shane159
New member
Guitarzan1143":3j8wejj8 said:
I agree. You have to be doing something wrong if you cant get a 5150 to cut. That is the funniest thing I have seen on this forum. 
I agree. You have to be doing something wrong if you cant get a 5150 to cut. That is the funniest thing I have seen on this forum. 
ttosh
New member
glpg80":1j0v04s3 said:
Since tone is in the fingers that is probably why some people get lost in the mix, their fingers lack too many mids...
Regarding the Herbert I could definitely see the Herbert getting drowned out since it has so many ways of removing the mids. Also Marshalls are the most mid centric amps on the planet and this actually makes sense to me as well. However I can say that the Herbert setup up with mid cut off and the mids dimed pretty much, depth rolled back, bass treble and presence setup properly it can keep up with most amps I have tried it against so far. This also provides a liquid creamy lead tone you do not get with a Marshall IMHO, which does not mean that it is better for some applications but better for others.
Not saying you are wrong, actually agreeing with you. Just saying there are many factors to play in the getting lost in the mix.
lolzgreg
New member
NITROHOLIC":2viuvrww said:
I'm sure 5150/Recto gets lost in the mix considering it has been used on about 8/10s of every aggressive metal production since their respective releases.
Sixtonoize
New member
In my experience, modelers tend to be harder to get to cut in the context of a mix.
There's just something about modeled guitar tones that makes them easy to lose if you're not careful.
That being said, any amp can cut in a mix if you dial it (and dial the rest of the band) correctly.
Also, any amp can get buried in the mix if you don't know what you're doing (or doing it intentionally).
There's just something about modeled guitar tones that makes them easy to lose if you're not careful.
That being said, any amp can cut in a mix if you dial it (and dial the rest of the band) correctly.
Also, any amp can get buried in the mix if you don't know what you're doing (or doing it intentionally).
spawnofthesith
New member
None of the amps that I have owned have ever really gotten lost in the mix, so I can't say anything from experience.
In regards to the 5150, when I had mine I cut amazingly. However, I was running my mids at like 7. On the flipside though, when I saw In Flames, I could barely make out the guitars in the mix, so idk. Could be too much scooping or it could have just been a crappy sound guy
In regards to the 5150, when I had mine I cut amazingly. However, I was running my mids at like 7. On the flipside though, when I saw In Flames, I could barely make out the guitars in the mix, so idk. Could be too much scooping or it could have just been a crappy sound guy
T
Tawlks
New member
spawnofthesith":ov0y6pt1 said:
I think probably the latter, I don't think In Flames are super scooped.
I'm amazed though that Phil Demmel of Machine Head has his mids on 1 and can still be heard.... Then again they've git a really guitar heavy mix
stefvorcide
New member
I think it's mostly a EQing and Cab problem.. if the other guitarist has an amp who add too much noize or "enveloppe" over the notes the other one can get lost...
When you have shitty pickups it sure doesnt help.
When you have shitty pickups it sure doesnt help.
FastRedPonyCar
Active member
Carvin V3 
And speaking of scooped mids = getting lost in the mix, the nitro didn't get that memo. I've played songs with mids totally cut and the tone was still a wrecking ball on stage.
And speaking of scooped mids = getting lost in the mix, the nitro didn't get that memo. I've played songs with mids totally cut and the tone was still a wrecking ball on stage.
AngryGoldfish
New member
Framus Dragon
It was the second expensive amp I'd owned that became lost in the mix. And I didn't know what to do to hear myself other than turn it up. Which, of course, just added to the mush.
My conclusion, the amp should of had no problem seeing as it's a relatively tight amp with a strong, defined high and low midrange. But, maybe because of the room or because of the music we used to play (Stoner Metal), it just turned into a flubby mess.
It was the second expensive amp I'd owned that became lost in the mix. And I didn't know what to do to hear myself other than turn it up. Which, of course, just added to the mush.
