Screw all modern high gain fancy fairy dust boutique Amps...

[ChuggNorris]

Yeah. One guy that also surprised me with tone from good amps was that yeshuda guy. He knew how to perfectly dial a good amp to sound like shit

Shit was the worst.
Another case of deep pockets meets shallow skillset. Then theres people like that who bag on amps and say they need this, need that, flubby this, boost that.... whole time its the amp who just needs a new player

 

[Simon Dorn]

I really love your tone there, but I want to show you what I was talking about with taking a marshall circuit, and highlighting the uppermid content, but still making it metal. This is a clip i did tonight. No post eq (I don't even know how to do some shit like that) and a phone camera. Please excuse my shitty playing.

Thanks for taking the time. You should really try out a 2203. It's a high-mid amp by default. The sound in our clip is relatively dark compared to a 2203.
Yesterday i raised the Presence to 8, then to 10 and the Bass to 10 and left middle on 5 and treble on 7.
That's very nasty.
I bought my first Plexi in the very early 90's. I already had a Plexi Clone before. I play 2203s since 2010. I know them Amps a little.
I have clips with many different settings and boosts on my channel.
Here's a scooped sound with presence on 8, bass on 10, mids on 0 and treble on 10.
Very bright. Mic placement matters too. Some Plugins on the Master in the Daw to make it loud and competitive.

 

[S̷͖͑m̵͎͂á̵̺s̸͚̈́h̴̬̑]

Thanks for taking the time. You should really try out a 2203. It's a high-mid amp by default. The sound in our clip is relatively dark compared to a 2203.
Yesterday i raised the Presence to 8, then to 10 and the Bass to 10 and left middle on 5 and treble on 7.
That's very nasty.
I bought my first Plexi in the very early 90's. I already had a Plexi Clone before. I play 2203s since 2010. I know them Amps a little.
I have clips with many different settings and boosts on my channel.
Here's a scooped sound with presence on 8, bass on 10, mids on 0 and treble on 10.
Very bright. Mic placement matters too. Some Plugins on the Master in the Daw to make it loud and competitive.

Yes. But i was able to dial in the darkness with subtractive eq at treble, allowing the presence to stay high which is what keeps the palm mutes bouncy and tight.
I am not saying apples to apples, because like you say, I am not on a stock jcm. I am just saying when you lower the presence, you take away the bite and the palm mutes become soft and sludgy. But i would need to play your amp at volume to see what i could do. And i think i would be frustrated also because of the limitations of the stock circuit. The eq is a weakness of a jcm.

 

[DanTravis62]

Yes. But i was able to dial in the darkness with subtractive eq at treble, allowing the presence to stay high which is what keeps the palm mutes bouncy and tight.
I am not saying apples to apples, because like you say, I am not on a stock jcm. I am just saying when you lower the presence, you take away the bite and the palm mutes become soft and sludgy. But i would need to play your amp at volume to see what i could do. And i think i would be frustrated also because of the limitations of the stock circuit. The eq is a weakness of a jcm.

The lack of gain is also the weakness of the 2203 circuit, which is why you need to boost it to all holy kingdom come to even get it into extreme metal territory... and then you do boost it, and introduce other issues like lack of dynamics and clarity

Larry is correct in that his amps 100% do not need a boost or gate - in fact, the gain sounds sound much worse with a boost in front. I have demonstrated it on recordings i've posted here before.

 

[rsm]

 

[no.mids.brando]

i got to mess around on a Friedman Dirty Shirley yesterday at a music store. i was going straight in so def not enough gain to get into metal but i really liked how it was voiced. kinda reminded me of my mark III but even more dynamic. i guess my dream amp would be something like this x50. more saturation while still feeling alive. wish i could go somewhere to try Larry, Wizard, Fryette and any other apps with boutique sauce…

 

[no.mids.brando]

another dirty shirley clip here:

 

[alund]

i got to mess around on a Friedman Dirty Shirley yesterday at a music store. i was going straight in so def not enough gain to get into metal but i really liked how it was voiced. kinda reminded me of my mark III but even more dynamic. i guess my dream amp would be something like this x50. more saturation while still feeling alive. wish i could go somewhere to try Larry, Wizard, Fryette and any other apps with boutique sauce…

Where are you located ?

