Mak4 gut shots

[mortega76]

Wow... thanks for the quick response... how about just smaller knobs so that all the channels can be accessed from the front?

Quick question... I was under the impression that you needed a tube power amp (like the VHT 2/90/2) to give it that tube power amp saturation... I currently have the Axe-fx into a PV1500 power amp... could I use a SS power amp and get the "full effect" of the Mak4?

I don't know... I think I'm old... I hate little knobs and little pots.... I like it now that it so easy, visible, and intuitive to dial in.
I figured most guys playing racks are probably my age.... almost 40. When you get this old the last thing you need is to squint at some knobs. It is not out of the question though, I'm really open to what people want.

Dude, you have a Axe-fx..... no need for a Mak4. But, yes, a tube poweramp is great.

Well... I demo'd the Mak4 at mhenson42's house with the 2/90/2 and I couldn't get my Axe-fx/PV1500 in the same league as the Dorado channel... the Mak4 sounded awesome through the 2/90/2 but when we did it through his SLA2 it fizzed and thinned out (if I remember correctly)...

 

[Ventura]

Wow... thanks for the quick response... how about just smaller knobs so that all the channels can be accessed from the front?

Quick question... I was under the impression that you needed a tube power amp (like the VHT 2/90/2) to give it that tube power amp saturation... I currently have the Axe-fx into a PV1500 power amp... could I use a SS power amp and get the "full effect" of the Mak4?

I don't know... I think I'm old... I hate little knobs and little pots.... I like it now that it so easy, visible, and intuitive to dial in.
I figured most guys playing racks are probably my age.... almost 40. When you get this old the last thing you need is to squint at some knobs. It is not out of the question though, I'm really open to what people want.

Dude, you have a Axe-fx..... no need for a Mak4. But, yes, a tube poweramp is great.

Well... I demo'd the Mak4 at mhenson42's house with the 2/90/2 and I couldn't get my Axe-fx/PV1500 in the same league as the Dorado channel... the Mak4 sounded awesome through the 2/90/2 but when we did it through his SLA2 it fizzed and thinned out (if I remember correctly)...

Yes as well. Andrew stated the Makoplex will benefit from an EL34 based poweramp, the Dorado from a KT88 based poweramp. In trading the two off to one another, the detriment to the Makoplex channel whilst employing a KT88 powersection, was less than the effect of EL34's on the Dorado channel. Another reason I went with the 2/90/2. My Dorado channel is soooooo fierce!!! It's ridiculous...!!

V./Mo

 

[mortega76]

Wow... thanks for the quick response... how about just smaller knobs so that all the channels can be accessed from the front?

Quick question... I was under the impression that you needed a tube power amp (like the VHT 2/90/2) to give it that tube power amp saturation... I currently have the Axe-fx into a PV1500 power amp... could I use a SS power amp and get the "full effect" of the Mak4?

I don't know... I think I'm old... I hate little knobs and little pots.... I like it now that it so easy, visible, and intuitive to dial in.
I figured most guys playing racks are probably my age.... almost 40. When you get this old the last thing you need is to squint at some knobs. It is not out of the question though, I'm really open to what people want.

Dude, you have a Axe-fx..... no need for a Mak4. But, yes, a tube poweramp is great.

Well... I demo'd the Mak4 at mhenson42's house with the 2/90/2 and I couldn't get my Axe-fx/PV1500 in the same league as the Dorado channel... the Mak4 sounded awesome through the 2/90/2 but when we did it through his SLA2 it fizzed and thinned out (if I remember correctly)...

Yes as well. Andrew stated the Makoplex will benefit from an EL34 based poweramp, the Dorado from a KT88 based poweramp. In trading the two off to one another, the detriment to the Makoplex channel whilst employing a KT88 powersection, was less than the effect of EL34's on the Dorado channel. Another reason I went with the 2/90/2. My Dorado channel is soooooo fierce!!! It's ridiculous...!!

