Stereo rigs? What to take into consideration?

[Shask]

I run one of my tube amps into a reactive loadbox, and then into a rack mixer with different rack effects in loops. That goes to a stereo solid state poweramp to 2 212 cabs.

The mixer gives you an easy place to control everything. Overall levels and levels to blend in each stereo effect into the overall sound.

 

[Jakem]

Any good compact size mixers?

My rig would be 1987x/101B/IIC++ -> Suhr Reactive load IR -> TCE 2290P, reverb etc -> stereo poweramp -> Mesa recto 1x12s

 

[Jakem]

Any good compact size mixers?

My rig would be 1987x/101B/IIC++ -> Suhr Reactive load IR -> TCE 2290P, reverb etc -> stereo poweramp -> Mesa recto 1x12s

... Or I'll just buy a Mesa 2x12 recto cab and run the rig as mono.

 

[alund]

... Or I'll just buy a Mesa 2x12 recto cab and run the rig as mono.

If the rig ain’t being moved then fuck mono. Do wet dry wet. It’s a wall of glorious sound if the core tone is good

 

[Code001]

Any good compact size mixers?

My rig would be 1987x/101B/IIC++ -> Suhr Reactive load IR -> TCE 2290P, reverb etc -> stereo poweramp -> Mesa recto 1x12s

MusicomLab Parallelizer II
RJM Micro Line Mixer

 

[rsm]

For my 5+ keyboard rig, I have a Behringer stereo line mixer (Eurorack Pro)

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/RX1602V2--behringer-rx1602-v2-rackmount-line-mixer


For up to 3 stereo inputs with one stereo output, Rolls makes one; they have others: https://rolls.com/products/mixers

 

[Shask]

MusicomLab Parallelizer II
RJM Micro Line Mixer

I use a Samson SM-10 but I have also looked at both of these for more of a pedalboard setup.

There are a lot of little tiny mixers, but not many also allow you to split/send the signal to the effects units. You have to have a way to send a signal in parallel, and then bring the effects back into a parallel mixer.

 

[vultures]

I've run both WDW and WW rigs a lot. I don't have a lot of this stuff now, but now I ran it in the past is..

WDW:

AMP -->	8 Ohm Out -->	Cab 1
\-->​	Send -->	Lexicon MPX1 In/Out Left -->	Mesa 20/20 Input A -->	8 Ohm Out -->	Cab 2 Left
Lexicon MPX1 In/Out Right-->	Mesa 20/20 Input B -->	8 Ohm Out -->	Cab 3 Right

Quad Cortex -->	Output 3 -->	Seymour Duncan Powerstage 170 -->	Cab 1
\-->​	Output 1 -->	Crown D-75A -->	Cab 2 Left
\-->​	Output 2 -->	Crown D-75A -->	Cab 3 Right

WW:

AMP -->	8 ohm Out -->	Suhr Reactive Load Input -->	SRL DI/Line Out -->	MPX1 Left -->	Mesa 20/20 Input A -->	8 Ohm Out -->	Cab 1 Left
\-->​	MPX1 Right-->	Mesa 20/20 Input B -->	8 Ohm Out-->	Cab 2 Right

Quad Cortex -->	Output 1 -->	Crown D75A Channel 1 -->	Cab 1 Left
\-->​	Output 2 -->	Crown D75A Channel 2 -->	Cab 2 Right

Quad Cortex -->	Output 1 -->	Positive Grid FRFR 1
\-->​	Output 2 -->	Positive Grid FRFR 2

If I'm ever going to bring a stereo rig out to a jam/gig, it will always be a small Quad Cortex board and two powered Positive Grid FRFRs. Can't justify bringing a head, 2-3 cabs, rack with power amp/reactive load/etc.. I only use a Crown power amp right now because it's solid state and doesn't alter the tone for Quad Cortex captures. I plan on getting a Matrix for my QC and a Fryette LXII for tube head stuff.

 

[Hiwatts-n-Gibsons]

Do You guys use tube or SS poweramps? Which one do You prefer and why?

I am playing around with a thought of setting up a stereo rig. The rig would be a tube head run into a Suhr reactive load IR and from there to stereo FX and then into a poweramp and two 1x12s. Would it work? Would the rig need a mixer?

Should work fine, and if your stereo fx have blend control(s) I'd use those instead vs using a mixer. Some fx like tremolo and phaser don't work out so well for me with the dry signal blended in, and I want 100% wet most of the time. Whereas with delay I tend to like a good bit of dry signal mixed in, like 50/50 or even more.

 

[GreatRedDragon]

I use a Samson SM-10 but I have also looked at both of these for more of a pedalboard setup.

There are a lot of little tiny mixers, but not many also allow you to split/send the signal to the effects units. You have to have a way to send a signal in parallel, and then bring the effects back into a parallel mixer.

I have a Parallelizer from my pedalboard days, and I might just put it on the pedal tray in my rack. Super handy little unit.

 

[Hiwatts-n-Gibsons]

Don't listen to @Floyd Eye

I just use two full stacks. By using two amps, you get the benefit of blending two tones, while having stereo effects.

* Amp 8 ohm speaker output -> Suhr RLIR input
* Suhr RLIR DI Line Out Unfiltered Output -> (optional) Mixer -> Stereo FX input (might need a Y cable if your FX unit doesn't have any mono in/stereo out capabilities). If using a mixer, set the FX to 100% wet and user your mixer to mix in the dry. If not using a mixer, set your dry signal in the FX unit itself
* Stereo FX output left/right -> Tube power amp left/right input
* Tube power amp left/right output -> speakers

Yes, use a quality tube power amp because that is now going to be part of your core tone. Yes, this will work. Using a mixer depends on the exact effects unit you plan on using. Units with analog dry thru don't generally need them, but a high quality mixer will always help preserve dry tone. At the same time, some effects just sound better in series - or don't work at all in parallel (EQs and compressors, for example)

Can't really give concrete advice without knowing specifics of your rig

Of the two I'd personally go with two heads. Either use one as the main amp, and one as a slave unit run off the fx loop using stereo fx to split them. Or just two clean pedal platform heads with stereo fx from my board sent to them both.

