Findthetone1
Well-known member
And a giant cunt
J
JDs Couch
Well-known member
All data contradicts your claims Tran.
G
Geo
Well-known member
"Sources on both sides", because there is only two, told me Ol' Crotchy's an Ultra Maroon.
The Blazing Saddle
Well-known member
The only thing Phoney Iommi does independently is masturbate (fingering own snatch). Often…
J
JDs Couch
Well-known member
Yet you only ever insult me and never produce contradictory arguments.
R
Robostyle
Well-known member
What fucking data? Your made up propaganda?
R
Robostyle
Well-known member
I've provided plenty in the past.
Don't act like you are suddenly here in good faith
G
Geo
Well-known member
No he doesn't you ugly, cock breath.
DanTravis62
Moderator
Using "estimates" collated by AI from partisan hack oppo research doesn't count as data unless you're a 13 year old Taylor Swift fan.
He uses the Lincoln project or Cato as a "source" and says "both sides" because hes either stupid or dishonest.
Luckily most people have caught on to how the left infiltrated academia and politicized and ruined entire fields of research.
Using controlled opposition as a data point for your "detractors" is a common propaganda technique; it was used very effectively in the Soviet era
MadAsAHatter
Well-known member
Who's gonna pick the crops and clean the toilets is one of the biggest bullshit arguments on this topic. Throwing in the American's will demand higher wages part makes it even worse.
The underlying message of this argument is migrants aren't worth more than menial jobs at slave wages. It's fine to continue treating it as such as long as grocery prices don't go up.
J
JDs Couch
Well-known member
You're so obsessed with me you made me your sig. Bitchboy
Present your data then Tran.
DanTravis62
Moderator
the crazy part is that this is the argument that the confederate states made for slavery.
History repeating itself
Findthetone1
Well-known member
I will. If you say you're a man, I will argue that you are absolutely not.
G
Geo
Well-known member
Reminds me of that scene in Back To School, when Rodney says "you might as well build them in fantasy land'.
There are two different realities between real life and the academic one.
J
JDs Couch
Well-known member
Is there any credible data that illegal immigrants harm the US economy?
Good question — and it’s one economists have studied for decades. The short answer is:
**There’s very little credible evidence that undocumented immigrants harm the overall U.S. economy.**
But there **are some localized or short-term downsides** that certain workers or regions may experience.
Here’s what the credible data actually shows:
---
## **1. National economic impact: overwhelmingly positive or neutral**
* The **Congressional Budget Office (CBO)** and **National Academies of Sciences (NAS)** both found that **immigration (including undocumented)** adds modestly to overall GDP growth and productivity.
* The **Cato Institute** (a libertarian think tank) and **Brookings Institution** (centrist) both conclude that undocumented immigrants are **a net benefit** or roughly neutral economically, because:
* They fill critical labor shortages.
* They increase demand for goods and services.
* They pay billions in taxes while receiving few public benefits.
Example:
> NAS (2016) found immigration overall raises long-term GDP per capita and has “little to no negative effect on wages of native-born workers.”
---
## **2. Fiscal (tax/benefit) impact: mixed but generally small**
* **Undocumented immigrants pay** an estimated **$11–13 billion** per year in state and local taxes and about **$9–13 billion** annually into Social Security and Medicare (which they can’t claim).
* They **cost** local governments in education and emergency health care, but most credible analyses (NAS, Cato, ITEP) find the **net fiscal impact ranges from slightly negative to slightly positive** — a fraction of one percent of GDP.
* In other words, they don’t “drain” the economy; at worst, they cost a little more locally than they contribute — but they help the national economy overall.
---
## **3. Local labor market effects: small and temporary**
* Some **low-wage U.S. workers without high school diplomas** may see modest wage pressure (1–2% lower in some regions).
* But studies show this effect **fades over time** as industries expand and native workers move into higher-skilled roles.
* Economists like Giovanni Peri (UC Davis) found undocumented immigrants **complement**, not replace, native workers by taking jobs natives are less likely to do (farm, construction, service).
---
## **4. Myths debunked**
* **Myth:** “They take jobs from Americans.”
**Fact:** Unemployment rates don’t rise with higher undocumented populations. Labor markets adjust — undocumented workers often take jobs locals avoid.
* **Myth:** “They’re a burden on welfare.”
