DiMarzio vs BKP?

[FourT6and2]

I've been using BKP for a few years in my LPs: Black Dogs, Nailbombs, and Holy Divers.

The other day I played an Ernie Ball Music Man John Petruci Majesty 7-string. I think it had Dimarzio Illuminators. I was playing through an Orange Rockerverb. I think it sounded pretty good. Nice vocal quality to the sound. Clear. But a little loose/muddy on the low end. Not sure if that's the pickups, or the guitar, or the amp. Might have been the guitar since the trem/bridge it had was a little awkward to play for palm muting. So that could have made my hand sit in a different position and make things looser sounding. But when I say "low-end" I'm talking about the low E and normal power chords and rhythm playing. I don't play seven-string so I pretty much ignored that low B.

In any event. It got me curious about DiMarzios (I've never played a guitar with them before).

What BKP are the Illuminators (6-string versions) similar to?

And what DiMarzio models are close the BKP Nailbomb, Holy Divers, and/or Black Dogs?

One thing I noticed about the DiMarzios is how smooth they were without being flat, scooped, or harsh in the highs.

Oh, the Illuminators in that guitar are ceramic, too. That's probably part of it. First time playing ceramic pickups.

 

[Khoi]

I actually didn't like the Illuminators at all, it was the main reason that I couldn't gel with my JP13. I thought they were too high output and thought it was kinda scooped sounding

I guess I'm just used to the openness and clarity of BKPs, it's hard for me to like anything else

 

[FourT6and2]

I actually didn't like the Illuminators at all, it was the main reason that I couldn't gel with my JP13. I thought they were too high output and thought it was kinda scooped sounding

I guess I'm just used to the openness and clarity of BKPs, it's hard for me to like anything else

I think for me it was the feel of them. How they responded. Don't get me wrong, I like the Bareknuckles I have. But their openness/clarity lends to a stiffer response.

Maybe it was the ceramic mag in the Illuminators?

I was on the fence when I ordered the Nailbombs whether to go with ceramic or alnico. I've had my eye on a Painkiller too. That's ceramic I believe.

 

[Khoi]

I actually didn't like the Illuminators at all, it was the main reason that I couldn't gel with my JP13. I thought they were too high output and thought it was kinda scooped sounding

I guess I'm just used to the openness and clarity of BKPs, it's hard for me to like anything else

I think for me it was the feel of them. How they responded. Don't get me wrong, I like the Bareknuckles I have. But their openness/clarity lends to a stiffer response.

Ah, yeah, that makes sense then, because I like the stiffness and dryness of the BKP's! I thought the Illuminators were too forgiving, but that's just my weird sense of playing

 

[FourT6and2]

I would venture to say its the guitar. that goofy thing..

It definitely is a goofy guitar. I have no need for a piezo. Or volume boost switches. Or coil split. Just two humbuckers plugged straight into an amp.

 

[Mizati20]

Sounds exactly like how I describe the Crunch Lab, Petrucci's old pickup he used... super smooth, kind loose... just meh... I currently have it in my main guitar which is a Bernie Rico Jr actually which is even funnier since I hate it... just been to busy/lazy to hunt down a pickup and get it swapped out... and I honestly have no idea what would sound good in the guitar since it's so thing and light...

What did you think of the Majesty in person? I absolutely think it looks like a "joke" guitar... so stupid looking... I hope they continue to make the JP guitars... otherwise us lefties will be shit out of luck, I'd love to own another BFR one day... some of the best playing instruments out there...

 

[FourT6and2]

Sounds exactly like how I describe the Crunch Lab, Petrucci's old pickup he used... super smooth, kind loose... just meh... I currently have it in my main guitar which is a Bernie Rico Jr actually which is even funnier since I hate it... just been to busy/lazy to hunt down a pickup and get it swapped out... and I honestly have no idea what would sound good in the guitar since it's so thing and light...

What did you think of the Majesty in person? I absolutely think it looks like a "joke" guitar... so stupid looking... I hope they continue to make the JP guitars... otherwise us lefties will be shit out of luck, I'd love to own another BFR one day... some of the best playing instruments out there...

It played pretty well. Fast, flat neck. Neck was really comfortable. Light guitar. Had a very vocal quality. With the tone knob rolled off, high gain had a sort of half-cocked wah pedal vibe. Which I like. But the way the trem is designed, it makes palm muting awkward for me. I guess I'm just used to a tune-o-matic style bridge where I can rest my hand. But then again, I have no issues with the PRS wrap stoptail.

I don't see myself getting a Majesty any time soon. Maybe the regular John Petrucci model. But it'd have to be a custom build without the Piezo and all the extra weird switches and such. I like things simple.

Maybe a Parker would be a better option to check out. But yeah... the Majesty felt pretty good in the hand.

 

[Ricky Rockhardo]

Regarding the loose low end, Rockerverbs are quite loose even with standard tunings, imo.
I had one for about a week and could barely gel with it using a boost.

Perhaps try the Majesty with another amp before sending the jury out on the
Illuminators?

 

[cardinal]

Loose low end sounds like the Rockerverb. So many different variables there.

