Under Lock and Key

[jerrydyer]

there was def Rockman stuff on it.

 

[paulyc]

@ibenhad : Technically you're right...there WAS some boutique stuff going on (Metaltronix) and some others...but look at what goes on today. How many versions of a Tube Screamer can you buy right now ? Back then it was Ibanez alone.

 

[Gainfreak]

Michael Wagener answered this question on Rig-talk a while ago.

You can take it for what it's worth or you can still continue to question the guy who recorded Georges sound.

Taken from Micheal Wageners Q&A on Rig-talk

About the Lynch guitar tone on Under Lock And Key. There are tons of rumors on how that tone was made, most of them started by people that want to sell amps to guitar players. What we did: we had two Marshalls and two Laneys (again not sure which models). One Marshall and one Laney had speakers in the big room at Amigo. The Laney took care of the low end and the Marshal took care of the higher sounds. I split them up so not one amp had the whole load of the full guitar spectrum, I still do that to the day. The other Laney was in a totally dead room and was fed by a Boss chorus pedal, and just slightly mixed in with the other two amps. The second Marshal (I think it was a 50W Plexi) was send to a cabinet in a small tiled bathroom. Everything was miced with 16 microphones all over the rooms. I then summed it all into one output on the console and send it to a Fostex 4-track cassette recorder and from there into the digital machine. George had mentioned that he always gets a great sound with his Fostex 4-track, so I told him to bring it in. We had it under the console covered with a packing blanket so nobody could see it and it was cranked to 11. That is most of the rhythm tone on ULK.

 

[jerrydyer]

why would the Fostex need to be hidden, in the studio? It all sounds goofy to me. Listen to the beginning of when the lightning strikes as he is plugging in. Those who have played a rockman know that sound (and nosie ) all too well. And on the songs with chorus it sounds the other way around to me .. the laneys with chorus sound thinner and the straight tone (marshall jtm 45) sounds fuller.

 

[paulyc]

I don't buy the Fostex thing at all. Never did never will. Sorry...not trying to offend anyone.

 

[paulyc]

Lynch has stated in published interviews (in GP) that a Rockman was used, and that he used 2 of them on tour...one for clean sounds and the other mixed with the amps for FOH. Why would he bother mixing it in if it wasn't on the album ?

 

[Gainfreak]

Lynch has stated in published interviews (in GP) that a Rockman was used, and that he used 2 of them on tour...one for clean sounds and the other mixed with the amps for FOH. Why would he bother mixing it in if it wasn't on the album ?

I don't know lol

My contention is that I will never believe it's all Rockman like other seem to believe. I have always said and it's also in this thread that I could believe that a Rockman was mixed in but I can also hear that there are other amps being used.

On another note, before we even Doubt or can Doubt Michael Wageners word, Has anyone tried using the Fostex like he said?

Maybe the Fostex cranked on 11 sounds like a Rockman

 

[jerrydyer]

diffrences are night and day you can tell its not all rockman.

 

[paulyc]

I never said it was all Rockman...no way. But the Fostex thing kills me...a $100,000.00 plus SSL console wired to a $500.00 Fostex 4 track cassette portastudio wired to a $100,00.00 plus digital tape machine ? Cut the sh*t...and in the MW thread posted above he leaves out the whole Urei 530 eq used on the output buss (that he stated over at the gearsluts forum) , that he says is his favorite eq for guitars...so much so that it shows up in Vito Bratta threads and Skid Row threads and Stryper threads also...but it's absent here ? I get MW talking about amp companies trying to sell people amps based on ULAK (Caswell), but Lynch only used those amps to tour ULAK and seems to have stopped using them before Wicked Sensation.

 

[Shiny_Surface]

I wonder what model Fostex it was, I remember the 4 track cassette based lower end ones from back then I think they also made reel to reel units as well.

 

[Gainfreak]

diffrences are night and day you can tell its not all rockman.

I agree!!

 

[Gainfreak]

I never said it was all Rockman...no way. But the Fostex thing kills me...a $100,000.00 plus SSL console wired to a $500.00 Fostex 4 track cassette portastudio wired to a $100,00.00 plus digital tape machine ? Cut the sh*t...and in the MW thread posted above he leaves out the whole Urei 530 eq used on the output buss (that he stated over at the gearsluts forum) , that he says is his favorite eq for guitars...so much so that it shows up in Vito Bratta threads and Skid Row threads and Stryper threads also...but it's absent here ? I get MW talking about amp companies trying to sell people amps based on ULAK (Caswell), but Lynch only used those amps to tour ULAK and seems to have stopped using them before Wicked Sensation.

Yeah, I'm not saying that you said it. I've been on other forums where they said it's 100% Rockman and I'm always left scratching my head, and I like the rockman lol

 

[paulyc]

I hate the Rockman alot (by itself) !!! Def Leppard comes to mind (Hysteria). Yuck. And in my opinion, the first Boston album tone is the best (which DIDN'T use a rockman 'cuz they weren't available yet)...that album is supposed to be Marshall and Ampeg tube amps into the prototype Powersoak.

 

[Mr. Willy]

I then summed it all into one output on the console and send it to a Fostex 4-track cassette recorder and from there into the digital machine.

I don't want to question the guy who produced the album, but there were digital mixers/machines used in recording in 1985? I would've thought it was all analog.

 

[OUTLAW1969]

There is a Rockman head for sale on TGP (I do not know seller), if anyone has 1k and wants to test out the theory.....

 

[Gainfreak]

I then summed it all into one output on the console and send it to a Fostex 4-track cassette recorder and from there into the digital machine.

I don't want to question the guy who produced the album, but there were digital mixers/machines used in recording in 1985? I would've thought it was all analog.

YUP. IIRC The scorpions were one of the first metal bands to use Digital for the love at first sting album and that was done in 1984. So yes, digital recording was available at that time.

 

[paulyc]

We're talking big money, state of the art digital...like a Mitsubishi or Sony 24 or 32 track digital reel to reel recorder...not ADAT digital...but you'll sum a mix of 16 channels of guitar god tone and send it through a portastudio cassette deck before the $100K digital tape machine ? Doubt it.

 

[Greazygeo]

We're talking big money, state of the art digital...like a Mitsubishi or Sony 24 or 32 track digital reel to reel recorder...not ADAT digital...but you'll sum a mix of 16 channels of guitar god tone and send it through a portastudio cassette deck before the $100K digital tape machine ? Doubt it.

actually that's how I used to run my Rockman back in the day....though it was a Tascam Porta One. They way it hits the preamps I guess. I forgot all about this thread.

 

[Progbusters]

I got this album as a teen back then:

I don't really like mid-late 80's stuff:

1. "Unchain the Night" MEH
2. "The Hunter" MEH
3. "In My Dreams" OK, I liked it
4. "Slippin' Away" MEH
5. "Lightnin' Strikes Again" WEAK
6. "It's Not Love" Great song
7. "Jaded Heart" UGH
8. "Don't Lie to Me" Dont even remember this one
9. "Will the Sun Rise" G**
10. "Til the Livin' End" WEAK

 

[paulyc]

Well, as with anything Donkey related, it can be improved a bunch by getting rid of Donna Donkey...