Got my Metroamp back!!

[jaybird]

WOW! That Ralle 2203 pre / 68 plexi "On Fire" clip was amazing! Now I want to build one of those! Sheeeeet!

 

[loudgtr]

Yes Ralph, no 2203 or 2204 I ever played sounded ANYTHING like that. Maybe with an overdrive AND an EQ you could get those gain levels.

I don't know...because there are people who will swear up and down that no stock 'plexi' has enough gain for VH. My '72 super BASS (shared cathode) has more than enough gain for VHII, Fair Warning, etc. That's with no EQ, no OD, no MV, just hot pickups. You can't puss out with your right hand, but if you want more gain out of it, then you don't really want that sound, IMO.

I might be totally off base, but to my knowledge, even though the Ralle amp isn't a common stock config, there's nothing about it that couldn't have come stock on an amp from that era. In other words, there's no extra gain stages, cascading, etc.

Remember Ralph, you posted those Largo links? What did everybody say? OMG there's no gain! OMG it sounds like a single coil! I think everybody wants to believe that Eddie used modded gain to be able to pull off what he did, when the fact is that he attacks the shit out of the strings. As does the other guy I mentioned in this thread...

And as good as Rockstah's amp is....I happen to think his clip sounds great...but there are too many other variables to make the jump and say that since his amp sounds so VH that Eddie himself must have been using a 2203 type of preamp.

Very Good points here! I was one of the guys thinking that about VH's early recorded tones...very clean with light OD. I've always thought the VH sound was not so gainy but rather light on the OD with a "heavy right" hand. The Brown sound always seemed "warm, rich and could clean up real nice with the gituirs volume knob."

That said... I love the modded 2203(or whatever) sound they got going on now

 

[Gainfreak]

Yes Ralph, no 2203 or 2204 I ever played sounded ANYTHING like that. Maybe with an overdrive AND an EQ you could get those gain levels.

I don't know...because there are people who will swear up and down that no stock 'plexi' has enough gain for VH. My '72 super BASS (shared cathode) has more than enough gain for VHII, Fair Warning, etc. That's with no EQ, no OD, no MV, just hot pickups. You can't puss out with your right hand, but if you want more gain out of it, then you don't really want that sound, IMO.

I might be totally off base, but to my knowledge, even though the Ralle amp isn't a common stock config, there's nothing about it that couldn't have come stock on an amp from that era. In other words, there's no extra gain stages, cascading, etc.

Remember Ralph, you posted those Largo links? What did everybody say? OMG there's no gain! OMG it sounds like a single coil! I think everybody wants to believe that Eddie used modded gain to be able to pull off what he did, when the fact is that he attacks the shit out of the strings. As does the other guy I mentioned in this thread...

And as good as Rockstah's amp is....I happen to think his clip sounds great...but there are too many other variables to make the jump and say that since his amp sounds so VH that Eddie himself must have been using a 2203 type of preamp.

I have never played a stock plexi that had the gain that VH had. You can get a similar sound but its always lacking that extra kick in the ass IMHO. My metro that just came back has about as much gain as any good plexi that I have played (that had some drifted values) but it still needs a kick in the ass in order really nail the VH tone.
As far as Ralle and Rockstah, I think that they have come up with a way to get that sound, but I don't necesarilly think that it was the way that Jose did it as there is always more then a few ways to skin a cat.

Since we all share the same love for EVh, I'll tell everyone what I think and I had major help from Mark Cameron. He is about the only one who I think has the answers or is the closet to really knowing the real deal.

I'm pretty sure that VH1 was re-amped (one plexi head into another amp)
and VHII had a Jose master volume mod.

After hearing what Mark Cameron did with the Jose Master volume, I have come to the conclusion that one mod hops up the gain and gets the tone well enough for VH with little modifications to the normal plexi circuit. I would be willing to bet that's what everyone is looking for. That master volume mod is the conclusion that I have come to If i am correct. Rockstah is going to try it and I'll reserve final judgment until I hear what it sounds like lol

Hopefully Mark will chime in !!

 

[Gainfreak]

I really want a tone like that as my starting point and then tweak it from there. I don't even know one VH song all the way through. Heck, I don't even know if I know any of the riffs correctly.

I don't know any VH songs all the way through and I'm pretty sure I don't play any of the riffs right either, but I sure like that TONE!

Steve

 

[ratter]

You said there was a clip of the Jose master somewhere? Do you have a link?

 

[Meathead]

I really want a tone like that as my starting point and then tweak it from there. I don't even know one VH song all the way through. Heck, I don't even know if I know any of the riffs correctly.

I don't know any VH songs all the way through and I'm pretty sure I don't play any of the riffs right either, but I sure like that TONE!

Steve

I posted a clip once of me playing Eruption and James said that I played it wrong...close enough for me, I never learn stuff note for note.




Congrats on the amp Ralph!

 

[Gainfreak]

You said there was a clip of the Jose master somewhere? Do you have a link?

Yup!

Mark recorded it with his lap top speaker so the quality is not good but you can hear the gain and there is little done to the circuit.( NEW 1959RI(only change.... 2.7/.68(v1)...100kFB(8ohm)...and master) brite ch all tone knobs on 6... pre on 8 w/brite cap)


https://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemus ... dID=741160

 

[Anonymous]

You said there was a clip of the Jose master somewhere? Do you have a link?

Yup!

Mark recorded it with his lap top speaker so the quality is not good but you can hear the gain and there is little done to the circuit.( NEW 1959RI(only change.... 2.7/.68(v1)...100kFB(8ohm)...and master) brite ch all tone knobs on 6... pre on 8 w/brite cap)


https://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemus ... dID=741160

Sounds damn gainy to me for an RI with minor mods!