**Fact:** They’re **ineligible** for most federal benefits — including Medicaid, SNAP, SSI, TANF, and ACA subsidies.
* **Myth:** “They depress wages across the board.”
**Fact:** Repeated meta-analyses show **no significant impact** on average U.S. wages, and small positive effects for higher-skilled workers.
---
**Bottom line:**
There’s **no credible evidence** that undocumented immigrants hurt the *national* economy.
There *are* limited short-term, localized costs — mostly in low-wage labor markets or school districts — but the broader data shows they are **economically beneficial or neutral overall.**
---
Would you like me to summarize a few key studies (CBO, Cato, NAS, and Harvard) that quantify exactly *how much* undocumented immigrants add or cost the U.S. economy?
Good question — and it’s one economists have studied for decades. The short answer is:
**There’s very little credible evidence that undocumented immigrants harm the overall U.S. economy.**But there **are some localized or short-term downsides** that certain workers or regions may experience.
Here’s what the credible data actually shows:
---
## **1. National economic impact: overwhelmingly positive or neutral**
* The **Congressional Budget Office (CBO)** and **National Academies of Sciences (NAS)** both found that **immigration (including undocumented)** adds modestly to overall GDP growth and productivity.
* The **Cato Institute** (a libertarian think tank) and **Brookings Institution** (centrist) both conclude that undocumented immigrants are **a net benefit** or roughly neutral economically, because:
* They fill critical labor shortages.
* They increase demand for goods and services.
* They pay billions in taxes while receiving few public benefits.
Example:
> NAS (2016) found immigration overall raises long-term GDP per capita and has “little to no negative effect on wages of native-born workers.”
---
## **2. Fiscal (tax/benefit) impact: mixed but generally small**
* **Undocumented immigrants pay** an estimated **$11–13 billion** per year in state and local taxes and about **$9–13 billion** annually into Social Security and Medicare (which they can’t claim).
* They **cost** local governments in education and emergency health care, but most credible analyses (NAS, Cato, ITEP) find the **net fiscal impact ranges from slightly negative to slightly positive** — a fraction of one percent of GDP.
* In other words, they don’t “drain” the economy; at worst, they cost a little more locally than they contribute — but they help the national economy overall.
---
## **3. Local labor market effects: small and temporary**
* Some **low-wage U.S. workers without high school diplomas** may see modest wage pressure (1–2% lower in some regions).
* But studies show this effect **fades over time** as industries expand and native workers move into higher-skilled roles.
* Economists like Giovanni Peri (UC Davis) found undocumented immigrants **complement**, not replace, native workers by taking jobs natives are less likely to do (farm, construction, service).
---
## **4. Myths debunked**
* **Myth:** “They take jobs from Americans.”
**Fact:** Unemployment rates don’t rise with higher undocumented populations. Labor markets adjust — undocumented workers often take jobs locals avoid.
* **Myth:** “They’re a burden on welfare.”
**Fact:** They’re **ineligible** for most federal benefits — including Medicaid, SNAP, SSI, TANF, and ACA subsidies.
* **Myth:** “They depress wages across the board.”
**Fact:** Repeated meta-analyses show **no significant impact** on average U.S. wages, and small positive effects for higher-skilled workers.
---
**Bottom line:**There’s **no credible evidence** that undocumented immigrants hurt the *national* economy.
There *are* limited short-term, localized costs — mostly in low-wage labor markets or school districts — but the broader data shows they are **economically beneficial or neutral overall.**
---
Would you like me to summarize a few key studies (CBO, Cato, NAS, and Harvard) that quantify exactly *how much* undocumented immigrants add or cost the U.S. economy?
Findthetone1
Well-known member
I'll take: "A lying sack of shit" for $500, Dan.
MadAsAHatter
Well-known member
I've said many times, everyone should read this book.
Something I had to read as part of one of my science classes in college way back when.
DanTravis62
Moderator
https://budget.house.gov/imo/media/doc/the_cost_of_illegal_immigration_to_taxpayers.pdf
https://www.fairus.org/issue/public...egal-immigration-united-states-taxpayers-2023
https://www.congress.gov/118/meetin...s/HHRG-118-BU00-Wstate-KirchnerJ-20240508.pdf
https://cosm.aei.org/key-data-on-federal-benefits-paid-to-illegal-immigrant-households/
"The study strives to illustrate themyriad of ways Americans pay for illegal immigration. Our estimate, which is a conservative one, is thatAmericans now pay $150.7 billion dollars annually due to illegal immigration. This figure represents anet cost. In terms of gross expenditures due to illegal immigration, we estimate that Americans pay$182 billion. Approximately $31 billion is received from illegal aliens in taxes, only 17 percent of thecosts they create. "
"“At the start of 2023, the net cost of illegal immigration for the United States – at the federal, state, and local levels – was at least $150.7 billion.”"