 

[no.mids.brando]

Where are you located ?

i’m in Florida, that shop is Walt Grace Vintage in Miami

also amp is a Twin Shirley*, not dirty

 

[alund]

i’m in Florida, that shop is Walt Grace Vintage in Miami

also amp is a Twin Shirley*, not dirty

Might be some folks down there with your request. I’m a bit far of a drive.

 

[DanTravis62]

Might be some folks down there with your request. I’m a bit far of a drive.

The DS circuit i think is the best thing Friedman has ever done, i'm sure theres some Florida Man© around here who might wanna checkit out

View attachment 432545

That's crazy talk, over a Hagen? Those things are amazing. Stay retarded, TGP

 

[thegame]

Larry is correct in that his amps 100% do not need a boost or gate - in fact, the gain sounds sound much worse with a boost in front. I have demonstrated it on recordings i've posted here before.

I used to think that until I tried a few good KLON types with it. Even still, I use those for just a touch of compression, not so much a boost per se as I generally keep both the pedal’s output level and drive at 9 o’clock and the amp gain at noon. This setup facilitates single note technical riffing like Necrophagist and Revocation

 

[DanTravis62]

I used to think that until I tried a few good KLON types with it. Even still, I use those for just a touch of compression, not so much a boost per se as I generally keep both the pedal’s output level and drive at 9 o’clock and the amp gain at noon. This setup facilitates single note technical riffing like Necrophagist and Revocation

I agree that it can add compression, which might be helpful to some players (especially live) - but at least with my right hand, it was wildly unnecessary the vast majority of the time - I definitely agree that klones are generally the best for the purpose, though, if you're dead set on doing it.

But I 100% disagree that it sounds any better, especially under a microphone - it might make it more compressed or more gainy, but honestly it takes away from what makes a larry's gain sound so great and magical in the first place and makes it more "ordinary" IMO

The whole idea (at least for me) is that the larry exposes your technique and forces you to straighten out your right hand and rely on that for the compression. Once that's sorted, you're rewarded with the tightest tracking, most usable high gain that exists on planet earth.

 

[S̷͖͑m̵͎͂á̵̺s̸͚̈́h̴̬̑]

I agree that it can add compression, which might be helpful to some players (especially live) - but at least with my right hand, it was wildly unnecessary the vast majority of the time - I definitely agree that klones are generally the best for the purpose, though, if you're dead set on doing it.

But I 100% disagree that it sounds any better, especially under a microphone - it might make it more compressed or more gainy, but honestly it takes away from what makes a larry's gain sound so great and magical in the first place and makes it more "ordinary" IMO

The whole idea (at least for me) is that the larry exposes your technique and forces you to straighten out your right hand and rely on that for the compression. Once that's sorted, you're rewarded with the tightest tracking, most usable high gain that exists on planet earth.

I agree with a lot of this. When you have an amp that is made right, a boost becomes only necessary in weird situations.

Take my MGL. I never use a boost on it when I take it somewhere, or if I were playing live. The only reason I use a boost at home is because my room is too small, so I have to do some weird shit to compensate for not being able to let it breathe fully. I honestly need to buy a bigger house so that I can have a jam room like @RedB4Black hmmmm.....Or he could switch houses with me....

Edit: Matt, you can leave your amps and cabs when we make the switch. But you take that goddamned motor oil you call beer.

 

[DanTravis62]

I agree with a lot of this. When you have an amp that is made right, a boost becomes only necessary in weird situations.

Take my MGL. I never use a boost on it when I take it somewhere, or if I were playing live. The only reason I use a boost at home is because my room is too small, so I have to do some weird shit to compensate for not being able to let it breathe fully. I honestly need to buy a bigger house so that I can have a jam room like @RedB4Black hmmmm.....Or he could switch houses with me....

Edit: Matt, you can leave your amps and cabs when we make the switch. But you take that goddamned motor oil you call beer.

it's interesting because a lot of the "problems" that we as guitarists "solve" with pedals are very specific to playing at home without being at actual stage volume.

Once an amp is opened up, you have a ton more sustain and compression with that volume. It conversely forces you to play more cleanly, but honestly that's a good thing.

One of the reasons I hate a lot of MoDeRn MeTaL guitarists is that you can tell they learned and practiced all at low volumes.