Steve

 

[Gainfreak]

Sounds damn gainy to me for an RI with minor mods!

Steve

I agree Steve!

That's the Jose Master volume mod and it does hop up the gain a lot IMHO. I'm not talking boogie gain but that is the kick in the ass that I am looking for for the VH thing

Jose was so ahead of his time and its good to see Mark kicking ass!!

 

[ratter]

Sounds damn gainy to me for an RI with minor mods!

Steve

I agree Steve!

That's the Jose Master volume mod and it does hop up the gain a lot IMHO. I'm not talking boogie gain but that is the kick in the ass that I am looking for for the VH thing

Jose was so ahead of his time and its good to see Mark kicking ass!!

Ahh thanks, I didn't see the thread that was there about it either. I think it is very cool that Cameron shares what he knows so freely. Lots of guys would milk it for every penny.

Not to be a naysayer, but I'm not sure why you'd go to the trouble of putting the diodes in the circuit rather than just using a boost out front...

 

[Chubtone]

And as good as Rockstah's amp is....I happen to think his clip sounds great...but there are too many other variables to make the jump and say that since his amp sounds so VH that Eddie himself must have been using a 2203 type of preamp.

Yes, but I didn't say that. Ralle said that. When Ralle talks, I listen. Here's Ralle's thread, his clip and his conclusion that THIS is what he thinks VH did:

http://forum.metroamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=13148

 

[Gainfreak]

Ahh thanks, I didn't see the thread that was there about it either. I think it is very cool that Cameron shares what he knows so freely. Lots of guys would milk it for every penny.

Not to be a naysayer, but I'm not sure why you'd go to the trouble of putting the diodes in the circuit rather than just using a boost out front...

I guess it saves you the trouble of using a boost

It also might sound differently! I hope to try it some day when I figure out WTF im doing

 

[ratter]

And as good as Rockstah's amp is....I happen to think his clip sounds great...but there are too many other variables to make the jump and say that since his amp sounds so VH that Eddie himself must have been using a 2203 type of preamp.

Yes, but I didn't say that. Ralle said that. When Ralle talks, I listen. Here's Ralle's thread, his clip and his conclusion that THIS is what he thinks VH did:

http://forum.metroamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=13148

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you said it...I was talking about Ralle saying it. His On Fire clip is totally ridiculous. I can't imagine why anyone would want to get any closer than that. My point was just that, IMO you can take many different paths to get similar results upon playback. Both Ralle and Rockstah recorded their clips at bedroom volume. I'd bet my left nut that Eddie didn't record at bedroom volume.

 

[Shiny_Surface]

I think I like the tone on the RalleP "On Fire" clip better than EVH's

 

[Gainfreak]

I'd bet my left nut that Eddie didn't record at bedroom volume.

I'll bet you are 100% correct!!!

 

[Meathead]

I think I like the tone on the RalleP "On Fire" clip better than EVH's

Eddie's tone could be improved upon IMO...his playing is what I dig, but his tone was a bit thin for me.

 

[Gainfreak]

I posted a clip once of me playing Eruption and James said that I played it wrong...close enough for me, I never learn stuff note for note.




Congrats on the amp Ralph!

ooops!! I missed this before!! Thanks Brother!! What ever happened to that Snit guy?

 

[Chubtone]

And as good as Rockstah's amp is....I happen to think his clip sounds great...but there are too many other variables to make the jump and say that since his amp sounds so VH that Eddie himself must have been using a 2203 type of preamp.

Yes, but I didn't say that. Ralle said that. When Ralle talks, I listen. Here's Ralle's thread, his clip and his conclusion that THIS is what he thinks VH did:

http://forum.metroamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=13148

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you said it...I was talking about Ralle saying it. His On Fire clip is totally ridiculous. I can't imagine why anyone would want to get any closer than that. My point was just that, IMO you can take many different paths to get similar results upon playback. Both Ralle and Rockstah recorded their clips at bedroom volume. I'd bet my left nut that Eddie didn't record at bedroom volume.

Why anyone would need to pursue it farther than Ralle and rackstah have done is beyond me. I agree with the poster above...... i think the Ralle On Fire tone may be even better than Van Halens tone.

The thing that intrigues me the most is the BEDROOM VOLUME thing. That is what interests me the most. At volume, AND IN THE RIGHT HANDS, my Mojave Peacemaker, and bone stock 1970 Super Trem can get me close enough. Not at bedroom volume though. As a guy recording in a home studio, that is what I really am looking for.

 

[Gainfreak]

Why anyone would need to pursue it farther than Ralle and rackstah have done is beyond me. I agree with the poster above...... i think the Ralle On Fire tone may be even better than Van Halens tone.

The thing that intrigues me the most is the BEDROOM VOLUME thing. That is what interests me the most. At volume, AND IN THE RIGHT HANDS, my Mojave Peacemaker, and bone stock 1970 Super Trem can get me close enough. Not at bedroom volume though. As a guy recording in a home studio, that is what I really am looking for.

Dude, you are preaching to the choir. I listen to ralle and marks clips and after reading some of the comments, I'm just sitting there scratching my head. If I can get either of those tones, Im done. i'll leave the bickering to whoever wants to keep searching
FWIW, I am balls close. I think with a few tweaks, Im finally done with my ultimate marshall tone.

 

[Chubtone]

Ralph,
Does your Metro have a master volume? Is it cool and very, very close but not quite there? What specs and trannies did you use?

Thanks