Bogner Helios, Helios Eclipse or Ecstasy 101b

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stratjacket

stratjacket

Well-known member
Looking for a little help. I’ve been struggling for a while on which amp to go for. I’ve done about as much research as I can do. I know the history, features, etc...but cannot and have not played any of them.

For those who may have played 2 or 3 of these amps for comparison, would you say there are any drastic differences?
I wouldn’t ask which is “best”, but there are some pretty big prices differences and I’m wondering if the amps are different enough to justify.

I’m looking at used prices. A used Helios and Ecstasy 101b are very similar, the Eclipse is anywhere from $500-$800 higher. I would go for the Eclipse, because all being equal price, that’s the one I’d go for. Another school of thought I’m having is that I will probably own all 3 at some point, so why bother with comparisons, just start with any of them knowing that I’ll eventually go through them all.

Any help would be appreciated.
 
I have had the Helios (orginal) and the XTC 101B. Both great amps. Both a bit different. The Xtc is a little darker compared to the Helios. The Helios is more raw and open and the most Marshellesque from the Bogner line. The Xtc is more versatile and has a ton of killer tones. I believe the 101B has more gain as well. The Eclipse certainly has my attention as it fixed all of the short comings of the original as far as flexibility and adding a lot more gain.
 
Helios is a one trick pony - 70's mode, hot input is great.
The clean is meh.
I thought the hot input in 80's mode (diode clipping) sounded like ass, and you can't use an A/B/Y box to switch between the Plexi and Hot input.
101B is a killer, super versatile amp. It can be a little compressed/dark at times, but generally sounds stellar in every mode / channel. (note: ch. 2/3 treble pot is audio taper -TURN IT UP!!) I ran mine with KT77's. I only moved mine as I had to free up some cash, and I kept the BE100 over the 101B, but it was close.
I've heard the Eclipse fixed the short comings of the original Helios, but I haven't tried one.
If the orig Helios and the 101B are the same money, the 101B is a complete no-brainer.
 
I had a Helios 50, killer amp. Very hot-rodded Marshall, with that signature Bogner flavor.

Takes boosts very well too.
 
Thanks guys, all great feedback. I'm sure this helps others too.
 
napalmdeath":3pd6m6hn said:
I had a Helios 50, killer amp. Very hot-rodded Marshall, with that signature Bogner flavor.

Takes boosts very well too.
Click to expand...
Yeah, Helios is the rawest, most "Marshally" amp they make. The 101B is kinda it's own thing.
If you have to have "hot rodded Marshall", then that might push you towards the Helios, but I think there are better ways to get that tone than the original Helios.
Maybe the Eclipse is that amp :dunno:
Never tried one.
 
The Eclipse doesn’t seem to have been too well received and resale will show it.
 
The fact that you cannot switch between the clean and the high gain channel on the Helios without switching inputs was a complete failure and a deal breaker for me. The XTC is the signature Bogner tone. The eclipse is an improvement over the standard Helios but doesn't have the signature Bogner tone
 
Had the XTC 20th (el34), the Helios 100, and I now have the Eclipse.
The Eclipse is my favorite. Fixed everything I wanted from the original. And has the raw upper mid punch that I loved about the original but was never able to get out of my XTC.

Eclipse and Eclipse+ mode have a shit ton of gain, with some added compression. I prefer to stay in Hot mode with the gain set higher.

The clean channel is great too. It stays very clean and has a 3-way bright/scoop switch.

All 3 channels blend together seamlessly, which is also something I struggled with on the XTC. I could never get Blue and Red to be exactly where I wanted, and I was always flipping toggle switches. I much prefer the simpler layout of the Helios Eclipse, and I get all the tones I want on all 3 channels.
:)
 
flimz":11kj5otu said:
Had the XTC 20th (el34), the Helios 100, and I now have the Eclipse.
The Eclipse is my favorite. Fixed everything I wanted from the original. And has the raw upper mid punch that I loved about the original but was never able to get out of my XTC.

Eclipse and Eclipse+ mode have a shit ton of gain, with some added compression. I prefer to stay in Hot mode with the gain set higher.

The clean channel is great too. It stays very clean and has a 3-way bright/scoop switch.

All 3 channels blend together seamlessly, which is also something I struggled with on the XTC. I could never get Blue and Red to be exactly where I wanted, and I was always flipping toggle switches. I much prefer the simpler layout of the Helios Eclipse, and I get all the tones I want on all 3 channels.
:)
Click to expand...