In fact that's what I did/do. I used to use a 2 channel head with another head slaved to it. Now I just run two vintage style pedal platforms and use boost, distortion, preamp, and fuzz boxes for gain. To split my signal I either use a Fulltone TTE > Fulltone SupaTrem 2, or Ftelectronica Anontmous Flange (Lovetone clone) > Pigtronix Echolution 2D > Fulltone SupaTrem 2 > amps.

The TTE or Echolution 2D I usually run around 30/70 to 50/50 wet/dry, the Flanger and Trem are 100% wet. It works and sounds great.

 

[Code001]

If you do the two head method, you'll want to have some way to invert phase, as well as being able to have an ISO transformer. RJM Y Not was amazing at this, but it's discontinued. I think Lehle might have an option.

 

[Shask]

I have a Parallelizer from my pedalboard days, and I might just put it on the pedal tray in my rack. Super handy little unit.

I looked at many of the other solutions like the little Rolls mixer, or the RJM Micro Mixer, but I keep coming back to the fact that you have to have a way to split the send to the units, and you need a way to control the on/off of the loops because you cant put most pedals in a mute bypass state. The Parallelizer is one of the only ones I have found that can do all that.

 

[TheGreatGreen]

In my experience, if you’re not distorting your power sections, then WDW and stereo are identical. I don’t mean “close enough” I mean “if you close your eyes you can’t hear a difference” as long as the outer cabs are in the same places. The outer cabs both outputting dry signal will basically produce a phantom middle cab.

I find the real key to a WDW, WD, or stereo rig is to dial your effects mixes right. You generally need WAY less effects than you might think. For example, I like a pretty padded out delay but I never feel the need to dial delay over like 12% mix.

That said, WDW rigs are awesome and I wouldn’t fault anybody for running them.

 

[Hiwatts-n-Gibsons]

If you do the two head method, you'll want to have some way to invert phase, as well as being able to have an ISO transformer. RJM Y Not was amazing at this, but it's discontinued. I think Lehle might have an option.

This isn't always necessary. Phase issues shouldn't pop up running through one main amp's preamp and using the fx loop to split the signal to the fx returns of two amps in stereo. I always thought it arose from amps with dissimilar preamp topology like 3 vs 4, 4 vs 5, or 5 vs 6 gainstages? I could be totally wrong on that, but I know for sure I never had any issues running a stereo rig like that.

Likewise, if you run two of the same amp, say two JMP's or two Dual Rectifiers in stereo, you shouldn't have a phase issue.

 

[GreatRedDragon]

I looked at many of the other solutions like the little Rolls mixer, or the RJM Micro Mixer, but I keep coming back to the fact that you have to have a way to split the send to the units, and you need a way to control the on/off of the loops because you cant put most pedals in a mute bypass state. The Parallelizer is one of the only ones I have found that can do all that.

I'm finding there are a lot of pedals out there that would be great rack units. The Parallelizer is one, but I also look at the Friedman IR series, Eventide's Dot9 pedals and Strymon's big pedals (how many pedalboards out there now have the "Strymon bridge," where once there would have been a rack?).

 

[Shask]

I'm finding there are a lot of pedals out there that would be great rack units. The Parallelizer is one, but I also look at the Friedman IR series, Eventide's Dot9 pedals and Strymon's big pedals (how many pedalboards out there now have the "Strymon bridge," where once there would have been a rack?).

Yeah, the SDE-3000D and 2290p pedals I have are basically rack units in a pedal.

 

[srommes]

If the rig ain’t being moved then fuck mono. Do wet dry wet. It’s a wall of glorious sound if the core tone is good

This. It sounds huge. No dry in the wet cabs either.

 

[Shask]

I'm finding there are a lot of pedals out there that would be great rack units. The Parallelizer is one, but I also look at the Friedman IR series, Eventide's Dot9 pedals and Strymon's big pedals (how many pedalboards out there now have the "Strymon bridge," where once there would have been a rack?).

I actually think I would be fine without the parallel mixer most of the time, but I do prefer Delay and Reverb in parallel. I have considered just getting something like the Source Audio Collider so I can have those in parallel without all the extra mixer stuff.

 

[Code001]

This isn't always necessary. Phase issues shouldn't pop up running through one main amp's preamp and using the fx loop to split the signal to the fx returns of two amps in stereo. I always thought it arose from amps with dissimilar preamp topology like 3 vs 4, 4 vs 5, or 5 vs 6 gainstages? I could be totally wrong on that, but I know for sure I never had any issues running a stereo rig like that.

Likewise, if you run two of the same amp, say two JMP's or two Dual Rectifiers in stereo, you shouldn't have a phase issue.

Depends on how the loop is designed and where it's placed. Also depends on speaker polarity. Even if the phase shift doesn't happen in the amp, it can happen in the cab, and the device I'm mentioning can fix that. Always good to have one if you're running a dual amp setup regardless. Most reliable devices do both phase shifting and provide ISO out, so there's no reason to not buy one if you're trying to run this sort of rig with two amps. Like anything else, it's a useful tool and will come in clutch if you're experiencing issues. And these issues are more likely to pop up with a dual amp setup than the loaded down amp with a dedicated stereo power amp I mentioned above (although not impossible with that scenario, either, but it's much more in line with basically having two of the same amp).