12 gauge speaker wire Louder?

squealie said:
Youre the speaker maker. Im just a dumbass on the innernets.

But I'd love to see some real data on this.
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I had to rewire some cabs years ago. Client had a Bogner Cab with 12 gauge, IIRC. He changed speakers to mine after he heard one of my cabs at Tone Merchants. He put the speakers in and used the 12 gauge wire in the Bogner Cab. He called me and told me it didn't sound right. He wanted it to sound like my demo cab. So I went and rewired his cab with my 16 gauge copper stranded red & black sheath wire. Then it sounded way better. Nothing measured or scientific, just used his ears.
 
Racerxrated said:
Whenever I’ve grabbed some copper lamp cord at the hardware store, and re wired my JCM 800 cabs soldered instead of the thin wire spade connectors the tone has always improved. Every time without fail. More clarity to my ears. I’ve not done that to any older 70s cabs though. Also, getting rid of that cheap stereo plug in a 900 cab and wiring mono also improved tone.
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I have always done this. I rewire every cab when i get it, mostly because i change the speakers, and look at the shit wire they used...And I hate stereo cabs....That jack on most of them looks like the cheapest piece of crap. I always buy nice mono jacks. I have used the spade connecters, but i soldered them to the ears when i did. But i have these alligator clips that make it easy for me to solder directly to the ears now.
 
Racerxrated said:
Whenever I’ve grabbed some copper lamp cord at the hardware store, and re wired my JCM 800 cabs soldered instead of the thin wire spade connectors the tone has always improved. Every time without fail. More clarity to my ears. I’ve not done that to any older 70s cabs though. Also, getting rid of that cheap stereo plug in a 900 cab and wiring mono also improved tone.
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I've heard this ol' tale since the HCAF days.

It makes absolutely NO SENSE that cab makers would not spend $0.20 on some wire to make their cabs noticeably better.
 
Scumback Speakers said:
I had to rewire some cabs years ago. Client had a Bogner Cab with 12 gauge, IIRC. He changed speakers to mine after he heard one of my cabs at Tone Merchants. He put the speakers in and used the 12 gauge wire in the Bogner Cab. He called me and told me it didn't sound right. He wanted it to sound like my demo cab. So I went and rewired his cab with my 16 gauge copper stranded red & black sheath wire. Then it sounded way better. Nothing measured or scientific, just used his ears.
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I respect your opinion a lot, but this is very subjective. The guy in the article that i linked that decided 12 gauge was the best wiring did blind tests with lots of different wiring. One thing they could for sure hear was the difference between 12 and 14 gauge was astronomically jumping out each time. I believe whether it is better or not might be your goals.
I personally didn't notice a decrease in treble/presence/highend with my change. I didn't notice an increase in low end. That would be an interesting thing to test if you left the amp exactly the same and changed the gauge. But I am for sure getting more clean headroom...somehow. I only know this because i am a metal player with a db meter and I am very specific about not getting a loosebutthole tone. But if someone like you that has more time (and i bet you solder a lot faster than me, lol) wanted to do an a/b, I would love to hear it.
 
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squealie said:
I've heard this ol' tale since the HCAF days.

It makes absolutely NO SENSE that cab makers would not spend $0.20 on some wire to make their cabs noticeably better.
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So you don’t believe that my cab sounded better with thicker wire? Have you ever been inside an 800/900 Marshall cab and noticed how thin the wire is?
I have a pretty good ear, I notice things like how much better a 2C+ sounds than a Mark 3. Maybe you’re in the crowd that feels they sound the same. Clearly then, we hear different things.
If I’m misunderstanding you my apologies.
 
Racerxrated said:
So you don’t believe that my cab sounded better with thicker wire? Have you ever been inside an 800/900 Marshall cab and noticed how thin the wire is?
I have a pretty good ear, I notice things like how much better a 2C+ sounds than a Mark 3. Maybe you’re in the crowd that feels they sound the same. Clearly then, we hear different things.
If I’m misunderstanding you my apologies.
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Yeah, I'm sure you've outsmarted me and 70 years of audio manufacturers. Kudos.
 
squealie said:
Yeah, I'm sure you've outsmarted me and 70 years of audio manufacturers. Kudos.
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????
Dude, get a grip. It’s just speaker wire. I mean, no one ever recommends thicker gauge wire. Especially audio manufacturers. Speaker wire, cables etc we all know it’s thin to win.

Ya ok. 👌
 
I just want to point out that manufacturers don't seek out the best way to do things. Mills acoustic was a company that tried it and failed.
Marshall was a company known for putting whatever they had on hand into an amp, which is why the variance is so great with their amps. Most manufacturers that are in business find the cheapest way to make something and go with it. How much a company cares about how high quality it is varies. But if you stay in business, you are generally cutting corners, or charging a lot more money for that quality.
When the companies charge more for the quality and for the labor of hand building these things, they usually get pariahed for snake oil, when they are just trying to not compete with slave labor...
 
Racerxrated said:
????
Dude, get a grip. It’s just speaker wire. I mean, no one ever recommends thicker gauge wire. Especially audio manufacturers. Speaker wire, cables etc we all know it’s thin to win.

Ya ok. 👌
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Yep. Cab manufacturers cripple their cabs to save 2 dollars in wire because it 'adds up'

This is fucking delusional.
 
squealie said:
Yep. Cab manufacturers cripple their cabs to save 2 dollars in wire because it 'adds up'

This is fucking delusional.
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2 dollars x6000 cabinets = 12,000$
this is a very modest estimate. If you think that $12,000 profit on wire size or a manufacturer considering it to be a win is delusional...I am kind of wondering where you are coming from. You do realize that most guitars come with shit electronics in them right? Is it delusional to believe that Jackson or ibanez would ship guitars with chinese pickups and pots? What about chinese version of bridges or plastic nuts? This shit is literally done every day, because it SAVES MONEY.
 
I oro
thegame said:
You heard it here first. Scumbacks sound muddy with wire thicker than 16 awg. Celestions sound good with any size wire.
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Thicker wire decreases both resistance and capacitance. I can’t see how there’d be any reduced high end, especially in the frequencies that guitars occupy
 
squealie said:
Yep. Cab manufacturers cripple their cabs to save 2 dollars in wire because it 'adds up'

This is fucking delusional.
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Dude, using thin wire doesn’t cripple the cabs tone. Cabs sound fine stock, I’ve never said they didn’t.
But I feel that at least in the JCM 800 cabs and newer, the lamp cord upgrade does just that…it simply sounds a bit better than stock. It’s not night/day or anything but I do hear a difference for the better.
But that’s just me.
 
8len8 said:
Never say never. A current source circuit drives a current into a load.

In this example (a current sink) the circuit drives a current. It has a high output impedance, higher than the load.

https://www.researchgate.net/post/C...-taking-the-base-emitter-voltage-as-an-output
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We’re comparing apples to oranges here. Sure a properly designed source scan effect the efficiency of how quickly the speakers impedance draws current based on dynamic frequency spikes, but your source cannot force the current to speakers. You cannot force a speaker to consume double the current, but you can replace a speaker with half the impedance and it will consume double the current with no changes to the source.
 
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