Liberal Gloating

[YabbaDabbaDoo]

You made three in that post.

Congrats you butt sniffing Prof.

 

[Ben Waylin]

 

[WEF Chairman]

Another inerudite goof who thinks Wiki lookups give him credibility. LOL! First of all, I'll silence your ignorance with one simple fact: many bible manuscripts are copies of much older original manuscripts, just like every copy of books written today. Go ahead Mr. Big-Brain Wannabe and show us all with your Wikipedia degree where you can find an original manuscript for any book written today or even 100 years ago. The fact that we actually have original biblical manuscripts from thousands of years ago is unprecedented.

Not only that, you never even read the bible or did any research on bible history, so what pathetic knowledge you think you have about bible manuscripts is laughable. Ha ha ha ha ha ha! I marvel at your haughty ignorance. LOL! Babblers like you are a dime a dozen.

You should have read the bible because it accounts over 20 ancient books that were lost in the early biblical era. Those works would have been at least 5,000 to 6,000 years old. In fact, the Book of Job was written in 2200 BC which is over 4,000 years ago. That's not to the only canononical book dated thousands of years before Christ.

Because you're rambling little lecture is so cursory, you didn't even think to consider other written and etched biblical artifacts in history. There are stone tablets, stone fragments, and even a bowl dated as far back as 3,300 BC which is 5,300 years old. You really don't know what you're talking about at all.

Because you're so uneducated, you don't even know that the most ancient Hebrew history is written on the artifacts of disparate cultures, spanning from Assyria, Egypt, Persia, Turkey, etc. Obviously, Hebrews were scattered among Middle-Eastern nations thousands of years ago so it's common-sense (that you don't have) to consider Hebrew history expands well beyond biblical manuscripts and Israeli archeology.

We haven't even gone in-depth here. We can scientifically infer from ancient non-biblical texts and archeological artifacts that there were indeed ancient texts that parts of the Torah were copied from. Just because the original texts haven't been discovered doesn't mean they didn't exist. Any monkey with a brain can figure out that if 2,000 to 3,000 year old texts cite and reference older texts then there were indeed much older original works.

Man, stop making a fool of yourself. People like you have no depth of knowledge. How stupid to think you were going to just come along with your Google lookups and put me to shame when I've been researching these things for decades. LOL! You thought you were going to prove me wrong and make a fool of me but all you did was put your ignorance and incompetence on display. Ah ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! I mean what on earth were you thinking to try such a thing? What in the world gave you the idea that an uneducated babbler like you could do some perfunctory, desultory internet searches and rival someone who is actually educated and knowledgeable?

That stupidity might convince a mindless liberal mob but you make a complete fool of yourself trying to take on people with real knowledge. It's obvious in your stupid comments that you don't even know how to do rudimentary, high-school level research because the way you went about your failed attempt at lecture is pitifully one-dimensional, shallow, and totally lacks the perspective of anyone who has done collegiate research. There are so many things you're not even smart enough to consider that makes your argument impotent and futile. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!



No need for "your turn" because I just put your dumb argument to death. Epic fail. You lose miserably as expected.

 

[jdel77]

This'll be good

Another inerudite goof who thinks Wiki lookups give him credibility.

Show me where I've referenced Wikipedia.

LOL! First of all, I'll silence your ignorance with one simple fact:

You're not silencing anything, apart from the remaining members reading this who think you have an ounce of academic credibility left.
You're an idiot.

many bible manuscripts are copies of much older original manuscripts, just like every copy of books written today.

Incredible insight. Of course they are, you numpty. So what? What has that got to do with the current debate?

Go ahead Mr. Big-Brain Wannabe and show us all with your Wikipedia degree where you can find an original manuscript for any book written today or even 100 years ago. The fact that we actually have original biblical manuscripts from thousands of years ago is

Are you referencing the Hinnom Scrolls? They date to C7th BCE, so are 2600 years old at best.

Reference > https://armstronginstitute.org/45-ketef-hinnom-scrolls

unprecedented.

Horseshit.
The oldest surviving text we have found religious or otherwise so far is the Kesh Temple Hymn, which are Sumerian clay tablets dating to 2600 BCE. This is end of the 2nd Bronze Age.

Reference > https://etcsl.orinst.ox.ac.uk/section4/tr4802.htm

This predates the earliest written records referencing the Torah, which is the Leningrad Codex which begins with Chronicles and is dated to around 1600 years later in 1000 BCE before it was translated from Hebrew to Aramaic in around 600 BCE.

