated to the left (good for a bit of compression and more dirt, less open, like an SD1, more metal) and most saturated and compressed to the right if you really just want a sweet overdrive into a clean amp, or wall of sound (like a Tube Screamer, never use this option myself, you might dig it).

Assuming the MXR sounds like the V2, I'd set the bass to 10 o'clock, treble to 1 o'clock, volume to 2, gain to 11. If the MXR is like the newer Tim, you may have to dial the tone knobs back a bit more, as they seem to come on faster, something like bass 9 o'clock, treble noonish.

To dial it in by sound for boosted Marshall greatness, assuming the master volume is between 1-2 on the dial (loud home/small bar band volume, not loud enough for power tube compression, not bedroom volume dark congested, before the amp opens up) :
Plug into the hi input on the 4104, set the preamp anywhere from 7.5-10 on the dial, depending on how much gain and low end you want. I set to 7.5 if I want super tight attack, the most dynamics to reach lower gain/clean sounds with guitar volume, and use the pedal for more gain. I set to 10 for all the gain, low end, thickest sound, and use the pedal to pull the flubby bass back. My most used preamp setting is like 8-9. I roll it up until I hear the big muddy bass jump, then pull it back to just before that, so I get the most gain without the flabby low end.
On the pedal, start at the suggested settings, V-2, B-10, T-1, G-11. Adjust the bass while chugging on the low e string, dialing it back for more tightness while retaining low end, all the way down for mid-heavy djent, or up for a looser feel. Adjust the treble for brightness, up for peaky bite, down for creamy warmth. Adjust gain for compression and dynamic response. Adjust volume for overall boost and gain. Don't be afraid to peg it, slam that front end, to see what the pedal truly offers. It'll boost so much that it hangs with anything I've used to boost an amp. I'll often compare the Timmy to other pedals, leaving the volume at 1 o'clock. All it takes it a twist on the volume knob for it to win the battle.

Timmy is a great overdrive in to a clean channel. Super easy to dial in all kinds of different, slight to medium gain crunch tones. Into the low input on the 4104, with preamp gain set at that just not quite muddy bass setting, you can find so many great sounds. It usually helps if the pedal is boosting the volume a bit. I've found this is a good general rule for any type of gain pedal into a clean amp (fuzz, od, or distortion)...a lil bump in volume makes all the difference. The bass knob is pre-gain. Dial out that wooliness by turning it down a bit.

Timmy is also a fantastic transparent clean boost. I've used it in the effects loop, or last in my pedal chain into a clean amp, as a volume boost when I want to be louder. Tone knobs up, gain to where it barely starts to affect the tone, volume to taste.
It's also the perfect sweetener for a sterile clean channel. A hint of gain and volume boost, bass and treble to taste, will wake up any bland clean channel, like on an EVH or other channel switcher. More than a couple of popular, "always on" pedals are based on the Timmy. Greer Lightspeed, Lovepedal OD11/Amp11, Venuram Jan Ray come to mind.
It's also a fantastic tone shaper when used after other gain pedals. You can boost the volume and tame the eq of an unruly fuzz (Fuzz Face, Tone Bender, Muff). Or give your TS/SD1 more juice with the extra volume, while precisely shaping the tone.
It'll stack with any other gain pedal for another level of gain. I've used it live, in front of or behind other pedals (Angry Timmons, Barber Gain Changer, Klon), as my lead boost pedal and/or my "metal" pedal, essentially adding an extra gain channel to whatever I'm playing.
There's really nothing it can't do, as an overdrive/boost, short of full on distortion.

A good Klone can do almost everything the Timmy does, in a different way. I like it better as a clean channel sweetener and stand-alone overdrive.
I use it for boosting/tightening gain tones when I don't mind a bit of extra bass.
It does pretty well behind other pedals as an extra gain stage and tone shaper. I like the Timmy better for that, and especially as a strictly clean boost.
I wouldn't want to be without either.
 
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Turned the master up to around 0.5/10 and did some quick before/after riffs with the Timmy set to @LPMojoGL's suggestions above. No fancy mic setup, I just stuck the PZM to the wall. Seems that spot ain't great, and standing there was less than ideal as well. But, I'm liking the direction the Timmy takes things.


Edit: Oh, and I had a Peterson StroboClipHD on the headstock.
 
Alright, finally go a decent sized piece of plywood to mount my boundary mic on. Did a little screwing around with the mic placed in a decent spot in the room. Aside being overly roomy, I think it's pretty good.

@TanPants some cleans for you:

@Beetlejuice Beetlejuice Beetlejuice some blues for you:

RoomEQWizard says this is the spectral content of my blues recording:
1746582681337.png
 
Threw the plywood on the floor in front of the amp and got a fairly balanced sound, if a little dark. Then realized the mic wasn't centered between the speakers (diffraction will get ya if you don't watch out...) and centered it, which recovered some high-end.