Have you ever seen the "youtubers play a plexi on 10 at thomann" videos?

Watching youtubers struggle with a real amp at real volumes explains a ton about their shitty gear opinions.

 

[S̷͖͑m̵͎͂á̵̺s̸͚̈́h̴̬̑]

it's interesting because a lot of the "problems" that we as guitarists "solve" with pedals are very specific to playing at home without being at actual stage volume.

Once an amp is opened up, you have a ton more sustain and compression with that volume. It conversely forces you to play more cleanly, but honestly that's a good thing.

One of the reasons I hate a lot of MoDeRn MeTaL guitarists is that you can tell they learned and practiced all at low volumes.

Have you ever seen the "youtubers play a plexi on 10 at thomann" videos?

Watching youtubers struggle with a real amp at real volumes explains a ton about their shitty gear opinions.

Yeah. for me, right now when i play at volume, my guitar is getting feedback because it is so powerful in the room. So I gate, but gating takes tone, so i have to put it back with a boost. It is an annoying circle jerk.

But the cool thing is that I know the exact settings for plugging straight in and I have the amp setup for my home situation where I play at about 112 dbs. At Matt's, I actually get to put the amp to around noon to 3 on the master and it doesn't even come close to overpowering the room. And it doesn't get feedback on the guitar, so a gate is not necessary

 

[RedB4Black]

I honestly need to buy a bigger house so that I can have a jam room like @RedB4Black hmmmm.....Or he could switch houses with me....

Edit: Matt, you can leave your amps and cabs when we make the switch. But you take that goddamned motor oil you call beer.

I’d be happy to rent you space in my room. Just keep whatever that equine urine you call beer is out of my house.

 

[S̷͖͑m̵͎͂á̵̺s̸͚̈́h̴̬̑]

I’d be happy to rent you space in my room. Just keep whatever that equine urine you call beer is out of my house.

Do you have any neighbors you don't like? I think the simplest solution is I kill them and just acquire their house.

 

[DanTravis62]

Yeah. for me, right now when i play at volume, my guitar is getting feedback because it is so powerful in the room. So I gate, but gating takes tone, so i have to put it back with a boost. It is an annoying circle jerk.

But the cool thing is that I know the exact settings for plugging straight in and I have the amp setup for my home situation where I play at about 112 dbs. At Matt's, I actually get to put the amp to around noon to 3 on the master and it doesn't even come close to overpowering the room. And it doesn't get feedback on the guitar, so a gate is not necessary

That's probably a function of you being too close to your amp. The feedback, that is. Can't play at huge volumes right in front of the amp, that's not how the physics of this is supposed to work.

when you can play at big kid volumes its crazy how much easier it is to get gear to do what you want. It's really crazy because sometimes you take someones opinion seriously on a forum - they might only play at stepdad volume where this gear all performs completely differently.

I practice at stage volume with my bands multiple times a week, so I'm forced to practice corralling a loud tube amp. I've been doing that for 30 years, fortunately.

 

[S̷͖͑m̵͎͂á̵̺s̸͚̈́h̴̬̑]

That's probably a function of you being too close to your amp. The feedback, that is. Can't play at huge volumes right in front of the amp, that's not how the physics of this is supposed to work.

when you can play at big kid volumes its crazy how much easier it is to get gear to do what you want. It's really crazy because sometimes you take someones opinion seriously on a forum - they might only play at stepdad volume where this gear all performs completely differently.

I practice at stage volume with my bands multiple times a week, so I'm forced to practice corralling a loud tube amp. I've been doing that for 30 years, fortunately.

Yeah. well I play in front of my amp a lot now since I have the gate, but I used to play to the side of the cab to prevent this, but I had the cab faced to the outside of the room. It worked to allow the feedback to be in check, but it shook the dishes in the cabinets of the kitchen. So I faced the cab into the corner, and now because I have wood floors, it reverbs so bad that I have to be in a different room to play straight in at volume to keep my guitar from overreacting. With my gating situation, now it is kind of like playing at matt's where you just control the amp with silencing the strings.

I agree with you though. Some people cannot control an amp at volume, and it is a learned skill. but if you play in a phone booth at volume, it is a big choore in any case.