V./Mo

Thanks for chiming in... +1 on the Dorado... that sucker rips with the 2/90/2, how would it compare with a SS power amp?

 

[Ventura]

Wow... thanks for the quick response... how about just smaller knobs so that all the channels can be accessed from the front?

Quick question... I was under the impression that you needed a tube power amp (like the VHT 2/90/2) to give it that tube power amp saturation... I currently have the Axe-fx into a PV1500 power amp... could I use a SS power amp and get the "full effect" of the Mak4?

I don't know... I think I'm old... I hate little knobs and little pots.... I like it now that it so easy, visible, and intuitive to dial in.
I figured most guys playing racks are probably my age.... almost 40. When you get this old the last thing you need is to squint at some knobs. It is not out of the question though, I'm really open to what people want.

Dude, you have a Axe-fx..... no need for a Mak4. But, yes, a tube poweramp is great.

Well... I demo'd the Mak4 at mhenson42's house with the 2/90/2 and I couldn't get my Axe-fx/PV1500 in the same league as the Dorado channel... the Mak4 sounded awesome through the 2/90/2 but when we did it through his SLA2 it fizzed and thinned out (if I remember correctly)...

Yes as well. Andrew stated the Makoplex will benefit from an EL34 based poweramp, the Dorado from a KT88 based poweramp. In trading the two off to one another, the detriment to the Makoplex channel whilst employing a KT88 powersection, was less than the effect of EL34's on the Dorado channel. Another reason I went with the 2/90/2. My Dorado channel is soooooo fierce!!! It's ridiculous...!!

V./Mo

Thanks for chiming in... +1 on the Dorado... that sucker rips with the 2/90/2, how would it compare with a SS power amp?

Seriously no idea... And I don't know anyone on this forum who'd have access to that answer first hand. Fryette was the recommendation a la Andrew, and the KT88's and the Dorado are serious biz. I can't imagine what this thing would sound like outside of my little Private Fryette Club

V.

 

[Bevosss]

Quick question... I was under the impression that you needed a tube power amp (like the VHT 2/90/2) to give it that tube power amp saturation... I currently have the Axe-fx into a PV1500 power amp... could I use a SS power amp and get the "full effect" of the Mak4?....(snip)
Thanks for chiming in... +1 on the Dorado... that sucker rips with the 2/90/2, how would it compare with a SS power amp?

I'll be able to tell you once mine arrives, I have a large-iron Crown K2 which kicks serious solid-state arse, I use it for reamping speaker-iso signals to guitar/bass cabs sometimes, sounds like it's plugged in still from the head! Very transparent and respects the bottom end.

I can't imagine it'll sound very good solid state, it's only a preamp and will need that power tube eq curve and give...fastedponycar's clips sounded their best through the Titan KT-88 section, THAT is what sold me on it.

Btw Andrew recommends 6550 tubes as well as KT-88, that's what ships in the Dorado heads...EL34/6L6 aren't really suited as V said, as it doesn't need saturation.

RE the 4 unit size: yes it is huge, but it'll be easy to adjust on stage! Now, if he did a midi-programmable 1 unit preamp with Caswell-type motorized knobs, that might be very tempting also.

Hey Andrew, I'm not 4 days into the future! ...just kidding mate, Monday will be fine, actually whenever it's tested and ready, don't rush it! It's a long way shipping back to you from here in Oz...

 

[threadkiller]

Btw Andrew recommends 6550 tubes as well as KT-88, that's what ships in the Dorado heads...EL34/6L6 aren't really suited as V said, as it doesn't need saturation.

I'll second this with my bried time with the Mak4. I have an EL 34 based 2502. I haven't spent much time on the dorado yet but to me I was getting better heavy tones with my triaxis.

However, the Makoplex frickin' kills with this arrangement. I am not a metal player anyway so don't know that I'll be on the dorado channel that much. Crunch and makoplex are absolute monsters with the EL34 power section, so pick your poison.