“We estimate that 59.4 percent of illegal immigrant households use one or more welfare programs. Compared to the U.S.-born, illegal-headed households use every program at statistically higher rates, except for SSI, TANF, and housing. Illegal immigrants have especially high use of cash (mainly the EITC), food programs, and Medicaid.”
There's a million data sets, but almost ALL of them are incomplete. As in, they don't account for many of the hidden costs associated with illegal immigration - one study will miss remittances, another doesn't count the strain on medicaid/emergency rooms used as GP, one doesn't count the stress on the education system, etc etc.
Findthetone1
Well-known member
How about the economic impact of the rise in insurance rates because the majority of them don't have a drivers license, yet still drive and have been known to plow into entire rows of parked cars because they drive fucking hammered?Is there any credible data that illegal immigrants harm the US economy?
Good question — and it’s one economists have studied for decades. The short answer is:
But there **are some localized or short-term downsides** that certain workers or regions may experience.
Here’s what the credible data actually shows:
---
## **1. National economic impact: overwhelmingly positive or neutral**
* The **Congressional Budget Office (CBO)** and **National Academies of Sciences (NAS)** both found that **immigration (including undocumented)** adds modestly to overall GDP growth and productivity.
* The **Cato Institute** (a libertarian think tank) and **Brookings Institution** (centrist) both conclude that undocumented immigrants are **a net benefit** or roughly neutral economically, because:
* They fill critical labor shortages.
* They increase demand for goods and services.
* They pay billions in taxes while receiving few public benefits.
Example:
> NAS (2016) found immigration overall raises long-term GDP per capita and has “little to no negative effect on wages of native-born workers.”
---
## **2. Fiscal (tax/benefit) impact: mixed but generally small**
* **Undocumented immigrants pay** an estimated **$11–13 billion** per year in state and local taxes and about **$9–13 billion** annually into Social Security and Medicare (which they can’t claim).
* They **cost** local governments in education and emergency health care, but most credible analyses (NAS, Cato, ITEP) find the **net fiscal impact ranges from slightly negative to slightly positive** — a fraction of one percent of GDP.
* In other words, they don’t “drain” the economy; at worst, they cost a little more locally than they contribute — but they help the national economy overall.
---
## **3. Local labor market effects: small and temporary**
* Some **low-wage U.S. workers without high school diplomas** may see modest wage pressure (1–2% lower in some regions).
* But studies show this effect **fades over time** as industries expand and native workers move into higher-skilled roles.
* Economists like Giovanni Peri (UC Davis) found undocumented immigrants **complement**, not replace, native workers by taking jobs natives are less likely to do (farm, construction, service).
---
## **4. Myths debunked**
* **Myth:** “They take jobs from Americans.”
**Fact:** Unemployment rates don’t rise with higher undocumented populations. Labor markets adjust — undocumented workers often take jobs locals avoid.
* **Myth:** “They’re a burden on welfare.”
**Fact:** They’re **ineligible** for most federal benefits — including Medicaid, SNAP, SSI, TANF, and ACA subsidies.
* **Myth:** “They depress wages across the board.”
**Fact:** Repeated meta-analyses show **no significant impact** on average U.S. wages, and small positive effects for higher-skilled workers.
---
There’s **no credible evidence** that undocumented immigrants hurt the *national* economy.
There *are* limited short-term, localized costs — mostly in low-wage labor markets or school districts — but the broader data shows they are **economically beneficial or neutral overall.**
---
Would you like me to summarize a few key studies (CBO, Cato, NAS, and Harvard) that quantify exactly *how much* undocumented immigrants add or cost the U.S. economy?
How about the economic impact of taxing local court systems for broken laws such as above, or even worse, child sex crimes?
How about the economic impact of themseves becoming robbery victims, because they all carry cash and don't use banks because they DO NOT pay taxes?
Last edited:
J
JDs Couch
Well-known member
These are your balanced, objective sources? Lol. The meth in Wenatchee must be realll good.
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