Delay in FX Loop on Gain Channel

[TremoJem]

I get that the gain channel will have some effect on my Strymon pedals, which are in the FX Loop, but what can I do about it.

It seemed not too long ago that I did not have this problem, of the delays not really being defined or sounding good in the gain channel.

In the clean channel all is good, but when I switch to the gain channel the delays are very lacking in definition etc.

I actually have reduced the gain since I first started using the FX Loop for my time based effects, so actually i should not have any problem.

Is it possible that there is something wrong internally with the amp?

The only other thing that I changed was to use a 12AT7 in V6 (phase inverter) of my Tremoverb.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

 

[sg guy]

- I've found that any modulation type of effect always works better in front of the amp instead of in the loop-

 

[Mesa\Kramer]

Delay, Reverb always in loop with Gain
Chorus/Flanger etc sound better also in the loop with higher gain

 

[rcm78]

Delay, Reverb always in loop with Gain
Chorus/Flanger etc sound better also in the loop with higher gain

Delay and reverb yes.

Modulation depends... The nice thing about the Mobius is the pre and post feature. I've found several modulation effects that sound better before the amp rather then in the loop.

Certain stand alone pedals that work better in front of a high gain amp are the EVH Flanger, any version of a Phase 90, and Tremolo.

 

[Dave L]

If the loop is line level and your signal is hotter when on the gain channel than on the clean you could be overloading the Strymons. They are fairly sensitive to hot signals and that could certainly explain some bad squash and mush on the repeats.

 

[some dude]

How are your channel masters set?

Is the amp set to switch between clean & modern?

 

[TremoJem]

Unless I misunderstand...my signal for the gain channel is (if anything) less hot than the clean channel.

I really tried to get both at "unity gain".

Hope that helps...and thanks.

 

[TremoJem]

The clean channel master is at about 50% or at 12:00 on a clock face.

The gain channel is at about 10% or "around" 7:00 on a clock face.

 

[Dave L]

Well, the level also depends on the gain and EQ settings. On one of my amps I run the clean with master 10 and lead with master 4, and once you factor in the gain settings the lead is quite a bit hotter. But since you seem to be sure the lead isn´t that much hotter it looks like the problem is elsewhere.

 

[some dude]

To me your masters seem a little low. I have my channel 2 around 9:00 on the master (modern) with the gain around 10:00. When switching the loop in and out of bypass this was about as hot as I could get it while maintaining minimal impact on the overall tone.

If I clone red to orange im pretty sure the master is up around 12:00 to hit the same volume, but I've never switched the loop in and out of bypass to test this setting since I don't typically use the amp this way.

FWIW, Channel 1 is also around 9:00 on the master (vintage) with the gain around 1:00.

 

[TremoJem]

My clean channel gain is at 9:00 and the master is at 12:00.

My gain channel (cloned to vintage/orange) is at 1:00 and the master is at 7:00.

I run two TOVs in stereo using a Radial JX-2. When I use only one amp it is almost loud enough for rehearsal, but when I use both amps...it is more than loud enough.

It is amazing how by adding a second amp, although at the same volume as the first amp. really increases the perceived volume.

In fact the only time I run one amp at a time is when I am tone chasing or trying to match levels of each channel against one another, so that one is not louder than the other.

My send level is at about 1:00.

My LAM is at 12:00.

Hope that helps.

 

[glassjaw7]

What Strymon (delay) are you running in the loop? I didn't like how my El Cap sounded in the loop with my amp's gain at all. I only liked it into clean channel or after overdrive pedals. My Carbon Copy just sounds "right" to me with amp distortion.

I've since gotten the DIG, which works WAY better than the El Cap in the loop of my Mark IV or Ecstasy. Not sure why it works with gain so much better but it's noticeable.

 

[TremoJem]

I have a Timeline and just as a reminder, the GMajor sounded killer before this happened and I am pretty confident the Timeline would have too.

They both sound the same now.

 

[gibson08]

Have you tried a new tube in V4 ?

 

[TremoJem]

Yes and no.

I replaced the V4 tube with a knowingly good tube...not new.

Not really the same thing as new, but it did not help.

Maybe i should buy some new Mesa tubes just for that.