Damn, and just when I reverted to youtubing and reading up more on the Ecstasy... :)

I think for me it'll come down to if I want the Marshally flavor or not. The thing that REALLY turned my onto the Helios/HEclipse is that I bought a pretty cheap used Marshall JVM 205h and fell in love with the orange channel pushed with pedals and EQ. So I started really thinking about the "hot-rodded" Marshall thing. So I am leaning that way.
 
I knew I should’ve stayed away.... what’s up with the eclipse?!

Not to derail. Thanks and sorry. Hehe
 
I think for me it'll come down to if I want the Marshally flavor or not. The thing that REALLY turned my onto the Helios/Eclipse is that I bought a pretty cheap used Marshall JVM 205h and fell in love with the orange channel pushed with pedals and EQ. So I started really thinking about the "hot-rodded" Marshall thing. So I am leaning that way.
Click to expand...
Oh oh.... if you're looking for "upper-mid bite" and "hot-rodded Marshall", a 101B aint it. It's a great amp, but it's not that.
If you are considering an original Helios, make sure you fully understand the limitations of the functionality, and also try to test out an Eclipse before you plunk down your hard earned cash.
FWIW, the XTC 20th i just picked up is a lot closer to what you describe than a 101B. Only had it for a day, but it seems like my 20th is much more open and less compressed, and it feels like the mid push is a little higher up than the 101B version.
Might be something to consider if you can find one used at a reasonable price. The one I picked up is only the second one I've ever seen for sale in my area.
 
scottosan":lnsld4wb said:
The fact that you cannot switch between the clean and the high gain channel on the Helios without switching inputs was a complete failure and a deal breaker for me. The XTC is the signature Bogner tone. The eclipse is an improvement over the standard Helios but doesn't have the signature Bogner tone
Click to expand...

Considering the price-point, I found it a deal-breaker for me. $2800 (new), for limited versatility made it go back. I had a Splawn Competition at the time also, it stayed. Single channel, yes, but footswitchable gears and comparable tones made it a no-brainer. Seeing how I'm back in the Splawn camp, I find it's tone right at home.
 
napalmdeath":1zb4ppb7 said:
scottosan":1zb4ppb7 said:
The fact that you cannot switch between the clean and the high gain channel on the Helios without switching inputs was a complete failure and a deal breaker for me. The XTC is the signature Bogner tone. The eclipse is an improvement over the standard Helios but doesn't have the signature Bogner tone
Click to expand...

Considering the price-point, I found it a deal-breaker for me. $2800 (new), for limited versatility made it go back. I had a Splawn Competition at the time also, it stayed. Single channel, yes, but footswitchable gears and comparable tones made it a no-brainer. Seeing how I'm back in the Splawn camp, I find it's tone right at home.
Click to expand...

I was checking out the Splawn Super Comp, which supposed to be the high gain channel of the Nitro. It looks pretty cool and the price point is way better. Any experience with that?
 
The XTC is pretty awesome. I have had the 101b and the 20th and both are great. Much more tones available than the others. Start out with the XTC.
 
What kind of sound are you looking for? I wouldn't rule out the 20th Anniversary Shiva. That amp is always overlooked
 
Metlupass2":vvf4sgpr said:
What kind of sound are you looking for? I wouldn't rule out the 20th Anniversary Shiva. That amp is always overlooked
Click to expand...

Thanks, I had one, very cool amp. I was just looking for some thoughts from folks who'd tried the 3 amps and I guess I was kind of hoping I'd get get some people saying something like "the eclipse is not worth the extra $$ compared to the Helios, it has all the Marshally bite a person needs". But doesn't look like that's the case. :no:
Until recently I never actually owned a Marshall, so kind of leaning that direction.
 
Well I've owned 2 Ecstasy 101bs.

Green channel - fender cleans

Blue channel - Marshall like low and high gain

Red channel - big low end more modern sound

Lots of preamp eq options with all switches.

Buy at guitar center and you can always return if you don't dig it.
 
I'd opt for the XTC to get the ball rolling - straight up 101B to set the pace.

Just my $0.02
 
I want to thank everyone for all the help. Really appreciate, this board does rawk!!
I think there a lot of people are curious on the topic of Helios vs Eclipse, so I'd be interested in keeping the topic going. Unfortunately, I don't think many has tried the Eclipse.

I spent the last few hours checking to the Splawn Quick Rod because I found a mint one for 3 figures. I really liked a bunch of youtube sounds. So 2 tears in a bucket, fucket...I bought the Splawn Quickrod. Seems like a great hot rodded Marshally tone for $2k less than the Eclipse, I couldn't pass it up.
(I've also had a bunch of Four Roses and I'm tired of sitting on the fence for 3 months thinking about this)
 
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