 

[Ventura]

FWIW, I'm putting together some more clips this weekend and will post 'em ASAP.

Peace,
V.

 

[technomancer]

Wow... thanks for the quick response... how about just smaller knobs so that all the channels can be accessed from the front?

Quick question... I was under the impression that you needed a tube power amp (like the VHT 2/90/2) to give it that tube power amp saturation... I currently have the Axe-fx into a PV1500 power amp... could I use a SS power amp and get the "full effect" of the Mak4?

I don't know... I think I'm old... I hate little knobs and little pots.... I like it now that it so easy, visible, and intuitive to dial in.
I figured most guys playing racks are probably my age.... almost 40. When you get this old the last thing you need is to squint at some knobs. It is not out of the question though, I'm really open to what people want.

Dude, you have a Axe-fx..... no need for a Mak4. But, yes, a tube poweramp is great.

I'm 39 and would much prefer it in a 2U with smaller pots/knobs

 

[Bevosss]

I did have one return on the Mak4 preamp. It was freakishly noisy..... I missed something when I soldered it.

That's still a majorly good record. Even my Diezel had a manufacturing error, wrong tolerance caps in the head that shorted it out within a year...plus the 'lifetime warranty' didn't apply apparently because I bought it new from the states, unknowingly right before we got an Australian distributor, so I ended up paying around $500 myself to insure it, freight it to the new distributor in Perth, get it fixed and rebiased etc. Plus, when I bought it, it came with different tubes then what I ordered! I also remember emails that didn't get replied, or were very short. I have a very long memory for stuff like this...thankfully, it's been dead reliable ever since, and should make a nice power amp for my MAK4.

So you sir, are definitely at the top level of quality control and customer service to me! Hopefully that lifetime warranty applies worldwide, although I'm counting on never needing to use it.

Hey, maybe you should have your own forum here Andrew? It would at least keep all the relevant threads together on Rig-talk regarding Mako products...just a thought.

 

[Ventura]

I did have one return on the Mak4 preamp. It was freakishly noisy..... I missed something when I soldered it.

That's still a majorly good record. Even my Diezel had a manufacturing error, wrong tolerance caps in the head that shorted it out within a year...plus the 'lifetime warranty' didn't apply apparently because I bought it new from the states, unknowingly right before we got an Australian distributor, so I ended up paying around $500 myself to insure it, freight it to the new distributor in Perth, get it fixed and rebiased etc. Plus, when I bought it, it came with different tubes then what I ordered! I also remember emails that didn't get replied, or were very short. I have a very long memory for stuff like this...thankfully, it's been dead reliable ever since, and should make a nice power amp for my MAK4.

So you sir, are definitely at the top level of quality control and customer service to me! Hopefully that lifetime warranty applies worldwide, although I'm counting on never needing to use it.

Hey, maybe you should have your own forum here Andrew? It would at least keep all the relevant threads together on Rig-talk regarding Mako products...just a thought.

Careful with this... I couldn't get the Diezel OUT of the tone by using my VH4S as a powersection - can't explain it - it is what it is - but my Mak4 opened right the f*ck up once it got on its own with the Fryette double decker (poweramp and cab)!! Totally different sounding and by no means in a bad way... Trying to mic it this evening has me pissed off though, I'm not QUITE ready to pull out the 57's and the NT1000 just yet - was hoping I could do it with my H4n, but it's not tracking that great - not the amp/cab/preamp's problem, it's the old "placement" problem... FAAAK!!!

WHATEVER, killer preamp. I love this thing LOUD - it's got colors man, major colors when it's pumping!!!

V.

 

[Bevosss]

Careful with this... I couldn't get the Diezel OUT of the tone by using my VH4S as a powersection - can't explain it - it is what it is - but my Mak4 opened right the f*ck up once it got on its own with the Fryette double decker (poweramp and cab)!! Totally different sounding and by no means in a bad way...