But all of my 7 strings have Dimarzios in them, at this point. The only BKP I've had was a Holy Diver, which I thought was just kinda bleh. Not bad, but not earth-shatteringly awesome. Of the Dimarzios that I have (PAF7, Air Norton 7, New 7, Tone Zone 7, D Sonic 7), I don't think any were really that similar to the Holy Diver. Maybe the D Sonic was closest (hot, bright-ish, clear but thin). The PAF7 is probably going to be closest to the Black Dog, but the PAF7 is kinda bright and scooped with the stock ceramic magnet. Swapping to an A5 and A2 makes it progressively warmer and rounder, though I don't think it could replicate the unique "bite" that everyone says the Black Dog has. I've been told the Tone Zone reasonably close to the Nail Bomb. Stock, the Tone Zone can be "too much:" the slug coil is overwound and that gives the pickup kinda tubby and overbearing bass/low end. The half-air mod essentially reduces the power of that coil, evening things out. I think I've read that the AT-1 essentially is two of the Tone Zone's screw coils, which also avoids the tubby/overbearing bass and keeps the overall thick/fat character.

 

[FourT6and2]

^^^Cool thanks!

I'm gonna bring my amp to GC and try it out with the Music Man just for shits and giggles.

 

[nigelpkay]

I think each pickup maker has their own "DNA" that you can hear across their product line. For BKP, it's about clarity and dynamic response more than anything I think, but that doesn't always equal best. That clarity and openness has a price where you trade off some power and forcefullness. Not to mention it lets a lot more of the wood sound through so that it is sometimes very difficult (and expensive) to match a BKP pickup to a specific guitar. They have their own voice which is cool, and they sound great for their intended applications.

Dimarzio's have a particular sound, lots of low mids I find. More compressed and easier to play, but they also sound pretty much the same in no matter what guitar you put them it so there's less guesswork. Just plug in and play. I used the Super Distortion for a long before I tried BKP Holydiver and Blackdog. The Holydiver is sort of halfway between a JB and Super Distortion, but lacks the power and charm of either sometimes. It's super clear, but also less forceful sounding, you really have to dig in. Same with the Black Dog. It's more of a tradeoff of various characteristics rather than being better or worse.
I still use the Holydiver because it sounds great for recording, a real noticeable difference in clarity. But I find live I would rather play the Super Distortion.

 

[FourT6and2]

I think each pickup maker has their own "DNA" that you can hear across their product line. For BKP, it's about clarity and dynamic response more than anything I think, but that doesn't always equal best. That clarity and openness has a price where you trade off some power and forcefullness. Not to mention it lets a lot more of the wood sound through so that it is sometimes very difficult (and expensive) to match a BKP pickup to a specific guitar. They have their own voice which is cool, and they sound great for their intended applications.

Totally agree. I'm quite happy with the BKP I have. I just like to experiment. I'm more a gear head than a musician

Dimarzio's have a particular sound, lots of low mids I find. More compressed and easier to play

This mirrors my thoughts from the other day.

but they also sound pretty much the same in no matter what guitar you put them it so there's less guesswork. Just plug in and play. I used the Super Distortion for a long before I tried BKP Holydiver and Blackdog. The Holydiver is sort of halfway between a JB and Super Distortion, but lacks the power and charm of either sometimes. It's super clear, but also less forceful sounding, you really have to dig in. Same with the Black Dog. It's more of a tradeoff of various characteristics rather than being better or worse. I still use the Holydiver because it sounds great for recording, a real noticeable difference in clarity. But I find live I would rather play the Super Distortion.

I had a JB for a while too. And I switched from it to a Holy Diver and liked it a lot more. To me is has all the same positive qualities of the JB, but doesn't have the annoying and harsh high-end. And the lows are tighter. But... I agree with you, that it lacks some of the forcefulness of the JB.

Black Dogs are just great. No complaints. Not the best for tight metal. But good for hard/modern rock and great for classic rock and '70s heavy metal.

 

[mchn13]

The holy diver reminded me alot of the dimarzio super3, which i didnt get along with either.. Just not enough grunt for the way i pick. Went back to a jb or a duncan distortion.

 

[the4thlast1]

Having tried a lot of Duncan, Dimarzio and BK's the Bare Knuckles do it for me most. They wont be everyones choice as mentioned by others depending on what you are going for. For what its worth I prefer Duncans over Dimarzio. Dimarzios sound and feel good for leads but for rhythm Duncans and BKs by far. This is once again my preferences , not saying Dimarzios cant do rhythm.

What you might "loose" a little with BK's is a very saturated and compressed tone that people might dig. What you gain is a more natural, open and clear sound. Let your amps and pedals give you more saturation and compression if need be goes for me.

A good point is that with the BK's you sometimes have to go through a couple models before you hit it right in the particular guitar. Unless you get good advice from the company or forums. This could be the same case with Duncan and Dimarzio pickups, comes down to how particular you might be. In my experience when you match a good sounding guitar with the right Bare Knuckle its really hard to beat.

 

[thegame]

Duncans and Dimarzios came out in the amplifier era of much less gain and compression. BKP's the opposite. All are quality pickups that will sound at least fairly good plugged into anything, but best into specific amplifiers.

 

[Dimebag11]

I must admit, I'm not fond of BKP. Owned 3 different pickups. Super clear, which was great....but it lacks width. I'm big on Duncan and Suhr pickups...I also love DiMarzios as neck pups. I like Gibson pups too.