My conclusion, the amp should of had no problem seeing as it's a relatively tight amp with a strong, defined high and low midrange. But, maybe because of the room or because of the music we used to play (Stoner Metal), it just turned into a flubby mess.
glpg80
Well-known member
stefvorcide":2fdctkwo said:
that one guy was playing a PRS... im just saying
but yeah on a more serious note, the cabinet i heard a herbert through was a diezel cabinet.
the clean tones sounded great, the lead tones (when you could hear it) were complex and sounded great too. but as soon as the bands started playing that amplifier just couldnt cut the mix at all until he boosted the hell out of the front end with a pedal for a solo - then it cut like a knife.
Z
zuel69
Active member
Thats exactly how you set up a herbert to scream in a band mix!
ttosh":1pyfc7ec said:glpg80":1pyfc7ec said:
Since tone is in the fingers that is probably why some people get lost in the mix, their fingers lack too many mids...
Regarding the Herbert I could definitely see the Herbert getting drowned out since it has so many ways of removing the mids. Also Marshalls are the most mid centric amps on the planet and this actually makes sense to me as well. However I can say that the Herbert setup up with mid cut off and the mids dimed pretty much, depth rolled back, bass treble and presence setup properly it can keep up with most amps I have tried it against so far. This also provides a liquid creamy lead tone you do not get with a Marshall IMHO, which does not mean that it is better for some applications but better for others.
Not saying you are wrong, actually agreeing with you. Just saying there are many factors to play in the getting lost in the mix.
Beyond Black
Well-known member
Gorilla.
FourT6and2
Well-known member
Blame the rider, not the horse.
ihave27frets
Well-known member
Herbert.
And pretty much most Engls.
And pretty much most Engls.
droptrd
Active member
I like thatFourT6and2":1agnfjoz said:
glassjaw7
Well-known member
ANY amp that isn't dialed in to gel within a band context. 
VoodooChild24
Active member
All amps that are poorly EQ'd by the user and sound guy. 
stephen sawall
SEMI ERECT MEMBER
This thread is a lot of fun. ttosh is right .... it's all in the fingers. If your fingers turn down the midrange on your amp there is a very good chance it well not cut. 
Just about any amp including Marshall's well have a hard time cutting if you deal with a other guitar player (midrange heavy), keyboards, horns also in the mix. Anyone who has played in a larger funk or R&B band knows what I am talking about.
It is all about fitting in with the other things in the mix, settings on the amp, and how the person does the actual mix at the board. Any of this can cause a problem.
Some amps well cause more problems than others ..... several are mentioned above.
I guess this is why I use two amps most of the time. One with the big huge modern bass and the other being a more vintage sound that cuts in the upper midrange running in parallel.
Just about any amp including Marshall's well have a hard time cutting if you deal with a other guitar player (midrange heavy), keyboards, horns also in the mix. Anyone who has played in a larger funk or R&B band knows what I am talking about.
It is all about fitting in with the other things in the mix, settings on the amp, and how the person does the actual mix at the board. Any of this can cause a problem.
Some amps well cause more problems than others ..... several are mentioned above.
I guess this is why I use two amps most of the time. One with the big huge modern bass and the other being a more vintage sound that cuts in the upper midrange running in parallel.
T
Tawlks
New member
stephen sawall":1dja1jdx said:This thread is a lot of fun. ttosh is right .... it's all in the fingers. If your fingers turn down the midrange on your amp there is a very good chance it well not cut.
Just about any amp including Marshall's well have a hard time cutting if you deal with a other guitar player (midrange heavy), keyboards, horns also in the mix. Anyone who has played in a larger funk or R&B band knows what I am talking about.
It is all about fitting in with the other things in the mix, settings on the amp, and how the person does the actual mix at the board. Any of this can cause a problem.
Some amps well cause more problems than others ..... several are mentioned above.
I guess this is why I use two amps most of the time. One with the big huge modern bass and the other being a more vintage sound that cuts in the upper midrange running in parallel.
I play in the college jazz band which has 2, sometimes 3 guitarrists, a bassist, drummer, sax, trumpet and trumbone player, keyboard player and singer.... I know what you mean.
Usually when discussing a band mix (which didn't help fucking anything in my last band) I've said that each guitarrist should boost either low or upper mids so it works well and the bassist can fill in the bass.