Reference > https://web.archive.org/web/20170326044718/http://home.earthlink.net/~ddstuhlman/crc10.htm

So not only are you full of shit when it comes to knowing the dates of the Pentateuch, you don't even know what you're on about regarding surviving texts of any religion.

Not only that, you never even read the bible or did any research on bible history, so what pathetic knowledge you think you have about bible manuscripts is laughable. Ha ha ha ha ha ha!

Again with the rambling.
I have read the Bible. I own numerous copies of different translations. So what?

I marvel at your haughty ignorance. LOL! Babblers like you are a dime a dozen.

So you marvel at things which are commonplace? Small things amuse small minds, so they say...

You should have read the bible because it accounts over 20 ancient books that were lost in the early biblical era. Those works would have been at least 5,000 to 6,000 years old. In fact, the Book of Job was written in 2200 BC which is over 4,000 years ago. That's not to the only canononical book dated thousands of years before Christ.

The idiot is doubling down!
So now we not only have Bronze Age biblical manuscripts, but Neolithic/New Stone Age? 6,000 year old paper manuscripts, what the actual fuck?
How can we have paper manuscripts written before paper was invented???
What planet are you from? Are you high?

The earliest paper manuscript we have is the Hindu Rigveda from 1500 BCE, so that's 3500 years old.

Reference > https://www.bl.uk/collection-items/rig-veda

As I've asked SIX TIMES NOW, identify and reference these now Neolithic/early Stone Age Biblical manuscripts.

Because you're rambling little lecture is so cursory, you didn't even think to consider other written and etched biblical artifacts in history. There are stone tablets, stone fragments, and even a bowl dated as far back as 3,300 BC which is 5,300 years old. You really don't know what you're talking about at all.

Is this what you're on about?

https://www.nbcnews.com/sciencemain...brew-inscription-dug-biblical-city-6c10970722
They date to 700 BCE. That's 2700 years old. 700 BCE + 5300 = 4600.
We live in the year 2023, not 4600 CE.
You're actually demented, sad really. It's like trying to have a discussion with a meth addict. Are you a meth addict?

Because you're so uneducated, you don't even know that the most ancient Hebrew history is written on the artifacts of disparate cultures, spanning from Assyria, Egypt, Persia, Turkey, etc. Obviously, Hebrews were scattered among Middle-Eastern nations thousands of years ago so it's common-sense (that you don't have) to consider Hebrew history expands well beyond biblical manuscripts and Israeli archeology.

Didn't I say all this in my previous post?
Consider whatever you like. I'd like to consider being Batman. Doesn't make it true.
You could consider that your anus has magically transported itself to just underneath your nose, which is why you talk so much unadulterated shit. I mean, we don't have proof of that, but it's "common-sense" to consider it.

We haven't even gone in-depth here. We can scientifically infer from ancient non-biblical texts and archeological artifacts that there were indeed ancient texts that parts of the Torah were copied from. Just because the original texts haven't been discovered doesn't mean they didn't exist. Any monkey with a brain can figure out that if 2,000 to 3,000 year old texts cite and reference older texts then there were indeed much older original works.

Sure, but Humanities, Sociology and archaeology needs to be evidenced based to support these hypothesis.
But you do you man, keep waving these unsupported theories around, which are pretty much lame Strawman Arguments. Stick to the facts.

Man, stop making a fool of yourself. People like you have no depth of knowledge. How stupid to think you were going to just come along with your Google lookups and put me to shame when I've been researching these things for decades. LOL! You thought you were going to prove me wrong and make a fool of me but all you did was put your ignorance and incompetence on display. Ah ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! I mean what on earth were you thinking to try such a thing? What in the world gave you the idea that an uneducated babbler like you could do some perfunctory, desultory internet searches and rival someone who is actually educated and knowledgeable?

That stupidity might convince a mindless liberal mob but you make a complete fool of yourself trying to take on people with real knowledge. It's obvious in your stupid comments that you don't even know how to do rudimentary, high-school level research because the way you went about your failed attempt at lecture is pitifully one-dimensional, shallow, and totally lacks the perspective of anyone who has done collegiate research. There are so many things you're not even smart enough to consider that makes your argument impotent and futile. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!



No need for "your turn" because I just put your dumb argument to death. Epic fail. You lose miserably as expected.

