Climate change denial conspiracies explained

  • Thread starter Thread starter JDs Couch
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Robostyle said:
We are not ever going to agree on this, and that is just fine with me.
Your opinion is that "people actually know what they are talking about".
My opinion is "some people probably do, and some people probably don't".
It's really that simple. Figures and statistics can absolutely be manipulated and every once in a while a story comes out where figures and statistics were manipulated. Are they all manipulated? Obviously not. But it does happen.
I'm not going to pretend to be a scientist, and i'm pretty sure you're not a scientist either.
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Have you ever read How to Lie With Statistics? It's a short book, but one I think everyone should read. It spells out how people can manipulate statistics to show pretty much any outcome they want. Once you're aware of that you see how statistics get manipulated everywhere.

Unfortunately science in recent times has been corrupted by an agenda. Once you attach an agenda and bias to science it's no longer science. Instead of facts/results leading to a conclusion it gets twisted to this is the wanted conclusion so force the facts/results to fit that. Now I'm not saying that happens with all science. There's many fields where it's done right. When you have a divisive issue like climate change scientists on both sides will manipulate things to show the conclusions they want.

Another good example is string theory. It was a revolutionary idea when it first came out and had a resurgence in the late 90's - early 2000's, but it's been losing ground lately. Theoretical physicists who dedicated their whole career to it don't want to let go. 30+ years later and you're still inventing new math just to make the theory fit, maybe it's time to move on to something else.

Unlike other's here I don't have to pretend to be a scientist. I am one; organic chemist actually. I have a white lab coat, but hate wearing it. The sleeves get in the way and I knock shit over. I prefer an apron and extended cuff gloves.
 
Robostyle said:
Humans who make mistakes and are not perfect.
Lots of people dedicate their lives to things and still suck at it.
You blindly believe people in white lab coats, i don't.
I said climate change is possible, you treat it like settled science (whatever TF that is).
We disagree, no big deal to me.
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It's about as settled as gravity. Do you question that too? Better get a second opinion, hmmm, let's ask these oil industry funded scientists for a counter narrative!
 
MadAsAHatter said:
Have you ever read How to Lie With Statistics? It's a short book, but one I think everyone should read. It spells out how people can manipulate statistics to show pretty much any outcome they want. Once you're aware of that you see how statistics get manipulated everywhere.

Unfortunately science in recent times has been corrupted by an agenda. Once you attach an agenda and bias to science it's no longer science. Instead of facts/results leading to a conclusion it gets twisted to this is the wanted conclusion so force the facts/results to fit that. Now I'm not saying that happens with all science. There's many fields where it's done right. When you have a divisive issue like climate change scientists on both sides will manipulate things to show the conclusions they want.

Another good example is string theory. It was a revolutionary idea when it first came out and had a resurgence in the late 90's - early 2000's, but it's been losing ground lately. Theoretical physicists who dedicated their whole career to it don't want to let go. 30+ years later and you're still inventing new math just to make the theory fit, maybe it's time to move on to something else.

Unlike other's here I don't have to pretend to be a scientist. I am one; organic chemist actually. I have a white lab coat, but hate wearing it. The sleeves get in the way and I knock shit over. I prefer an apron and extended cuff gloves.
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I read an article the other day, in Forbes I think. It was about the alleged 97% of "Climate scientists" who agree that most climate change is driven by human activity. Disregarding the crossover or the idea that scientists who aren't actually climate scientists but seem to think their opinion on climate science carries weight, the actual number of the consensus is significantly lower than 97%. It's still pretty high though. I think the estimate was around 80%.
 
JDs Couch said:
It's about as settled as gravity. Do you question that too? Better get a second opinion, hmmm, let's ask these oil industry funded scientists for a counter narrative!
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You are proving my point dumbass.
If there are oil industry funded scientists, then scientists can be bought and paid for, on either side.
 
Robostyle said:
Wow.
You can't be this stupid
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Probably not. Just radically biased to the point of being unhinged. Certainly willing to lie and ignore facts to push his agenda. The strange thing is he's pushing it here, to a bunch of "Alleged" musicians in a foreign ( to him) country. I wonder if maybe he's disabled. Like in a wheel chair or something. Trapped at home with nothing but a computer and a TV.
 
