How do you tell your wife you just spent 7000 dollars on monitors?

I think these would be the mix in headphone guys though isn't it? Like Scheps who I mentioned.

i dont know anyone who mixes on headphones. i do know plenty of guys though that still mix on shitty sounding ns10s that spent thousands on their room for their ns10s to sound just as shitty. im not saying they are mixing in a small tiled bathroom but a scientifically built room isnt really necessary either, that said if i had sick genelecs and had a chance to build a room hell yeah i would.
 
You could go down that rabbit hole, sure but there's an alternative:

Sit closer to and lower the volume of the monitors. The further you take this, the more you take the room's characteristics out of the equation.


There's a problem with this approach:

The idea of "perfect" monitors in "perfect" rooms is all about flat responses and minimising unnecessary reflections and room modes, with good reason.

Any non-linearities that force you to deviate from what would otherwise be a "perfect" mix limit the range of rooms it'll sound good in. So, if this dude's making this and that adjustment due to the shortcomings, of which there are many (he's even boasting about it), it'll only sound anywhere-near right in rooms with similar problems. He used a broad brush when describing the average listener's room, but as you'd know, the overall shape, surface material and furniture vary heaps from one person's house to another's.

So, that "good reason" I spoke of comes down to a best-for-most philosophy. That plethora of listening environments is going to deviate from neutrality in countless ways, hence the need to strive for perfect balance in the first place, ensuring that anomalies of these rooms are imposed on an already-perfect product. If said product already has bumps and troughs in its response, they're going to combine with room modes in some environments (double-up) and be cancelled by others. See the problem?

All this is why I suggest what I like to think of as the "sensible" middle ground:
Sit close, lower the volume and you now have the flatness of the monitors combined with just a hint of the room's influence. Being just a hint means that only a "typical" HF ambience will enter the picture, something that will aid in judging reverb levels (easy to overdo, especially with headphones).

HTH



Unfortunately this isn’t true brotha. I thought the same thing about lowering the volume and sitting closer. But it’s debunked and proven untrue unfortunately.

 
Regarding NS10s, there're basically 2 factors historically:

1) They approximated a good, typical home-stereo sound.
2) Peeps knew them very-well, which was aided by the fact that when engineers mixed at different studios they still had the same near fields to mix by and come to know even-better.
 
I had to have my ears measured as part of Menieres testing.

Soundproof booth and ridiculous high-end medical headphones and listening for random tones.
Hear something and give a thumbs up. The tones come in crazy intervals so there's really no cheating.

Here I am thinking I'm doing really well cause of all the years working in audio.
Would have said I had lower end 'golden ears'.

I failed miserably starting around 1.5K with a steady decline with each octave added from thereon.
I f-ing medically qualify for hearing aids for cripes sakes (insurance doesn't cover them and they start at $1,500 each!!!!)

Sucks, but I'm accepting listening to streaming compressed music now without bitching about it.

Enjoy those uber hi-end babies while ya still can - wedlock be damned. :giggle:
 
i dont know anyone who mixes on headphones. i do know plenty of guys though that still mix on shitty sounding ns10s that spent thousands on their room for their ns10s to sound just as shitty. im not saying they are mixing in a small tiled bathroom but a scientifically built room isnt really necessary either, that said if i had sick genelecs and had a chance to build a room hell yeah i would.
Those ns10's go for a bargain nowadays...800$! :p
 
Unfortunately this isn’t true brotha. I thought the same thing about lowering the volume and sitting closer. But it’s debunked and proven untrue unfortunately.



C
I'm with you brother.

I'm a bassist first (first instrument) and am appalled by how the welly is removed these days by distortion.

You can have both, of course, but many seem to overlook this.

Totally, it can be subtle but not the main sound. All the greats cut through.

What's funny is listening to that over processed drum track, it is funny how many layered samples they used for splash and hi hat. Like they layered them over for accents after. But yet in the mix, it kills!
 
Those ns10's go for a bargain nowadays...800$! :p


Yeah that sounds about right, they been steadily going up, the tree made to use them went extinct. I thought about grabbing a pair just to have but I’ve spent years learning my hs5 and sub so I think I’ll just stay with them for a while.
 
Yeah that sounds about right, they been steadily going up, the tree made to use them went extinct. I thought about grabbing a pair just to have but I’ve spent years learning my hs5 and sub so I think I’ll just stay with them for a while.

I'm on the Hs5's as well. Seem decent to me but what do I know..
 
I'm on the Hs5's as well. Seem decent to me but what do I know..

i went with them years ago just based on seeing them everywhere figuring if they are good enough for guys im trying to sound like they gotta be good for me. the sub and if you should use one though is one of the biggest things i see debated in music, ive never mixed without mine so i cant really comment but i will say ive had a few guys come over who were pretty anti-sub ordering one after hearing it. i actually mix with my foot on the thing, i can feel whats going on with the low end as much as i can hear as crazy as that may sound.
 
Unfortunately this isn’t true brotha. I thought the same thing about lowering the volume and sitting closer. But it’s debunked and proven untrue unfortunately.
Acoustics Insider.com. Pecuniary interest.

He ignores the fact that at low-enough levels you perceive nothing of reflections / the room's influence. Think about it. If you want to hear slap back in a room you don't whisper or even talk, you clap your hands.

Unless one's room is lined with mirrors or something, that level I speak of need not be that-low.

IMHO he used "insider techie talk" to bamboozle the listener and massage him into the belief that he'd need one or more of the company's products.
 
Unfortunately this isn’t true brotha. I thought the same thing about lowering the volume and sitting closer. But it’s debunked and proven untrue unfortunately.




That was a really well done video, and he's 1000% correct - except its pronounced "Feck-ner" in the weber fechner effect, lol.

I will say though, that in general, lots of people just starting with mixing are doing it WAY too loud. I generally do a moderate volume for most things, to try and keep my ears fresh for longer, and then turn up loud to pay closer attention to snare transients, eqing guitars, and verbs and stuff like that.
 
Dr. Gonzo her: "As your attorney and my silent partner, I advise you to continue to allow these transactions."
 
...sit her down in front of them and have her truly *listen* :D

Ya gotta know the movie. :giggle:

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