And here we come to the crux of the issue, what this is really all about. You ready?

Have you noticed that EVERY SINGLE ONE OF YOUR POSTS comes back to the same boring, meaningless subject - YOU.
Every single discussion I've had with you, or you've had with anyone here evolves around your concept of yourself, and your ego.
You have apparently studied and reached qualifications in a number of academic fields (who cares anyway), but it's a crutch to support your pathetic low self opinion.
You lack confidence, and you have crushing low self esteem. I've met so many guys like you mate, who insist the world revolves around them. You have to be the centre of conversation, despite the fact it bores everyone around you to tears.
You talk AT people, not TO them.
You're angry, bitter, feel you're misrepresented and not appreciated and you cannot communicate worth a runny shit.

I've never made this about me. I've never posted my qualifications, experience, professional travel or publications. Who cares? This is a guitar forum .

My advice to you would be to take some time off, go do some self reflection and work out who you really are, and most importantly, why you really are.

Oh and have a listen to this - they wrote it for you!

 

[Strandberg Junkie]

 

[dcburn]

Now we're talking.
Here we go.



Wrong.
The oldest Biblical manuscript we currently have is the Nash Papyrus. It dates to the 2nd Century BCE. This means that Biblical manuscripts range to a maximum of 2, 250 years ago, which isn't even half of what you contend.
Your claim of 5, 000 years ago would place earliest manuscripts in the the Year 3000 BCE. The earliest text from this period is the Kish Tablet, Mesopotamian Cuneiform on limestone.

Reference > https://cudl.lib.cam.ac.uk/view/MS-OR-00233/1



Wrong.
The Dead Sea Scrolls comprise a collection of works spanning 400 years from the 3rd Century BCE to the 1st Century CE.

Reference > https://www.imj.org.il/en/wings/shrine-book/dead-sea-scrolls



Wrong.
Philosophy is not fact.



Wrong.
I never claimed research into the Bible as being non credible or unscientific. Such a proposition makes no sense.
Strawman argument and Ad Hominem attack and therefore irrelevant.



You're allowed a wank break I guess.



So is this a no?
Stop talking shit, name your subject and question and let's go.



My qualifications and experience are irrelevant here and I don't need to trumpet them to walk around with a hard on.
Your sidestepping speaks for itself - answer my question > Name and reference the Bronze Age Bibilical manuscripts you mentioned.



More Strawman Arguments. Please try to stay on track.



I'm doing that now, fool.



Sure - the polytheistic Shasu and Canaanite religions which date back to around 3000 BCE, or a little bit earlier at the most.
This was absorbed into early Hebrew Yahwism, which presents multiple divinities known as Elohim in Genesis 6:2, of which YHWH was just one, who first presented himself to Moses who lived around 1300 BCE.
There's also references to other Arabian clans worshiping Yahweh from around the same time, or a hundred years earlier from Egypt at the time.

Reference > https://www.jstor.org/stable/j.ctt7rqr7 (Siversten)



Wrong.
See above. It's well established that Judaism combined Babylonian and Sumerian traditions with the Canaanite worship of YHWH, as far back as 2000BCE culminating in the first records of the Torah by 300 BCE.
There's even suggestions that YHWH was divinity linked to metallurgy, which would make sense given the technological transition from Bronze to Iron Age.

Reference > https://www.haaretz.com/archaeology...w-theory/0000017f-dc86-d3ff-a7ff-fda6aa390000




This just resembles drunken ranting. The kind of stuff you hear crazy people yelling out in train stations. Not worth responding to.

Your turn.

You shouldn't have to do this kind of homework on a guitar forum.
But nice job.

 

[jdel77]

You shouldn't have to do this kind of homework on a guitar forum.
But nice job.

It’s all good man. I’m obsessed with both guitar gear and the Humanities.
I’m just as up for a solid history/geography/politics/religion chat as I am about guitars/amps/fx/modellers etc…

 

[Ben Waylin]

I have read the Bible. I own numerous copies of different translations. So what?

And you still reject Christ.

I guess that's "so what".

 

[Bagel and Creamcheese]

And you still reject Christ.

I guess that's "so what".

I really can't figure out if you play at being a X-tian here just because you think it bugs the 'libs' while not really believing or if you really think you are a X-tian.

Why? Because if you really think you are a X-tian you're the worst X-tian I've ever met. No exaggeration, no trying to irritate you, just straight up truth. You're as bad as those leeches on TV or the guys who lead the Kool-Aid cults.