We'll see...I'd wager the Herbert with 2 more tubes and a huge transformer may sound different to your VH4, certainly shouldn't be anywhere near saturation point with it's massive headroom and bottom end extension, she's a loud bitch! And should be even louder and more percussive once I put the 6550s in I have waiting, (I just want to hear the MAK4 first with EL34Bs before I change them). I dunno, so far the Herbert has come through as the ultimate mono power amp for me, I don't have a Fryette to compare though.

Your point noted and under consideration V, but for the record Erock here is running his MAK4 through his Herbert, and is incredibly impressed with the combo. Did you compare just changing the power amps through your new cab? That's the only fair test.

I'm hoping when the Mako stereo poweramps come out they will be bridgable to mono, there's really something to be said for the sound of huge headroom imo.

 

[titanamps]

i'll weigh in with my experience with SS vs tube power amp with one of these...

i've had a mosvalve power amp for a while...a 962, i think? i picked it up on the cheap a while back. when i got the mak4, i played it through the mosvalve. it sounded ok, but didn't really knock my socks off. i was disappointed, really.

then, i ran it into the FX loop return of a tube amp and it was immediately clear that the tube amp was better.

at this point, i'm looking at either picking up a 2/90/2 or building a power amp for myself. then, once i figure out how to make the mak4 switch my amp, i'll be running a stereo rig

 

[Ventura]

Careful with this... I couldn't get the Diezel OUT of the tone by using my VH4S as a powersection - can't explain it - it is what it is - but my Mak4 opened right the f*ck up once it got on its own with the Fryette double decker (poweramp and cab)!! Totally different sounding and by no means in a bad way...

We'll see...I'd wager the Herbert with 2 more tubes and a huge transformer may sound different to your VH4, certainly shouldn't be anywhere near saturation point with it's massive headroom and bottom end extension, she's a loud bitch! And should be even louder and more percussive once I put the 6550s in I have waiting, (I just want to hear the MAK4 first with EL34Bs before I change them). I dunno, so far the Herbert has come through as the ultimate mono power amp for me, I don't have a Fryette to compare though.

Your point noted and under consideration V, but for the record Erock here is running his MAK4 through his Herbert, and is incredibly impressed with the combo. Did you compare just changing the power amps through your new cab? That's the only fair test.

I'm hoping when the Mako stereo poweramps come out they will be bridgable to mono, there's really something to be said for the sound of huge headroom imo.

All duly noted, and don't get me wrong, it sounded pretty damn sweet off the back of my VH4S, but I am glad I have the Fryette to do its thing now... And further to that, I simply don't wanna mess with my VH4S - she's one of my favorites, and seriously doesn't need any adding or subtracting. I'll happily leave the 6550's in there for now, and hammer that rig when I need my Diezel fill. I guess at the end of the day, I just wanted the Mak4 to have it's own place and voice, know what I mean??

It was by no means to be a comparo of the Mak4 and the Diezel, it just seemed to me, it sounded a lot more like a Diezel when it was matched to the powersection of the V than it does now.

Peace,
V.

 

[Bevosss]

It was by no means to be a comparo of the Mak4 and the Diezel, it just seemed to me, it sounded a lot more like a Diezel when it was matched to the powersection of the V than it does now.

All good V, I'm all for comparisons to be sure. I would love you to do a recorded test where the ONLY variable was the power amps, Mako/cab and mic position exactly the same etc,and they were pretty much matched regarding depth and presence and level. I certainly haven't crossed out getting a Fryette 2:90:2, but I'll need to see what Andrew has up his sleeve first...maybe his power amps will rule!

Of course I've always wondered about the KT-88 sound, it kills on bass, I have a 300W Trace Elliot V6 Head here with 6 of them in it (it used to belong to Dave Bronze, Eric Clapton's old bass player from the 90s)...I may just get that line-in put in so I can see what the buzz is all about.