Floyd Eye said:
I read an article the other day, in Forbes I think. It was about the alleged 97% of "Climate scientists" who agree that most climate change is driven by human activity. Disregarding the crossover or the idea that scientists who aren't actually climate scientists but seem to think their opinion on climate science carries weight, the actual number of the consensus is significantly lower than 97%. It's still pretty high though. I think the estimate was around 80%.
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Like I mentioned in the NCY climate thread it would be short sighted to think humans have no impact on global climate. the point of contention is how much. My person opinion based on what I've seen/read is it's not an insignificant amount, but not near as much as what climate alarmist would have you believe.

You can zoom in on the last 50-100 years and say look it's all human's fault. But when you look at it on a geologic scale it paints a different picture. In that time frame the earth has been about 18 degrees hotter on average. We can look at core samples and see when things were cooler and hotter, and to a point see how fast the temperatures changed, but no real pinpoint data. The data on that timeframe is just not that accurate to show how temps. changed on a year to year basis.

Zoomed in during todays times you could say look temps are raising faster than they ever have. On a geologic scale there's not enough data to say this isn't how it happened even during periods it took longer for temps to rise. Maybe there was a quick spike over 100 years and it went back down for a time.
There's also 2 events that to my knowledge haven't happened concurrently. We're coming out of an ice age and the magnetic poles are set to flip. We don't know a whole lot on how those events affect climate change on a short time scale, let alone how they will impact climate together. You really have to take all the data as a whole for it to carry enough weight, not just zoom in on a particular piece to push an assumption.

All that said I do think we should do what we can to protect the planet, both on a large scale and individually. But most of the so called solutions have been pretty craptastic. Suzie Q. Soccer Mom driving an EV is't going to put a dent in anything when you're still using fossil fuels to charge the thing. Plus what's going to happen to the battery when it's no longer useable? A larger portion will be toxic waste. How is the gov't taxing me going to help the climate. News flash it's not. Alternate energy sources are a good idea on the surface, but most still use a lot from the oil & gas industry to produce and maintain. Plus they're currently not that efficient. So they're not offsetting emissions and much as they're trying to say. Not to mention they're not that good got the natural environment; wildlife and such.

Yes we should peruse options to offset emissions, but what we have going now is just feel good solutions that really don't do much in the long run. Technology needs to improve, we need to look at more efficient sources of energy; nuclear for example, or tapping landfills to capture methane for energy.

Anyway, that just my longwinded view on the subject.
 
MadAsAHatter said:
Like I mentioned in the NCY climate thread it would be short sighted to think humans have no impact on global climate. the point of contention is how much. My person opinion based on what I've seen/read is it's not an insignificant amount, but not near as much as what climate alarmist would have you believe.

You can zoom in on the last 50-100 years and say look it's all human's fault. But when you look at it on a geologic scale it paints a different picture. In that time frame the earth has been about 18 degrees hotter on average. We can look at core samples and see when things were cooler and hotter, and to a point see how fast the temperatures changed, but no real pinpoint data. The data on that timeframe is just not that accurate to show how temps. changed on a year to year basis.

Zoomed in during todays times you could say look temps are raising faster than they ever have. On a geologic scale there's not enough data to say this isn't how it happened even during periods it took longer for temps to rise. Maybe there was a quick spike over 100 years and it went back down for a time.
There's also 2 events that to my knowledge haven't happened concurrently. We're coming out of an ice age and the magnetic poles are set to flip. We don't know a whole lot on how those events affect climate change on a short time scale, let alone how they will impact climate together. You really have to take all the data as a whole for it to carry enough weight, not just zoom in on a particular piece to push an assumption.

All that said I do think we should do what we can to protect the planet, both on a large scale and individually. But most of the so called solutions have been pretty craptastic. Suzie Q. Soccer Mom driving an EV is't going to put a dent in anything when you're still using fossil fuels to charge the thing. Plus what's going to happen to the battery when it's no longer useable? A larger portion will be toxic waste. How is the gov't taxing me going to help the climate. News flash it's not. Alternate energy sources are a good idea on the surface, but most still use a lot from the oil & gas industry to produce and maintain. Plus they're currently not that efficient. So they're not offsetting emissions and much as they're trying to say. Not to mention they're not that good got the natural environment; wildlife and such.

Yes we should peruse options to offset emissions, but what we have going now is just feel good solutions that really don't do much in the long run. Technology needs to improve, we need to look at more efficient sources of energy; nuclear for example, or tapping landfills to capture methane for energy.