Pre-centering:


Centered:


Spectrum of the two clips with SPL aligned (green is centered):
1746761841374.png


My first impressions are that I'm happy with the tonal balance of the centered clip, but the strings plinking is killing the vibe. I think next on the list of things to try is some way of isolating the mic from that. Might be hard give how reflective my room is (clicks from behind me bounce off the wall and sound like they're coming from in front of me) and the fact that I'm using an omni pattern mic. We'll see.
 
Seems like I'm losing high-end still: that steep drop-off in the graph after 3kHz. A quick check of polar patterns suggests that I should expect everything 2kHz and up to be about 5dB down (and more as frequency rises) due to being about 30 degrees off-axis with mic placement, not accounting for the slight boost I should see from placing the mic in the beam. A 5dB high-frequency shelf starting at about 3.2kHz seems to do a world of good for articulation, with the unexpected effect of more well-defined growl. I'm gonna have to look into better mic placements to not drop that much high-end. Another note is that the plinking of the strings seems to be mostly a low-volume issue. Turning up the volume a bit on the amp makes a large difference in how audible the plinking is.
 
Threw a 57 on the edge of the dustcap against the grill cloth, and saw less of a difference than I expected in the high-end. Here's the graph, red is the PZM placed so recordings sound like what I hear in the room, green is the 57:
1746991414841.png

PZM track:

57 track:


Subjectively the 57 track sounds bigger, chunkier, darker, and smoother, with more hash. The PZM track sounds clearer, brighter, smaller, thinner, and a little rougher. But, it's almost bang-on what I hear in the room. At least listening back on my cheap over-ear headphones. I ordered some Yamaha MSP5's so that I finally have a decent reference to work off of, I expect I'll have to re-tune mic placement when they arrive.

Take-away so far is that the 57 really does a number on your room sound, at least in my attempts, and that the PZM can get really close to what you hear in the room, but that might not be subjectively as good as the altered sound from the 57. Also setting up the PZM on the floor is super quick and easy with surprisingly good results, and the omni-directional nature of it can make low-volume recording fiddly if you don't want out of phase string plinks in the background. My goal so far has been to get what I hear in the room onto tape, and I think I've gotten really close to that as of now. Probably fine tuning and tweaking things now, like getting rid of plinks.
 
Subjectively the 57 track sounds bigger, chunkier, darker, and smoother, with more hash. The PZM track sounds clearer, brighter, smaller, thinner, and a little rougher. But, it's almost bang-on what I hear in the room.
I'll take the 57 over any of the other close mic live sound options. A room mic is nice to add to recordings and I did that but I find the main tone in mixdown is generally 60 percent or more of the 57. They just work good.
 
They just work good.
I suppose for sound production, where you're probably trying to make a new sound anyway. My beef with them is that for sound capture, things don't sound like I hear 'em in person. At least with my experiments so far. I paid for my amp I want to hear my amp!
 
I suppose for sound production, where you're probably trying to make a new sound anyway. My beef with them is that for sound capture, things don't sound like I hear 'em in person. At least with my experiments so far. I paid for my amp I want to hear my amp!
I owned a Marshall for many years and always captured the flavor in studio using a 57 without much hassle. *shrugs
 
I owned a Marshall for many years and always captured the flavor in studio using a 57 without much hassle. *shrugs
That's the thing though, I'm not going for "flavor" I'm going for "replica". Unless you're saying you've got that too... In which case definitely intrigued. At any rate I know I'm not that great at using a 57 yet so I'm reserving final judgement until I've eliminated that as a possible reason for differences.
 
Went back through and listened to just about every clip I posted in this thread now that I have decent monitors to listen with, and not just gaming headphones. Some of the earlier clips that I didn't really like I now like better, so that's interesting. Overall, I still prefer the PZM to the 57 on most of the recordings, aside from the string noise bleed. With the exception of that last clip where the PZM was matched to what I hear in the room. There, while the 57 doesn't provide my ideal tone, it does sound better than what I'm hearing in the room, by proxy.

Hoping to have some new clips up soon with the amp placed differently in the room after seeing how much things change when I put some wall-like thing behind the amp to reflect the backwave instead of letting it get trapped under my desk.

I also scooped up another of the same PZM off EvilBay, so that I have two for stereo recordings. Will be trying various arrangements out with that. Building a better cab will have to wait, I'm suddenly busy this summer, so money to buy wood went to the mic instead.
 
Got the PZM from the post today, and did a little screwing around with it and the other one in a stereo pair arrangement. Did semi-close-miking stuff by sitting the mics on a box a few feet in front of the amp and then spacing the mics around head-width apart and placing a roughly 1sqft baffle between them (a three ring binder). Also double-tracked with a 57 (edge of dustcap, against grill) to get a comparison. Late, so very low volume. Per usual.


Edit: "boot" in the filename is because I used a boot as a mic stand for the 57.
 
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