Modellers vs loud Tube amps

[Smash]

I love modelling technology and think it is convenient as fuck for recording and silent playing.

I love tube amps for the in your face firebreathing punchy tone and the sheer fight of controlling one at volume.

I was talking with an amp maker about this earlier, and he said something to the effect of, he is trying to make his amp louder and more aggressive. I fucking love that mentality.

Instead i see other amp builders trying to placate the modelling crowd with lighter, quieter amps competing with modellers.

Modellers are useful as fuck and convenient. There is nothing wrong with that.

Tube amps are loud and rude and manly and there is nothing wrong with that.

I think we should let both shine and stop trying to meet in the middle

 

[DanTravis62]

I agree completely. They are different tools for different things.

Modelers only sound great for live performance if you have fantastic sound reinforcement; which, unless you're metallica or something, you probably arent going to get when you and your boomer friends cover "La Grange" at the county fair this year.

And even then, many think metallica doesn't sound good now - with all that excellent sound equipment, techs, and engineers - compared to how they used to sound with real amps.

Modelers are absolutely unbeatable, however, for relatively low volume home practice, or convenience when recording. I can spend days getting a killer miced up amp tone for recording, then profile it, and bring it back whenever I want. In fact, I just did that today. There's no universe in which modellers aren't better, cheaper, and more convenient for recording, practice, and any situation where you aren't playing at high volumes with a band.

 

[thegame]

Loud tube amps are like nude art modelers, in that nothing is more exposing than that, warts and all.

 

[DanTravis62]

Loud tube amps are like nude art modelers, in that nothing is more exposing than that, warts and all.

it's funny because you can see a huge generational divide with younger players who didn't learn how to play with loud tube amps - who were learning on modelers or software plugins. They all bitchpick, have no dynamics in their playing, and no fire when they play, even live with a band.

it's a really weird thing, but I guarantee it is a thing

like i can play a riff, then ask them to play the same riff, and it sounds bland simply because of the lack of right hand dynamics and control

 

[Smash]

I agree completely. They are different tools for different things.

Modelers only sound great for live performance if you have fantastic sound reinforcement; which, unless you're metallica or something, you probably arent going to get when you and your boomer friends cover "La Grange" at the county fair this year.

And even then, many think metallica doesn't sound good now - with all that excellent sound equipment, techs, and engineers - compared to how they used to sound with real amps.

Modelers are absolutely unbeatable, however, for relatively low volume home practice, or convenience when recording. I can spend days getting a killer miced up amp tone for recording, then profile it, and bring it back whenever I want. In fact, I just did that today. There's no universe in which modellers aren't better, cheaper, and more convenient for recording, practice, and any situation where you aren't playing at high volumes with a band.

I have heard modellers sound great live. But they are run through front of house as are the tube amps.
I think the thing that people don't understand is the playing of a modeller vs a tube amp as the real disconnect. The feel of a tube amp is unbeatable.

And maybe a modeller is the same with a tube power amp and real cab. I cannot say as I have no experience with it. Would love to try for sure.

 

[glpg80]

100%

Big iron is what’s inspiring. Big glass has a lot of potential if people know what they’re doing with it. I don’t think people realize how pulverizing EL34s can get let alone 6550s or KT88s.

The dynamics of an amp turned up don’t have an explicit knob to turn to show someone who’s never experienced it. Either you get it or you don’t. As someone who grew up gigging a 5150 II my whole life I’m thankful to understand how important that is to people who want it and seek it.

 

[romanianreaper]

It is not just a tube amp thing. Transistor amps like my Orange amps sound great at shows and have that immediate feel and response. I tried doing the FRFR thing and just didn't grab me. When I used modelling, I had to use a power amp and cab.

 

[Smash]

It is not just a tube amp thing. Transistor amps like my Orange amps sound great at shows and have that immediate feel and response. I tried doing the FRFR thing and just didn't grab me. When I used modelling, I had to use a power amp and cab.

Yes. I love solid state amps also. They are fun as hell

 

[Eazy-ESP]

it's funny because you can see a huge generational divide with younger players who didn't learn how to play with loud tube amps - who were learning on modelers or software plugins. They all bitchpick, have no dynamics in their playing, and no fire when they play, even live with a band.

it's a really weird thing, but I guarantee it is a thing

like i can play a riff, then ask them to play the same riff, and it sounds bland simply because of the lack of right hand dynamics and control

You forgot lack of testosterone

 

[CoreyW]

Think you need an option for modeler straight to FOH.

Amps are cool, but when you look at the entire picture, are they worth the hassle when the audience cant tell the difference.

I have not played out in years, but I do jam a little at friends places, and as long as there is a PA to hook into, ill just take my FM3, if people come to my place ill just run with my Axe fx.

 

[DanTravis62]

You forgot lack of testosterone

I mean, that's an entirely different but definitely related generational problem

 

[mnemonic]

I tried to do the modeler with cab thing for a while, I was never satisfied for more than about a day, then the endless tweaking started. I just play tube amps now, hardly ever touch any settings. Less versatile but better sound and feel to me.

I came up on modelers, used a vox valetronix combo in high school, pod XT in college, and axe FX II after that. I never tried to make a tube amp work since it just wouldn’t have fit in my living situation. Once I got a house with a spare room is when I tried modeler and cab, but not long after that I just bought a recto and that blew away anything I ever got out of the axe FX II.

Tube amps do have a better feel and sound for me but each one has its own ‘core sound’ which if you don’t like, you won’t like the amp. At some point I bought a jet city jca50 very cheap and while the crunch channel had some great sounds, I couldn’t get a high gain aggressive metal tone that would beat the axe FX II (too smooth and saturated). Eventually I got into pedal building then amp modding so I eventually just modded it into something I like, now it beats my old axe FX patches easy.

 

[geetarmikey]

I saw a Whitesnake tribute band earlier this year and one guitarist had a brilliant Sykes-esque tone that really cut through; turns out it was a smaller Helix while the other guitarist had an AxeFX 3 which sounded very plain and not loud enough so I guess it's how you set them up.

 

[MadAsAHatter]

Amps are cool, but when you look at the entire picture, are they worth the hassle when the audience cant tell the difference.

100% Yes real amps are worth the hassle.

 

[cardinal]

I play a lot more frequently with a profiler thing than I do with tube amps. I have a mental block turning on a tube amp just to noodle for 15 or 30 minutes, but flipping on a Nano Cortex for that is no problem.

But when I can dedicate more time to really playing, a tube amp is just somehow more fun.

 

[roodboy]

There is nothing like a nmv marshall cranked thru a 4x12 cab.
For me gigging days are over and idk where you can even do that live anymore
So its been fractal through a pair of clrs for many years now and it sounds great.

 

[inyarak74]

it's funny because you can see a huge generational divide with younger players who didn't learn how to play with loud tube amps - who were learning on modelers or software plugins. They all bitchpick, have no dynamics in their playing, and no fire when they play, even live with a band.

it's a really weird thing, but I guarantee it is a thing

like i can play a riff, then ask them to play the same riff, and it sounds bland simply because of the lack of right hand dynamics and control

Big time !

 

[DISTORT6]

 

[cobrahead1030]

I’m glad we have both.

Nearly half my amp collection is 25w or less these days, which is great for every day home playing.

The rest are 50-100w, because they’re stupid & glorious.

 

[FuriousMopar1968]

I’m glad we have both.

Nearly half my amp collection is 25w or less these days, which is great for every day home playing.

The rest are 50-100w, because they’re stupid & glorious.

High powered amps are so fun to play with in a live setting haha, a good attenuator makes them more useable and allows you to really open one up and still exist in the same building as it.