Anyway, that just my longwinded view on the subject.
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I agree with all of this. As is typical with, eh, certain groups, the reaction is usually feel good bullshit that doesn't do anything and serves an agenda driven purpose as a bonus. They take the same approach to crime, guns, immigration, etc..

One of the things that bothers me the most about the global climate change issue is that it seems to me the US is always the target. We have made significant strides in the last couple decades, meanwhile China, India and some others are completely going in the opposite direction yet these "Eco-warriors" are still trained on the US while simultaneously ignoring the biggest offenders.
 
MadAsAHatter said:
Like I mentioned in the NCY climate thread it would be short sighted to think humans have no impact on global climate. the point of contention is how much. My person opinion based on what I've seen/read is it's not an insignificant amount, but not near as much as what climate alarmist would have you believe.

You can zoom in on the last 50-100 years and say look it's all human's fault. But when you look at it on a geologic scale it paints a different picture. In that time frame the earth has been about 18 degrees hotter on average. We can look at core samples and see when things were cooler and hotter, and to a point see how fast the temperatures changed, but no real pinpoint data. The data on that timeframe is just not that accurate to show how temps. changed on a year to year basis.

Zoomed in during todays times you could say look temps are raising faster than they ever have. On a geologic scale there's not enough data to say this isn't how it happened even during periods it took longer for temps to rise. Maybe there was a quick spike over 100 years and it went back down for a time.
There's also 2 events that to my knowledge haven't happened concurrently. We're coming out of an ice age and the magnetic poles are set to flip. We don't know a whole lot on how those events affect climate change on a short time scale, let alone how they will impact climate together. You really have to take all the data as a whole for it to carry enough weight, not just zoom in on a particular piece to push an assumption.

All that said I do think we should do what we can to protect the planet, both on a large scale and individually. But most of the so called solutions have been pretty craptastic. Suzie Q. Soccer Mom driving an EV is't going to put a dent in anything when you're still using fossil fuels to charge the thing. Plus what's going to happen to the battery when it's no longer useable? A larger portion will be toxic waste. How is the gov't taxing me going to help the climate. News flash it's not. Alternate energy sources are a good idea on the surface, but most still use a lot from the oil & gas industry to produce and maintain. Plus they're currently not that efficient. So they're not offsetting emissions and much as they're trying to say. Not to mention they're not that good got the natural environment; wildlife and such.

Yes we should peruse options to offset emissions, but what we have going now is just feel good solutions that really don't do much in the long run. Technology needs to improve, we need to look at more efficient sources of energy; nuclear for example, or tapping landfills to capture methane for energy.

Anyway, that just my longwinded view on the subject.
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Thank you for mirroring what I said so that the losers can like the sentiment as well lol. Bunch of petty shmucks
 
Dan Gleesak said:
Thank you for mirroring what I said so that the losers can like the sentiment as well lol
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Just like you to take credit for something that you didn't do. You get to call people losers too, while having the balls to tell someone else they are being lesser of a person.

Dan, you are truly a piece of shit.
 
Floyd Eye said:
Just like you to take credit for something that you didn't do. You get to call people losers too, while having the balls to tell someone else they are being lesser of a person.

Dan, you are truly a piece of shit.
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Wtf are you talking about now? I didn’t say he wrote that because of me. I just said that he wrote something that had the same sentiment that I wrote, because it is accurate and logical.
it’s funny to see how people to the same sentiment shared by different people.

It’s too early for you to this angry and insufferable dude. You aren’t gonna make it
 
Robostyle said:
Must be a fun-house mirror lmao
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Even if he had said the same thing he would definitely not have been able to resist throwing some digs in about the "Losers" who disagree with him. His point is never to actually have enlightening conversation. His point is to be a smart ass and insult people. Always.
 
Dan Gleesak said:
there is life on Mars
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IMG_3977.jpeg
 
Dan Gleesak said:
Wtf are you talking about now? I didn’t say he wrote that because of me. I just said that he wrote something that had the same sentiment that I wrote, because it is accurate and logical.
it’s funny to see how people to the same sentiment shared by different people.

It’s too early for you to this angry and insufferable dude. You aren’t gonna make it
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Thanks for your concern bro. I'll be just fine. 😉
 
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