 

[Strandberg Junkie]

And you still reject Christ.

What do you mean reject?

Reject that some dude turned water into wine?
Parted a sea so people could walk through it?
That the big guy turned a woman into salt just by looking at her?
That a dude was brutally murdered but rose from the dead without a scar?
That the entire planet was once covered in salt water?
That the entire world wide animal kingdom originated from a single boat?

Talk like that should get you put away in an asylum.

 

[YabbaDabbaDoo]

What do you mean reject?

Reject that some dude turned water into wine?
Parted a sea so people could walk through it?
That the big guy turned a woman into salt just by looking at her?
That a dude was brutally murdered but rose from the dead without a scar?
That the entire planet was once covered in salt water?
That the entire world wide animal kingdom originated from a single boat?

Talk like that should get you put away in an asylum.

So..........the BIG question is.............everything has a beginning..........so, who started it all?

Biden?

Things don't just appear and even if they did..........something had to pull the lever.

 

[Bagel and Creamcheese]

So..........the BIG question is.............everything has a beginning..........so, who started it all?

Biden?

Things don't just appear and even if they did..........something had to pull the lever.

Who pulled God's lever to make him appear? And who pulled that guy's lever?

 

[Ben Waylin]

This is what passes for a full life, well lived in a buttfuck backward Texas town. I wonder if that's what they inscribe on your headstone. It's likely your major life achievement.

I never realized you were such a useless worm. Part of that apology is actually real. I feel a tiny bit sorry for you.

When cancer has you dying screaming in a shit filled bed - think of me laughing at you.

This you ?

 

[Bagel and Creamcheese]

This you ?

It certainly was. I don't claim to be a X-tian. I do however have a deep loathing for you. As do many.

 

[YabbaDabbaDoo]

Who pulled God's lever to make him appear? And who pulled that guy's lever?

The concept of God is lost on you and your statement proves that beyond a doubt.

The comprehension you possess cannot fathom beyond your limited experience and therein lies the problem.......how can you doubt what you can't comprehend.....................ignorance it is, all the way. Same as the rest of these soulless cretins who pile on about no creator.

I'm being serious here............the ignorance and aggression of the naysayers here is to be marvelled at.

 

[Bagel and Creamcheese]

The concept of God is lost on you and your statement proves that beyond a doubt.

The comprehension you possess cannot fathom beyond your limited experience and therein lies the problem.......how can you doubt what you can't comprehend.....................ignorance it is, all the way. Same as the rest of these soulless cretins who pile on about no creator.

I'm being serious here............the ignorance and aggression of the naysayers here is to be marvelled at.

You answered my questions with an empty platitude. Why? Because you can't answer it directly. So you revert to some religious bullshit.

That's fine, believe what you will. It doesn't affect me. Until your type try to force your beliefs on others. Then, shtf.

 

[Ben Waylin]

It certainly was. I don't claim to be a X-tian. I do however have a deep loathing for you. As do many.

The problem with being a Satanic piece of shit is.. you don't get to turn around claim the moral high ground.

 

[Bagel and Creamcheese]

The problem with being a Satanic piece of shit is.. you don't get to turn around claim the moral high ground.

Well, I'm not a liar or two faced. So, I'm morally higher than you'll ever aspire to.

 

[Ben Waylin]

Well, I'm not a liar or two faced. So, I'm morally higher than you'll ever aspire to.

Yeah, let me know how that works out for you.

 

[jdel77]

And you still reject Christ.

I guess that's "so what".

I believe the early Old Testament is legit.
I believe YHWH was one of numerous Elohim, who organised Ancient Hebrew society and was worshipped by people in Ancient Israel around 3000 years ago.

I also believe that the Greeks absorbed this religion into their own polytheism and reinterpreted Dionysius as Jesus Christ.

What have they got in common?

* The immortal father/human mother
* Virgin birth
* wandering around, getting deep in the desert and shit, probably getting bent on psychedelics
* murdered, went to Hell and then rose from the dead
* symbolism with wine - communion, “I am the vine” etc..

The Romans saw this reinterpreted religion as a great wave to ride so it was eventually nationalised by Constantine and the state church was institutionalised in C4th CE.

Dionysian symbols are all through Christian tradition. So yeah, I reject Christ, but only as much as I reject Dionysius. He was the ultimate party dude.