Fwiw I have done recording tests with the Diezel preamp through my Recto poweramp with JJ EL-34s (set to Modern/Bold/SS), and they actually sound very similar...more bottom end and thrust and size with the Diezel as expected with it's depth control, but a little more midrange grind to the Recto...they stack well together on a track. But yeah, very very similar, probably because the Herbert is running EL34Bs.

 

[philnz]

I'm currently waiting on a MAK4 & got a VHT 2/50/2.
For the most part I'm pretty much an EL34 guy & will probably live on the crunch & makoplex channels the most.

This talk of power sections for makoplex/dorado channels is quite interesting tho.
I had a thought of somehow running the crunch/makoplex channels with the 2/50/2 & using my UL's power section for clean/dorado.
Would this be hard to do
I'm pretty much a plug & play guy but this might be a cool thing to try if I can figure it out.

I think Andrews Dorado dedicated poweramp with 2/50/2 for the other stuff would kill

All this sounds like a midi set up to change things on the fly, hopefully not overly complicated

 

[HeimBrent]

Man, that Mak4 would be awesome if it was in a 2U rack... and now looking at the innards... it looks like it could be done! Plenty of space.

Sure it could be done.

I'm going to make it 2U...... 2 chans on the front and 2 on the back....this would be pure awesome..... guitarists need more exercise. Put down your shake weights and turn some knobs on the back of your rack!

Just looing at it without any measuring... It should be possible to keep the spacing between the knobs more or less the same and still get two channels per row? I would think making it a 2U instead of 4U would make it more interesting to alot of folks.

 

[Bevosss]

Just looing at it without any measuring... It should be possible to keep the spacing between the knobs more or less the same and still get two channels per row? I would think making it a 2U instead of 4U would make it more interesting to alot of folks.

Heh, it DOES look like it would fit like that...certainly would fit more easily into a suitcase like that for flying gigs.

Of course, if that happens, the original 'large block' Mak4s will be claimed to be sonically superior to the later versions! If not here then TGP...

 

[Ventura]

I'm currently waiting on a MAK4 & got a VHT 2/50/2.
For the most part I'm pretty much an EL34 guy & will probably live on the crunch & makoplex channels the most.

I had a thought of somehow running the crunch/makoplex channels with the 2/50/2 & using my UL's power section for clean/dorado.
Would this be hard to do
I'm pretty much a plug & play guy but this might be a cool thing to try if I can figure it out.

All this sounds like a midi set up to change things on the fly, hopefully not overly complicated

Don't complicate things...

Bottom line is that the Plex channel is tuned a bit more to EL34's, and the Dorado is tuned more to 6550's or KT88's. At the end of the day, it has been clearly stated by Andrew that regardless of what tubes are in your powersection, the MAK4 doesn't like saturation of ANY sort. So where typically we'd feel the need to incorporate the color of the tubes being used in the powersection, it becomes quite secondary in the case of the MAK4 - tubes do offer color without saturation, but not nearly the same amount as when they're truly being pushed hard. MAK4 likes gobs of headroom, not a reliance on the power section being pushed.

@bevoss, I recorded a number of clips last night - I've got the placement of the H4n nicely dialed in now, and feel as though I'm getting a good representation of this amps tone and channel flavors. I'll cut some more tonight, and tomorrow - time allowing - run it through the Diezel power section with everything else remaining equal. My only thoughts on this not being an option are that I'm really diggin' the sounds I'm getting right now and don't wanna mess with it

Clips will be edited and posted once I'm happy with everything

Peace,
V.

 

[bubbastain]

Stick a SM57 in front of the speaker and record ONE track and leave it raw. That's a good representation of what the amp sounds like. All that other crap(double tracking, quad tracking, mic placement, eq, compression ect) is a representation of what the amp is capable of in a studio.

 

[steve_k]

Stomach cramps starting.......